Our children have the right to an education.

[NameChange738676756]

So many posts about whether schools will be safe when they reopen but I’m not seeing this point made. Lots of discussion around the childcare that schools provide and the importance on children socially.

My 11 year old has lost all interest and I can’t get him to do anything significant. We’ve had one zoom social with his teacher and classmates. So pretty much zero learning going on.

We know children are less susceptible and there is some discussion around whether they’re transmitting less. The children of key workers (i.e. the ones more likely to catch and spread it) have been at school the whole time and as far as I know there haven’t been massive outbreaks in schools.

So I think I just want to loudly shout: our children have the right to an education.

@Lostmyshityear9

So if your school knows it won’t have enough space then it should be either making plans to have half year groups at once or expand the space. Sports centres aren’t being used at present so may be space there or village halls (my daughters school are going to use the village hall).

Corridors not wide enough for two people to pass - design a one way system and change the flow through the building- at work we are using big display screens to separate corridors and using fire exits to change the way people come and go, a group of us sat down and drew a map of the building and trial ran it several times (and then had to tweek it due to

Agree totally that school funds should cover soap. Fully behind you on this. Fancier detergents not needed as soap kills it but soap should be provided. Very happy to write to mps and sign petitions for schools to have soap.

It's getting ridiculous now. The teacher haters are frothing at the mouth. Watch out or you'll get apoplexy. Go for a walk.

The law in this country is that parents are responsible for providing their children with an education. The vast majority do that by sending their children to school. Others educate at home.

Teaching unions have advised against online classes such as zoom for safeguarding reasons. I don’t have an issue with this.

I have one child in Year 6 and one in Year 7. Both have been advised to follow their existing timetable and work is being sent home/uploaded to the website every week. We have been following that, with regular breaks and lunch hour. We stick to routine as that is what keeps us sane. If the school hadn’t sent enough work, I would find some for them to do. There are plenty of free resources out there on the internet. You can tour museums and places of interest virtually. You can use google maps on satellite view and visit anywhere in the world! You can watch free musicals and plays. You can download as many worksheets as you like from places like Twinkl. You can order CGP books Or art supplies off Amazon cheaply. You can teach them key life skills like cooking, meal planning, how to wash laundry, how to clean a house, how to mow a lawn, etc. I have loved having my kids at home though of course it hasn’t always been easy and I’m also trying to work around them. The only thing I wish the schools were doing more of is providing feedback on the work they’ve done/submitted.

They are both missing the social side though, and this especially concerns me around my Year 6 child. I’m glad he’s not doing SATs but he is miserable. He’s going to a different school to everyone else and is convinced he won’t see any of his friends again, that he never got to say a proper goodbye. He didn’t even get to go on his fun residential. He’s become almost depressed at home. He’s not eating much, he doesn’t know what to do with himself. For him, I will be happy to send him back when the school reopens as the risks will outweigh the benefits for him in my opinion.

School attendance won’t be compulsory this term and parents won’t be fined - so if you don’t want to risk it, don’t send your child in. Things may look different in September.

Of course children have the right to an education, but can you not understand why they can't be in school right now, Every one with children, are in the same situation. Children will recover eventually,no matter what.

We haven't been planning for the return for 7 weeks because we didnt know what it would look like for the last 7 weeks. We had to wait until we were given guidance from the government - before Monday be didnt know what to plan for. The parameters put in by the government are the very thing that is making the return so tricky. They changed again yesterday and again today. It isnt an easy feat to work out how you might get a maximum of 15 pupils in each classroom, sort out the curriculum, stagger breaks/lunches, rotate staff, sort teaching groups, safely transport pupils, make sure work is accessible to pupils who dont come in, protect vulnerable staff or those who are shielded etc. It is honestly a logistical nightmare. We are working as best we can on it, but it is tricky. We dont have answers today, because we've had three days in which we have had guidance a d the goal posts have shifted twice already.

Pupils have a right to an education- what do you think the online work is? We are doing our best in difficult circumstances. Teachers hate the fact that your kids are missing out.

