Shocked about death in care homes **MNHQ content warning**

[happyandsingle]

Just this.Cannot believe how care home residents and staff have been thrown to the wolves.
Everything focused on the NHS it's like the elderly didnt matter.
Feel ashamed how we treat our elderly and even if the government act now in my opinion it's to late as to many lives have been lost.
To think the goverment need to be held accountable for this.

So the government should not be held accountable for the social care it commissions and is legally responsible for?

And in the future we should have a conversation about letting old people die and spending the money on young people instead.

Okay, I am quite clear what you think.

@Amanduh Lots of people only go into care homes when things are desperate because they know the reality of a care home. So yes a lot do not have long to live. Some though live there for 20 years.
And you are ignoring the many interviewed care workers who are saying they have never seen so many old people die, and sometimes ones who were healthy and they would never have expected to die.

Anyway after this there will be far less old people in care homes so the social care bills will be much lower. So you will have largely got your wish to spend far less on old people.

I am shocked at some of the attitudes here it's very sad. The people that died had families, loved ones I think the coldness shown by some posts is really horrible but then again everyone is entitled to their opinion even if I find it hard to relate.

@happyandsingle Sadly some people do see old and disabled peoples lives as worthless.

Very true as shown in the responses here.

I just hope when these people get old and need care, that they will remember what they said.

I was chatting to the manager of a care home I have connections with. She said that they have no cases of Covid-19, and she knows others who don't, but you don't hear about them in the media.

She says that she thinks that they are having a slight increase in the death rate, with Covid not suspected. Apparently they don't sent patients to hospital except in extreme circumstances - no one is admitted 'just in case' or for observation, in case they pick up Covid.

She says that this isn't always a bad thing, that although people may die a little earlier than they might have with hospital intervention, they die peacefully, among their own possessions and staff who know and are fond of them, with lots of TLC and pain relief and/or sedation as necessary, but without procedures that maybe quite traumatic and may not necessarily prolong life, and certainly not enjoyable life, for long.

This Home, which I've always thought excellently run, is owned by a charity, so no owners feathering their nests there.

Always fascinates me how free and generous people are with other people’s money, while those of us who are actually contributing large amounts of tax and who have an opinion on where it could be put for the most good (BECAUSE THOSE CHOICES HAVE TO BE MADE) are reviled and made out to be heartless...

I have a disabled son. It is nearly impossible to get him the support he needs in school because of local authority cut-backs. Would I rather my tax money get spent on disabled children rather than prolonging the life of a 95 year old with dementia living in a care home? Yes I would.

The truth is we could do both.
But instead we are going to bail out companies who don't even pay tax here.

Because I don't think as soon as someone hits 95 they should be euthanized.

Can I just add , and this is warning for all with elderly relatives. The symptoms with covid 19 in the very elderly are not always obvious. My uncle and aunt both had a slightly high temperature and no cough to talk of then extreme tiredness and by the time breathing problems were apparent it was too late . This is why my uncles death did not have covid 19 recorded but my aunt did because when she fell ill quickly after him they realised there may be a link.

Argh Cantary you are living in a dream world! There isn’t enough of other people’s money to pay for the level of social care and healthcare and welfare that you want. It’s just the way it is - people are living longer than ever and there just isn’t enough money.

Please don’t start on about euthanasia again. I mentioned before that I will take myself off to Dignatas when it gets to the point that I need to go to a care home. But that’s my choice for myself and in no way means that I support forced euthanasia! Nothing could be more abhorrent to me.

I think you and I just have very different views about the role of government in social care for the elderly.

Jeez - I wish COVID-19 could target some of those with the empathy bypass and leave the elderly alone

@noego I agree with your post. It was not ageist to nor record any covid deaths that were not in hospitals . And the carehome director’s had decisions to make . Some of which are very difficult. Also if you have a person receiving care in their own home they are automatically more at risk as they have different carers in every day . They are using PPE but there must be more risk because of travelling between residents houses . So what is the answer?

There are some people in their 90s that have been treated and recovered .

Susie very sad. I was ask about temping on reception in care home. I said no. Just too risky.

Hopefully all the ones moaning about care for the elderly will be quite happy to go before they reach that age. Although as I suspect when they get to that age they may well have different views.
And if they have elderly parents they will not mind about the type of care they get as they are old and will be dying soon anyway.

I can't believe that 21% of people voted that YABU. It amazes me how little time it has taken for people to think it's ok for old or vulnerable people to die before their time. Why not just take them out and shoot them?

Going by some attitudes on here they would probably think that's a good idea.

I really do not like what this virus has revealed about our society.

Well, my mother was evidently completely out of the ordinary then, she lived in a nursing home for 10 years following her diagnosis of dementia! Stubbornness always did run in the family though.

And to those who might be wondering why we didn't just move her in and provide 24-hour care, none of us had a big enough house to take her in; some of us were living hundreds of miles away; some of us had our own families; all of us were working at least an 80% "average" working week and often more. So sadly, the best option, for her own safety, was to find a home for her. For the first couple of years, she paid privately, from the pension that my dad had left her, and other pennies that she'd squirrelled away. Until the money ran out. I'd honestly rather have seen her enjoy that money while she still could. For years before the end she'd stopped recognising us.

Anyone making comments about taking in relatives must never have been in the position where they've had to make a choice. What's that saying about walking a mile in someone else's shoes??

I do think there are WAY too many of us on Planet Earth and lifespans have increased exponentially. As has the survival of babies who, bluntly, in previous centuries would not have made it. But that doesn't mean I think it's time to go all Logan's Run and Soylent Green just yet.

@mondaynoon As I said before, what is “before their time”? Why is it different to dying of the flu? Would you say they had died before their time if they died from that? It’s meaningless! Talking about elderly people in care homes “dying before their time“ just seems ridiculous to me.

I suspect when they get to that age they may well have different views.
And if they have elderly parents they will not mind about the type of care they get as they are old and will be dying soon anyway

This is just not true. All my relatives past and present have lived to 90+, several to their 100's. They all got excellent care. They do all now get excellent care. They have had hips and knees done, cateracts, cancer and heart surgery. Survived strokes. At no point have they not had the care that they need.

Now, ask them what they want. Those same people are also declining other interventions if they don't add to their quality of life. They are not taking life extending drugs, they have dnr's and very specific lists of treatments they would and would not accept. When you get to 90 you have the right to determine your own end. I often feel on these threads that no-one has actually asked those elderly what THEY want, rather than what someone else thinks they should have.

And saying it is comparable to taking them out and shooting them just makes my blood boil!