Using ( not resident) nanny during lockdown?

[Ladyinamask]

So found out today my SIL and BIL are still having the nanny take care of their children . Nanny does not live with them btw.
I am rather horrified but not completely surprised they do this. Not key workers but both highly paid and quite frankly extremely arogent at the best if times.
They live in a rather nice part of West London by the river so hardly a remote hamlet with no known covid cases nearby.
Is this against the rules or is everyone still doing this?

I am disappointed to see so much support for this on here, and it makes me wonder if these are the very same people having friends over for BBQs because its outside, going to house parties - only a 'bubble' of us so thats fine, and generally not giving a damn.

Not at all; I have the luxury of being able to stay home and so I am. I don't even go out shopping. I do that because I realise that most people are not so fortunate and many people still need to go out so they can work and pay their bills and feed their families.

As for nannies. I am one. I work for a few families, most of which have furloughed me. Some need me.
If I don't go to work then they can't work then we all lose our jobs do we ? They are wfh but key workers but even if they weren't I would still go in because, as clearly pointed out several times on this thread. We are allowed to go to work.

Reasons why it is different:

1. Nurseries have lots of children in every day with some children only going once a week, some every day, lots of mixing, kids coughing over things, basically a lot of mixing.
2. Childminders often have lots of kids in their settings too, 3 young ones and Ofsted older children too. Not true for all but I'm general it is.
3. A cleaner is different because having your house cleaned isn't essential. Having childcare so that you can perform your job is.
4. Risks are minimal.
5. @Twigletmama saying 'you have no idea what your nanny is doing when she leaves your premises' how do you know they don't? I have a very good relationship with the families I work for. I would never flout the rules. I go to the supermarket once a week only. Otherwise, not seeing anyone. I can't imagine any employer hiring a nanny who didn't trust them.

If you think the rules are wrong then fine, but you don't need to have a go at nanny employers or employees about it because they arent doing anything wrong whatsoever.
This isn't the reason we have a high death rate. We have a high death rate because they didn't act soon enough. Chelthenham races shouldn't have happened for a start.

Stop attacking people on this thread @Biscuit0110 and @amelisa1

@mynameiscalypso no actually, I'm not going around having BBQ's at all 🤷‍♀️ because that isn't permitted.
Going to work is permitted.
Why are people assuming things about others when people are literally following the rules.

To anyone that might be offended, I extend my apologies. I just have called Public Health to understand better the guideline. The advisor recognised that the guideline may contain some loopholes but insisted on the right of the nanny to refuse work and follow the employment contract terms and conditions (that will trigger ultimately a dismissal)
I have called LA, Childcare Dep. The Coordinator interpretation of the same guidelines is that if you are a key worker not working from home you will require childcare services and ideally will be the nanny to move in. If parents are at home, working or not working , the nanny can move in but is not expected to travel each day for work as this will increase the risk...
I quite understand the logic of the Early Years Coordinator.
On this note, as none of the professionals above were able to clearly tell me that I am wrong, I still believe that the guidelines, in some situation has been bent to suit personal needs. I hope no one has been again offended.

@Hugglespuffed Oh I agree, I meant to quote in bold but it didn't work! I think anyone who wants to work should be able to!

@amelisa1what a time wasting, ridiculous thing to do. Just because you wanted to "prove" yourself right, you're not going to change a thing.

I presume you're also the sort to be calling 999, going to a & e with athletes foot, going to the GP with split ends.

You're still bloody rude and now a bloody time waster of people with more important things to do!

Get a life!

@Biscuit0110
I agree the guidelines do not offer a full explanation, and they are very contradictory

But it's number 12 here. It's very full. The alternative is we defraud the taxpayer by claiming furlough for childcare issues while furloughing said childcare, despite government permission for them to work - or we could lose the taxpayer even more by quitting my job, furloughing my nanny for a few months then inevitably making her redundant also when I can't find a new job during the coming Depression. And for what benefit?
www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-outbreak-faqs-what-you-can-and-cant-do/coronavirus-outbreak-faqs-what-you-can-and-cant-do

@amelisa1

*If you provide paid-for childcare in a child’s home, you can go to your place of work - this is in line with Government guidance that you can travel to work if working from home is not possible. However, it is important that you take as many precautions as possible in line with Public Health England guidance, including:

if you or someone in your own home has symptoms, you should not go to work, but self-isolate in accordance with Government adviceyou should not work in any household which is isolating or where an individual is being shielded, unless it is to remedy a direct risk to the safety of the householdwash your hands more often than usual, for 20 seconds using soap and hot water, particularly after coughing, sneezing and blowing your nose, including when you arrive at work and when you return hometo reduce the spread of germs when you cough or sneeze, cover your mouth and nose with a tissue, or your sleeve (not your hands) if you don’t have a tissue, and throw the tissue in a bin immediately. Then wash your handsclean and disinfect regularly touched objects and surfaces using your regular cleaning products to reduce the risk of passing the infection on to other peoplemaintain social distance as far as possible with family members and others that you are not directly caring for

Your employers are responsible for informing you and supporting you in how to maintain these measures.