Most of my colleagues want to go back to school. We want to teach properly, but this half way house system is causing more disruption and problems than it is solving. We have 900 pupils in our school, social distancing will be impossible. Now the Ed Sec has just mooted having volunteers and graduates teach during the summer holidays. This is a ridiculous idea that will not benefit the pupils or the curriculum. Our curriculum is carefully planned - a volunteer or graduate with no teaching experience couldn't just pick that up and catch kids up.

I am so tired of being bashed. I'm working so hard every day to try and lessen the impact on pupils. No one gives a crap. The only thing people care about is what they think teachers are not doing. The government hasn't got a fucking clue either.

Teachers who don't feel they can safety return to work (for example, due to underlying health conditions) should be supported onto long-term sick pay, like all others who can't work due to medical reasons.

Exactly. As a former teacher myself I never thought I’d ‘break ranks’ to say this, but given that so many posters have been insisting that children (and parents) must now face a ‘new normal’ of social distancing, restrictions on play, reduced hours, no extra-curriculars etc, surely they must also accept that in this future landscape some of them simply won’t be able to do the job any more. It can’t be children doing all the compromising here.

You’re right OP our children have a right to an education. Conversely, the children of the teachers teaching our children, have a right to not have parent not dying from a disease we do not fully understand.

I totally understand the frustration but the risks to the teacher’s and support staff is far higher than to your child.

We haven't been planning for the return for 7 weeks because we didnt know what it would look like for the last 7 weeks.

You knew that there'd be an incremental re-opening rather than a "big bang" full re-open. That was common sense.

You knew that social distancing will be in place for many months. That was common sense.

You knew some staff wouldn't be able to work closely with others/children at first due to shielding/being vulnerable. That was common sense.

You knew some pupils wouldn't be returning to the classroom at first due to shielding/vulnerable parents/guardians at home. That was common sense.

You knew that large gatherings, such as whole school assemblies/plays/sports days wouldn't happen this year due to social distancing. That was common sense.

You knew that at some stage, a proper evaluation of the building, i.e. classroom size, toilet layout, kitchens, staff rooms, communal areas, corridors, etc., would need to be done in respect of working out how social distancing could be maintained. That was common sense.

Surely all that kind of thing should have been done right at the start, so schools knew what they needed to do when the time came to start thinking about reopening?

This kind of common sense has been done by small private owner managed firms such as shops, small workshops, etc., by people who often don't have degrees and an academic background - they've read the Gov.uk guidelines and applied common sense, and either stayed open throughout or are slowly starting to re-open.

My school made plans.
It did not include reception and nursery as a starting point. We based everything around years 5 and 6.

For me it’s all the conflicting information.

Don’t see your family. If you get caught talking to people you know while you are out, and there’s more than one from each household you could be fined. So don’t take your child. Apart from anything else, as the expert on Radio 5 said this morning, they don’t understand social distancing.
But do take them into school because that is different.

If you are a Ta with a 5 year old grandchild, you may not hug them. But you may go into school and hug everyone else’s five year olds.

Do not take children into shops. They touch things and people do not want to pick things up if your child has had their hands all over it because kids spread germs. Except in school where it’s fine. Because kids don’t spread this germ.

Schools need to open but the general current advice about maintaining social distancing is not compatible with sending the youngest children back first. So which is it? If they are in school and playing with 14 other children, why not take them to a field altogether on the weekend and let them play? But you could be fined for that....

Also, your five year old, two terms ago, would have learnt mostly through play and ten minute periods of more traditional learning. Not sit in your desk learning. But now we have to take loads of the toys away. So let’s get back to school, get back to normal, but with a teacher that is possibly not their own teacher, without loads of the toys they would have used.
So after several months of being at home (and let’s face it, we get a lot of tears on the first day back after the summer holiday while the kids get their heads round being back), they now have to come back to people who may be different, to an environment that cannot operate as it did before. If a child clings to their mum crying, who is going to peel them off and carry them in? I can’t go within 2m of them.

Yo don’t have this problem with Year 5 and 6.
So we did plan. We just did not plan for this age group yet. It’s not in the interests of their mental health because returning to school can be upsetting under normal circumstances, and if it’s interaction that’s needed, surely to say that you will be allowed to associate with one or two other families, say at the park, would be better. There will be too much that is weird and different.
And it’s not in the interests in their education because we will be spending most of our time just trying to help them feel safe. And they can’t learn the way they should learn, through play, because we won’t be able to give them toys.

