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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Relocating to the US this year?

91 replies

Jamandbreadd · 27/04/2020 21:06

Looking for views from people particularly those based in the US I guess. We were supposed to relocate with dh job to the US (NYC) next month. Clearly this was put off quite quickly due to covid, we were jsut beginning visa applications with his company in March and nothing further has happened. I now have no idea what to expect. Obviously no crystal ball, but how realistic is it that we will relocate to NY this year now? And/or would you think it was crazy to go ahead with it?
Need some advice as I hear some very scary things coming out of the US and our whole year has been thrown into doubt. Our jobs are fine (for now) if we stay in the U.K. Dh is very excited about this opportunity but we have a school age dd and I don’t wish to put anyone at risk.
Any thoughts at all?

OP posts:
MissConductUS · 27/04/2020 23:28

You could also chat with one of the American banks that operates in the UK. Chase or Bank of America or Wells Fargo perhaps. You could come over here with accounts already established.

Jamandbreadd · 27/04/2020 23:37

Thanks all.
Coming back to the original point too.. Would you move there any time soon or not due to Covid/trump ?

OP posts:
IncorrigibleTitmouse · 27/04/2020 23:42

I think, if you are able, wait until after the election in November and see how the land lies then.

Jamandbreadd · 27/04/2020 23:45

I’m really worried that if I tell dh I have had second thoughts about this in the light of developments in the past couple of months he will be really upset with me.
I think the lockdown etc here (we are in London) has just made me really value what we have here (and feel fortunate for the NHS.) I feel I am swaying towards a change of heart, I was so excited in late feb when we decided to take NY but now I just don’t want to rush over there. Any advice on how to open this convo with dh... he won’t take it well I think.

OP posts:
flyingspaghettimonster · 27/04/2020 23:46

I live in Philly. I wouldn't move here right now. Wait till you have had the virus first. Even with insurance medical care is expensive. I would also wait to see whT happens with the elections etc. Right now you won't be moving here for at least 60 days as there is a total hold on new visa processing. But i would guess you might move by next year or maybe as early as Autumn. I woupdnt consider it till after 2nd wave though just in case. Gun crime is up roght now and unemployment will mean more robberies etc.

lastqueenofscotland · 28/04/2020 00:23

Some family friends recently returned from Southern California after they found that Trumps election meant that they experienced more homophobia in their day to day lives, like it became more acceptable.

My ex DP has a brother living there who is planning on returning in the next few months as one of them has lost their job due to covid and it’s made them realise how precarious the situation is especially in regards to healthcare.

That’s not to say their aren’t positives but I would want to wait till at least November and if you had some idea of how great the economic crisis will be.

For what it’s worth I lived in San Diego for a while and loved it and still dream of returning, but there were some uncomfortable bits and bobs - someone I knew vaguely was in a major car accident and his insurance only covered one prosthetic limb being a stand out one. The lack of annual leave is also a pain in the arse, as is finding really good Indian food Grin

Good things are I actually found the cost of living pretty cheap and wages higher than they would be in the UK for what we were out there for (academia), the houses are bigger (not sure if that would be the case in NY).

I think to be honest, if you’d not even researched enough to know you might struggle to get a phone contract you need to do some more before committing to anything.

Have you researched what lifestyle/property you would be looking at on your husbands salary as you said yourself you can’t work for a while (and there is no guarantee you will be granted permission to work, or at least that was the case when I was there! If you aren’t able to work can you afford it LONG term)?

Will your DHs healthcare plan cover the whole family, what strings are attached to this, and what about dentistry?

What are the schools like for your DD?

How much annual leave will your DH get, there isn’t a legal requirement to provide any IIRC.

TheTeenageYears · 28/04/2020 01:13

International moves are difficult at the best of times (we've done 5 in 11 years). So much depends on how supported the move is (we've done pretty much having to do everything ourselves including drag young children around immigration buildings through to almost everything being taken care of by a relocation company). This summer is going to be a really difficult time to relocate anywhere and trying to feel your way in an unknown land with major restrictions in place is just going to add to the stress. Depending on how much flexibility you have on dates maybe you could sit down with you DH for a practicalities check of everything involved when you move house never mind country so he can see how difficult it could be. How much has your world be disrupted recently in the UK and how much could it have been, how will you all cope with any issues you've faced whilst being thousands of miles away and no end in sight?

At the moment I feel like i've spent 11 years preparing for lockdown as we generally only come back to the UK over the summer. If we can't come back this summer we will effectively have been in lockdown for almost 2 years. The world getting back to normal in September for example doesn't help the many British expats who rely on summers at home to get them through the year being away.

Quizacabusi · 28/04/2020 02:07

@Jamandbreadd
Re credit, when you arrive and need to buy cars etc you won’t be accepted for any credit so unless you have cash or enough on UK credit cards to pay then you are a bit stuck. If you do buy with a UK credit card you need to work out the exchange rate.