People should not be leaving their home to undertake unpaid and informal care of others’ children.*

www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-outbreak-faqs-what-you-can-and-cant-do/coronavirus-outbreak-faqs-what-you-can-and-cant-do

Follow that link. I've quoted the answer from question 12.
If that isn't clear enough for you then I'm not sure how else to prove it?!

@mynameiscalypso sorry I didn't realise you were quoting!
This thread has made me angry 😩

@mynameiscalypso I'm not having BBQs either, such a mumsnet mantra the if you don't agree with me "you must be a bad person", I wonder if people like you have no friends anyway so it's a non issue?

Sorry @mynameiscalypso I also didn't realise you were quoting!

The anger of some posters at @amelisa1 is very revealing and says more about you than her. She has shown that what you've been insisting all through the thread isn't correct and you don't like it at all. Hence the aggression of your response. Maybe it was time wasting but it's interesting that you don't want to admit that you were wrong.

My main concern would be if a nanny was being put under pressure to keep working and then having to go home to a someone vulnerable or shielding. It is potentially putting other people at risk whatever the actual regulations might be.

I am really shocked by how many people support using a nanny during the current circumstances.
I know several people with a nanny; they have all furloughed them, or in one instance, where there is a nanny share, they are paying in full so that the other family ( who are key workers) can continue to have childcare.
I had presumed that everyone would be doing the same. Lesson learned!

@understandme I didn't say the thing about BBQs! I was quoting another poster who said it! I think people should do whatever is best for them without blind adherence to rules, most of which appear to be entirely made up. I'm not having BBQs because I live in a flat with a tiny balcony and I bloody hate sausages that are raw on the inside and burnt on the outside.

@mynameiscalypso yes I realised that, I did post .... sorry

@Mittens030869 I think you'll find if you read the whole post, that @amelisa1 set the tone.

And she's proved nothing, she spoke to one person telling them her thoughts and they probably just said "yes, if you like", I could make the same call and get a different response based on how I posed the question.

But @Mittens030869 we aren't wrong so what is there to admit? I've clearly posted the guidelines.
I'm not saying this to prove I'm right.
I'm quoting the clear guidelines because I don't want other nannies to read this thread and think that they are wrong for going to work and then risk losing their job.

But you seem to refuse to accept that the concerns people are having is reasonable? A live-in nanny wouldn't be an issue at all, as long as she's in lockdown with the family employing her. A nanny living elsewhere, potentially with a vulnerable partner or family member, is a completely different scenario and I would hope that she isn't being pressurised into carrying on working. There have been posts suggesting that this isn't the case, though, which is worrying.

@Twigletmama

Presumably you are also shocked by anyone buying for example craft material on Amazon (non essential, workers reliant on public transport, and Covid and poor implementation of safety in the warehouses), or getting takeaway from local restaurants (similar to the above).

Our cleaner is not working (but we are continuing to pay) as her service is not a requirement for our jobs continuing, and is riskier for her (and for us all) as she has her own family, takes the bus and works in multiple houses. For many nannies, that is not the case.

But you seem to refuse to accept that it is not against the guidelines @Mittens030869, despite them being linked.

Oh I accept what you're saying. I'm not a nanny and I don't employ a nanny so it doesn't affect me at all. (I had a live-in au pair for a year. I have been suffering from CIVID-19 symptoms myself for several weeks, though, and I'm concerned that some of you don't have concern that some nannies might be being put in a position where they're putting themselves and their families at risk (and other members of the public).

But I haven't studied the guidelines myself so I'll leave it at that.

That was supposed to read COVID-19.

Mittens030869
Agree that nannies with vulnerable family members or even requiring public transport to work should not be required to come. Concerns are absolutely valid.
But given that both scenarios are entirely legal, it is not clear why so many people are shocked or made so angry by a nanny who is isolating in her home, a walking distance from the family she works with, enabling two to three jobs to continue and almost identical to a live in nanny, bar possibly one additional supermarket delivery a week.