I’d be happy for kids to come back but it needed to be realistic and it just isn’t, with this age group. Why the hell didn’t they start with Year 5 and 6, kids how have some concept of social distance, see how it went, and then expand downwards??

I got about halfway down this thread, then had to give up. The vitriol towards teachers is astounding and sickening.

Posters actually advocating that teachers should not be paid if parents are expected to teach at home.

We are in the middle of a catastrophe, and some of you are going full Lord of the Flies.

Honestly, you should be ashamed of yourselves.

This quote upthread is the most sensible thing on here:

'We are in the middle of a global viral pandemic of a completely novel virus. How about being patient, and let's see what we can learn before using our kids as test subjects?'

Because the education system is fragmented people cant say what "schools' have been doing. Where i work the focus when schools closed was on setting up and making the crititcial worker thing work (we host a hub), sorting out the mess with fsm, and getting systems up and running for home learning. It took a lot of time and effort. Once that was stable we then moved on to imagining what would be needed whenever and however schools opened. But the planning ended there because for example we imagined they might recommend taking temps on arrival like other countries. We thought that might take a long time so we prepared to order a lot of infra red thermometers. Thankfully the dfe guidence came out before we ordered them saying 'dont take tempretures on arrival'
Can you not see how much time and money gets wasted if you prepare too much for the unknown. Now the guidence is out we can go through it point by point with our context and do out best.

OP you are wrong not all key workers children have been at school all along .I am a key worker ( community carer ) mine at home with their dad when i work where i feel they are safest .
Ours is a small village primary i have absolutely no idea how they will do the safe distancing there is not the room in the classrooms .My DC's one yr 6 primary and the eldest secondary are do fine with their work at home infact the youngest is doing fantastic handing in some brilliant work.
Until it can be done safely mine will not be back def not 1st June unless we see a rapid decline i figures .

Kazzyhoward, exactly.

I work for a large multi-site organisation. We were planning for lockdown before it happened, and we started planning for it being lifted as soon as lockdown happened. I imagine most in the private sector have done the same.

miles The only people that should feel shame should be the teachers being paid to post on here when they should be teaching!!

No you are not special, not you will not have zero risk (along with the rest of the country) no you are really not on the front line of CoVid, speak to a medic and they will show you what the real front line looks like. The rest quite frankly is mass hysteria by the teaching profession being whipped up by the unions to justify this years membership fee.

Do yourself a favour RTWT and then comment.

Hard working parents are sick and tired of doing two full time jobs, many at far more risk than teachers, whilst the teachers on this thread argue to keep their six months paid holiday in tact.

It has been revolting to read.

Jazzy - yes, we knew it would be incremental. But with no clue about the number, we’d worked out how to do it in our school. Largely Years 5 and 6. We’d looked at space, resources, staff, and all the other things you mentioned. Just like a private firm would.
We’d also considered maybe having the kids back in family groups, taking into account the type of community we live in.

We had plans which don’t count for anything now the government have chosen these particular year groups to go back. It’s also upset the staffing arrangements, because neither our reception nor nursery teacher can come back (both shielding). We had all this managed.
We just weren’t expecting the youngest back first. There was no notice for this par of the plan, and I’m sure you can see that 11 year olds require very different arrangements than 4 or 5 year olds.

i imagine most in the private sector have done the same.

Of course they have.

We’ve been doing complex scenario planning. In this eventuality, this. If this happens, this.

If we didn’t have a plan ready to go, we’d be on the back foot, competitors would race ahead.

It’s basic.