It takes about a year to build up a credit profile here so for the first year you need to pay in advance for car insurance, phone plans, house insurance, TV packages, internet, gas etc. Nobody will let you set up payments like Direct Debits, in fact Direct Debits do not exist here.

We have found that people are superficially friendly and warm but scratch the surface and everyone is out for themselves. As long as their comfort is not affected they are ok but the moment they are inconvenienced it’s game over.

We found this especially when setting up bank accounts, getting school places etc. We would visit the branch, speak to someone and arrange to call them the next day to finalise things. We would call the next day and they wouldn’t have done any of the things we had all agreed would happen. It is VERY frustrating. In the Uk for example if you call a facility and get the wrong extension usually the person would offer to transfer your call. Not here, you get told you have the wrong number and they would hang up.

It baffled us for ages why people drive everywhere. I am not sure if it’s down to safety or not but nobody walks say between shops in a shopping park. They would drive and park as close to the door then get in the car again and drive to the next place even if it would be quicker to walk. My neighbors get in the car and drive 3 houses away to the mailbox and back.

We are in a very liberal state but there is still an open carry rule so we often see people in the park or shop with a gun on their hip. It scares me a lot.

I travel with work all over the US and the number of homeless people and Tent Cities is astonishing. Many homeless people have serious mental health issues and I am sure in the UK they would be sectioned for their own well being yet they are just left, in the streets with no medical intervention.

It’s not unusual for people to live out of their car.

All of our neighbours have multiple guns and laugh at us for not having any. It’s a way of life, date night at the shooting range, kids with mini rifles etc. It is always awkward when the kids want to go on play dates as we ask about gun safety and not always are the guns in a safe.

Work wise, we have found systems to be very dated. There is a lot of paper used all the time rather than emails. The annual leave allowance is awful and often new starts don’t accrue any leave at all for the first 12 months so I would make sure your husband negotiates his UK annual leave allowance.

Our children have had it drummed into them to say please and thank you and it’s noticeable here. Kids here would say ask for things but not use their manners. Also people here do not use cutlery, google it, people cut with the edge of their fork which drives me nuts when the children try and do that.

Re food - you will be better in NY than we are here but where in the UK we have Indians and Chinese takeaways it is all Mexican and Thai. We miss having a good curry. Also, if you do find a curry place they use the thigh meat. We miss a good curry.

The cost of good food is ridiculous. Fruit and veg are really expensive as is lamb if you can even get it. Beef is really cheap. There is a lot of cheese in the cooking here.

We notice that people don’t care about the environment so much, everything is disposable. For example I bought a candle with the shopping and they wrapped it in 3 carrier bags. People here have USA flags out the front and the law is that you don’t have a flag in the dark so everyone has porch lights on all night every night. There is no concern about using loads of paper and the cars have massive engines which guzzle fuel and have terrible emissions.

There is no MOT system either so we see loads of car which are not road worthy and pour out fumes.

We really miss having a good heart to heart with people. It feels like here while we have a great group of people to hang out with, none ever show any vulnerability or really talk about deep stuff.

It feels like people are competing to be the best, brightest fastest etc. This is especially apparent in school with competitive parents.
People don’t understand the British self deprecating sense of humour. People look quite puzzled and I have had people tell me to work on my confidence when I have made a joke about being rubbish at something.

It’s very annoying when people ask where you are from and then tell you that they are from the UK too despite never having been there. It happens multiple times a day.

Many people see value in what they own, they like a $100k truck but it’s all on credit. There is a different mentality around material things.

We feel that there is still an underlying racism. It is just little things people say that in the UK people would be appalled at yet here it’s acceptable. People mock Mexican laborers for example. It’s not pleasant at all.

You are welcome to PM me if you like as I don’t want to block up your whole thread. It just feels like we are tuned in differently! Other expats feel the same, in fact a friend described it as living in a weird reality show where everyone is competing for the best and to be the most popular but with no substance.

The good things are cheap fuel, our kids school is fantastic and has so many great resources. The car parking spaces are wonderful, you can drive right in. The lovely wide roads are great. People in our area take great pride in the neighborhood so no litter or noise etc. We like the sprinklers in the garden and the houses are much more spacious and well laid out compared to the UK (blown air heating here - no radiators).

It’s a massive step and if you could do it for a couple of years it would be a great experience but I wouldn’t make the move without an exit strategy.

I realise this may be unpleasant reading for Americans but we have been here long enough to feel like we have given it a really good go. We have travelled extensively and this is our genuine impression.

