To wonder why the Brits are so obsessed with WW2?

[MrsSchadenfreude]

My Mum is 87. She was 12 when the war ended and went through it in London. She remembers being terrified and hungry and getting grief because her grandmother was German. Other elderly relatives don’t have lovely memories either, apart from relief when it was all over. So why do we glorify it all, at every opportunity? Why do we always look back instead of forward?

And Northern Ireland.

Always forgotten on MN. The “lest we forget” that’s always trotted out on these occasions always makes me laugh for this reason. It’s hollow as hell.

I agree with others that it is the family history of many British people.

My grandparents and their siblings were a huge part of my life growing up. Some of them only died very recently. Their sacrifice shaped who they were and had an enormous impact on the rest of their family.

I agree with you OP. I find it very weird and a bit disturbing tbh. Especially as it just seems to get worse, the longer ago the war was. Nobody did this when I was a child (1970s) because the war was still a very real (and in many cases horrific) memory for anyone aged 40+. Now that nobody under 80 can remember it, it's just turned into a nostalgia industry with a side of nationalism.

I'm sure there are many people who go along with it in a sincere spirit of genuine remembrance, but IMO we can have that without all the Churchill/Vera Lynn stuff, and as for invoking the war whenever there's any kind of crisis, from Brexit to Coronavirus, it's embarrassing at best. I'm all for 'lest we forget' and teaching kids about what happened, but it's still history, and I think all this living in the past isn't healthy for our country on many levels.

The fact that there is archive footage available from the era, coupled with decades of films and TV shows set in the war, doesn't help. In the 1970s nobody went on about the Boer War or Queen Victoria, or even WW1 really. There weren't re-enactments or a vintage industry or constant comparisons with those times. But I see the next wave of this creeping in now with a lot of Cold War era shows on Netflix etc. Maybe in twenty years' time everyone will have moved on from the WW2 obsession and instead we'll have 'build your own nuclear bunker' parties, with everyone dressed in 80s clothes and national singalongs of 'Relax'.

@ostinato
What a fantastic post.

We stood alone between Dunkirk & the invasion of Russia

But what do you mean by "alone"..if you mean "alone" as in the only bit of real estate in Western Europe that wasn't either neutral, occupied, or part of the axis you are right, fair enough

....but as a British people "we" were joined (as you say) by the Commonwealth Forces, Ireland, the Poles, the Czechs, the Free French, and, despite a lot of domestic opposition Roosevelt was providing some aid to the UK, even prior to Lend-lease and Pearl Harbor.

I'd agree that Britain as an island stood alone, but the idea that some like to portray that the plucky British people stood alone is simply wrong.

@SarahAndQuack yes I know (see my other 2 examples). It was just a response to the op describing the exclusively negative experience of her family. There was no one experience for everyone.

Can anyone explain why, if today is about remembering and honouring the hardships and sacrifices of the war and celebrating the end of that war and not about jingoism, being the winners and national pride, we need so many Union flags to do it?

Why is a flag and national pride more about winning than sacrifice?

Although to be honest I have no idea if people are waving flags or not, as I haven’t been out of the house as I thought we were in the middle of a pandemic.

@BlibbyBlobby
Because like it or not, symbols are important and never more so during war time. That was the flag the people we are honouring fought and died under. What’s wrong with that?

I'm so sorry, @Eskarina1. I read your post as indicating that the positive aspects justified the suffering, but I realise that wasn't your intention.

Why is a flag and national pride more about winning than sacrifice?

Because it makes the day about Britain and British identity, not the individuals from many nations who suffered and made sacrifices. They are just bit players in the myth of the nation.

Although to be honest I have no idea if people are waving flags or not, as I haven’t been out of the house as I thought we were in the middle of a pandemic.

You don't have to leave your house to see them
www.bbc.co.uk/

ostinato

Sorry to divert the thread but I have to ask:

Later, new types of bombs were developed to weaken the Nazi’s industrial heartlands,

Which new bombs are you referring to? For sure, bomb design changed ( light weight casings, which"cookies" etc)..but the big developments that arguably, very very arguably, contributed to a weakening of the industrial heartlands was the operational techniques that improved main force accuracy - in particular the Pathfinder force and the technology they had that improved their accuracy ( H2S and most especially Gee)

with extraordinary feats such as the dambusters raid (even if you could argue it wasn’t necessary by that stage of the war).

The raid was in May 43..over a year before the second front opened. I think the argument has been those raids were never ever particularly necessary, and in hindsight were not very effective but they were a major propaganda coup.

@OhCaptain No, the Soviet Union - but society doesn't want us to talk about that.

danfoster go to the doctors please.

Blibby, I don’t really understand why it shouldn’t be about Britain.

I am British and I live in Britain and my British family members sacrificed a great deal during the Second World War.

I would feel quite uncomfortable if we started creating some kind of line up of groups that were on ‘our side’ because not everyone I’m related to was on ‘our side.’ We’re trying to remember our own people, not recreate a massive division across Europe over who fought on what side. It was horrendous for everyone, regardless of whether they were French, Italian or whatever.

That was the flag the people we are honouring fought and died under. What’s wrong with that?

If you want to honour a person or a cohort, seems simpler and more honest to just do that rather than add the abstract symbol of a flag. Similarly, if you want to celebrate/commemorate the end of fighting between nations, doing it with a national symbol is an odd choice.

As soon as the flag flies, it makes honouring the people or celebrating the end of the war subordinate to the story of the nation rather than something bigger and better than nations.

I would feel quite uncomfortable if we started creating some kind of line up of groups that were on ‘our side’ because not everyone I’m related to was on ‘our side.’

I agree. No flags, no sides.

The soviets destroyed about 80% of nazi division. The British a few more then the Americans come after that.

divisions

Why do keep remembering these things? Because if we forget, the history repeats itself. In fact it is repeating already under our noses (think Trump and Boris) and nobody is doing anything significative to stop it.

Op you are rude to use the word Brits. It’s a derogatory turn in my opinion, normally used by Americans who believe they saved the war!

This weekend is about remembering the end of the war, long years spent In fear, hunger and death, with many sacrificing their lives so we could live in peace. There is no’hooha’ and it’s right we continue to remember what happened, and hope there is never another world war

‘I agree. No flags, no sides.’

What do you mean? The side no longer exists. The U.K. still does. It is the country we all agree to live in together.

I'm a major WWII buff. It is fascinating to me, not what was happening with Britain so much, more what was going on in Germany, on the Eastern Front and the Nuremburg trials. I've read hundreds of books by now and have learned a lot.

I didn't go out celebrating today, but I will never stop being interested.

It's worth mentioning, that not all people who were alive at the time don't like to talk about it. There used to be a man who lived next door to my Nan (desert rat) who showed me all his medals and told me stories of when he used to drive tanks

Its our countries flag, deal with it.

Some dont like the flags because its a reminder their own country hedged their bets the wrong way perhaps? I dont give a monkeys