So if your school knows it won’t have enough space then it should be either making plans to have half year groups at once or expand the space. Sports centres aren’t being used at present so may be space there or village halls (my daughters school are going to use the village hall).Corridors not wide enough for two people to pass - design a one way system and change the flow through the building

Parents have an expectation that ALL children will be in school within a month. So we can't half classes if we are going to meet expectation. And nor can we just magic staff out of thin air to staff double classes. Loads of staff off due to sheilding, some will be ill at any given time and others have resigned. Sure, I am sure a one way system will be developed. But it will mean about 10 minutes between classes for some people to get round the building (long, narrow building so if you're in the wrong place, it might take you 10 minutes to get round it to your next class). It's not going to be an education. It's going to be a lot of stomping around and going no where near people. God knows how we'll manage lunch in secondary, even with half the kids in. And before anyone says 'at their desk', that's double the classrooms, double the teachers (we don't actually have) and absolutely no time off for teachers at all (we'll have to eat with pupils but I'm not fancying my chances at getting 5 minutes to walk round the 10 minute one way system to the nearest toilet!).

I am not being defeatest. These are the things that will sort themselves out. What is worrying is the science behind transmission and what that means in classrooms when someone is infected. That's what I care about, personally, because I don't fancy my chances if I get it.

Biscuit. I’m a TA and part time. Is it ok if I post?
I am going into school still, photocopying resources for kids who don’t have computer access, driving round the area delivering them, helping deliver online sessions, while also homeschooling my own 2 kids.
The teachers at our school are very much still working. My sister, a teacher, is going into her school which is still open, and went in over the holidays (for which she doesn’t get paid). And setting home learning, marking, and all the time while managing the home schooling of her own three kids.
This is not about teachers being special. It’s about saying that sending these year groups back, with this advice (remove the bloody toys, for a group of confused 5 year olds, really??!) is wrong.

The only people that should feel shame should be the teachers being paid to post on here when they should be teaching!!

Because none of us work part-time, none of us are allowed a lunch break and none of us at all have the odd free lesson? Or we aren't allowed any kind of down time whatsoever?

We were planning for lockdown before it happened, and we started planning for it being lifted as soon as lockdown happened. I imagine most in the private sector have done the same.

The idea that any organisation can operate safely and adequately with a bit of planning is wrong.

Hard working parents are sick and tired of doing two full time jobs, many at far more risk than teachers, whilst the teachers on this thread argue to keep their six months paid holiday in tact.It has been revolting to read

Revolting to read. Wow. Not one teacher has said they want a 6 month holiday. Most of us are working our normal hours with lessons online but you seem to have missed that (and I work part time and am not in on Wednesdays, in case you want to pick at that). I have worked all my hours as a single parent with 3 children in the house so please don't give me 'hard working parents ' shite. Teachers are also hard working parents. All of us have expressed concern about how it will work without significantly increasing R or without spending money that schools simply don't have. The only counter-argument I have seen is teachers are lazy and don't want to work.

@Jojobar

I think it's pretty clear from any interaction you have with parents of school age children that many are not. Even teachers on this thread have said they're working a lot less than full time because parents aren't asking for more worksheets. Yet no apparent thought as to how they could use that extra (paid) time.

Like it or not, teachers act as role models, and this can't do attitude is not helpful. No one is being asked to face certain death. Maybe teachrs should use their current spare time to actually educate themselves about the reasons for lockdown and the risks of returning to school. All this hysteria about how children and teachers will die is complete hyperbole. Healthy people have no more to fear than from crossing the road.

DO NOT USE MY WORDS AGAINST ME AND OTHER TEACHERS. You haven't a clue how I am using my extra paid time. Here is a list
a) Reading books to enhance my pedagogy
b) Learning French so I can teach it better
c) Completing online courses
d) Writing schemes of work for next year
e) Trying to engage with parents and children on home learning, and continuing this engagement where they find this helpful
f) Working one day each week in school
g) Working with the senior leadership to try to work out how to reintroduce the children safely
h) As I am also a human being, I am also helping my friends and family and trying to help my own children learn at home
However, only (e) is work that the parents can "see"

Your words are infuriating, and I shouldn't engage, but I'm not letting you turn my honesty against me.

Biscuit I'm not a teacher.

I'm just not an arsehole.

Quick wee break. Thread reported as off we go again.

I think if government want school to open safely they need to provide additional funds for temporary washrooms and portacabin type classrooms and additional cleaning staff, in order for schools to be able to carry out the guidance government have given them to operate safely.