Stillfunny · 28/04/2020 02:19

It is a shame that you are getting such negative conversations here. I love
NY and would jump at the chance to go back.
If your DH is going to work for a large company in a niche area , I assume the salary is good ? Is there any relocation package on offer ? Having a company as your advocate can ease any of the issues re : banking , rents, phone etc.
Wondering why people are pushing you to wait for an election ? Even if Trump wins again , NYers will just have to put up with it - they cant all leave. Millions of people live and work there , living their lives , just like the UK.
I would absolutely go for it , give it at least 6 months , embrace all it has to offer .And if you absolutely hate it , you are not a prisoner , you can always come back.Flowers

globetrotter141 · 28/04/2020 02:31

We moved to the US earlier this year with my DH's job. It's a tricky one. Had I known we would go into lockdown straight away, would I still have come? Maybe... But no one knows when life will go back to anything even close to normal. I am sad that our life here is so different to what we expected, and I don't know when we'll get to do the things we'd planned on doing. I think you're right to be cautious, equally if you're likely to be in the US for at least a few years, it's probably still worth it. But who knows how or when the US will recover economically from this.. You'll likely not be coming to the New York you imagined.

Re cost of living, it is higher. Food is more expensive than in the UK overall. We managed to get a car on a hire purchase agreement without too much bother. Insurance was more expensive, but not loads more than Americans would pay. We set up a US bank account while in the UK and my DH got his SSN before we made the move, so that might have helped. You will likely need to pay a larger deposit if you're renting. Unless your husband's company covers that for you. We've been able to set up internet and other things with no issue.

If you are still wanting to do it, make sure the package offered is v good i.e includes medical premiums, shipping, cost of return back to the UK at end of contract etc...

Hope that helps. But I'm glad we're here, in spite of the politics!

IncorrigibleTitmouse · 28/04/2020 02:34

@Quizacabusi Your experiences/feelings are very similar to mine! Nice to know it’s not just me feeling like a fish out of water over here!

FireandFury · 28/04/2020 02:37

OP we’ve recently relocated to the US so would be happy to answer any questions if you’d like to PM me.

FromEden · 28/04/2020 04:41

There is a pause on the issuing of green cards, not visas. Although I presume there will be a lot of delays. As usual the "ban" on immigration was just bluster.

BritWifeinUSA · 28/04/2020 06:06

@FromEden there is a pause on issuing visas as all embassies are closed. Visas are issued by embassies.

OP, the L-1 is a pretty safe bet as, unlike other employment visas, it doesn’t have the requirement to prove that an American can’t do the job. The L-1 is an intra-company transfer so its basically a long-distance desk shuffle. It’s the EB visa category that has that requirement. The big question is when L-1s and other non-family based, non-immigrant visas will be issued again. The embassies have to open up first.

TKAAHUARTG · 28/04/2020 06:23

Where are you @Quizacabusi?

wibdib · 28/04/2020 06:34

Another thing to consider is if you’re likely to get pregnant as having a baby can be expensive in the US especially if you need a cesarian. Plus there can be pros and cons for the child in having been born in the US - much later downthe line! - like taxes. And can they be called up should the us need troops? Can’t remember. I’m sure others will know much better, also shoul you all come back I don’t know if there are any disadvantages to not having been born here.

Staticelle · 28/04/2020 06:41

I will caveat my response with the fact that I love America, not in a patriotic way of course, but having studied there, cycled down route 66, and visited friends most years; I find it to have some of the most beautiful places on earth, have largely found the people friendly enough, and always look forward to going. However I wouldn't move there at the moment, hell to the no. Too much political instability, the response to covid by the government is pretty scary, and November will be interesting. I would be open to it in the future potentially, not a huge fan of NY so personal choice wouldn't move there, but lots of people obviously really like it- but wait until next year at the earliest to see what is going on.

C4tintherug · 28/04/2020 06:57

We are in exactly the same position as you, meant to be relocating in July.
We have an appointment for embassy in June,, our immigration lawyer has advised- the ban is for 60 days and for immigrant visas. L1 is a non immigrant visa so therefore unaffected.
I wanted children to start new school in august so hoping to go but a lot is unknown. Further complicated by the fact I have to hand my notice in at my job in the next month if I have any hope of going in the summer.

TooSadToSay · 28/04/2020 07:04

I'd love to move back to New York, but a long distance move would be tricky right now for all the reasons mentioned plus the big issue of making friends. If you can't get out it will be hard to meet people and in my experience that will feel as boring as lockdown.

Pps are dead right about the start up funds and time lag for insurance plus be sure you understand that you still have to pay co-pays and co insurance. That could still be an immense amount if in ICU for covid or a prem baby for example. Hope you can still make the move later this year. NY is spectacular and you're obviously used to big city life.

peanutbutterandfluff · 28/04/2020 07:04

@Quizacabusi

I’m American (in UK 18 years) and I agree with everything you said. I spent the first 8 years here longing to go back, and the last 10 realising all the things you posted. And I’m also from the “liberal” Northeast.

British society is just more caring. I know it doesn’t feel like it under the Tories, but there is so much more of a social safety net. In the US it’s every person for themselves. I never knew that until I lived here.

In my career I would be paid nearly twice as much in the US (with a house 5x the size) but I wouldn’t go back now for anything. I couldn’t stand to raise my child in a place where someone as selfish and terrible as Donald Trump could be elected (and likely re-elected). I couldn’t bear for my child to be exposed to those values.

Jamandbreadd · 28/04/2020 07:04

Yes we would have a good relocation package. However rents anywhere decent in NY are huge for a 2 bed and I’m very conscious of that... we live in London so are used to high rents but it seems that NY is even more expensive. I’ve been renting for 10 years and if we stayed here we would be looking to buy our own first property, if we go to the US (looking at 2 years initially) we will be renting obviously and if the economy’s fucked over there, I’m worried about finances. I have a pretty good job here and earn well, but I wouldn’t be able to transfer with my work so even with an L2 visa I would need to find a new job. But Dd is young and I don’t see myself being able to work the same hours there while settling her in for a decent period of time anyway.

Dh is an optimist but he’s pretty naive. He has a single friend in NY who lives a cool city lifestyle with a plush 1 bed flat in a cool area of Brooklyn, no kids, lots of disposable income. Our life won’t be like this (it’s more like this here to be honest because my family live locally and can babysit for us, we are both currently good earners, and live in a “trendy” part of London.) my gut has been saying for a while that despite NY being exciting we would not be gaining much to live there and if we stayed we could achieve things like buying property, me progressing in my job, likely having another baby within a year or so. The NY move puts a hold on that. Add in a worry about second wave of COVID (not just in NY but also it affecting our loved ones back in the U.K.) and the recession on its way, I am very nervous about leaving my job and taking a leap of faith when we have a good life now. I think dh is a bit naive about this move but when I have raised these issues he jsut accuses me of being “scared”. I am risk averse and this year so far has only made me more so.

OP posts:
Room101isWhereIUsedtoLive · 28/04/2020 08:17

Please please before you move there, research the Hague convention and what it could mean for you and your children if you were trying to move back with your children but without your husband.
I wish I had known in advance what that could mean, but I didn't. And that did not end well for me or my children.

FlowerArranger · 28/04/2020 08:56

I could have written just about everything @Quizacabusi wrote. We came on a top-notch expat package but life in the US proved way more difficult than we had anticipated. To the extent that stuff like big salary and house ceased to matter. The move contributed hugely to the demise of our marriage and in the end I moved back home, even though it meant leaving adult children and grandchildren behind.

Also, @Jamandbreadd, take note of what Room101 said regarding the Hague convention, particularly since you and your husband don't appear to be entirely on the same page with this proposed move. A child can be considered resident after just 6 months. I'd want some kind of written statement to the effect that he would allow you to take your DC back to the UK if the marriage were to break down. I have no idea whether this would help in a court of law, though. Speak to an immigration attorney in the US (your own, not the company's).

3rd issue: what about your own career, if not now but in the future? Are your skills and qualifications transferable? The latter very often aren't, especially teaching, nursing, law etc. US companies tend to be very fixated on local qualifications and degrees. Job applications are often online, and your British qualifications won't fit into the tick box categories. Moreover, employers don't understand visas and may be reluctant to hire a foreigner on a temporary visa.

4th: Your visa will be dependent on your husband's. This alone can shift the power balance... What are the long term plans? Companies often drag their feet with green cards because they want to keep the employee tied to the company.

Sorry to sound negative, but you really need to think about all this very carefully, not just for now, but potentially forever. You need to have a secure bail-out plan in case you find that your new life doesn't work for you. Or just stay put Flowers

lastqueenofscotland · 28/04/2020 09:17

From your post it just sounds like your husband has got giddy about the thought of cool city living in New York.
Well he’s not 19 anymore and he has a wife and kids, and you need to be considered especially if you want another baby.

Also you say yourself you have a good career that you would be giving up, I wonder if in time that will breed resentment?

Jamandbreadd · 28/04/2020 09:45

Thanks to the posters talking about the potential child custody issues. Dd is dh’s stepchild (not adopted)- we got together when she was 1. Her dad has never been in the picture. I’m pretty sure I would not have issues with that. However dh and I have said we do want another baby (I’m early 30s) and I’m nervous about having one in the US for many reasons, cost and custody being two big ones. Another reason why it would need to be “temporary” and stuff like babies/house buying would need to wait til we are back in a couple of years (so the plan goes). It felt like a kind of fun adventure while dd is young but the current climate has drummed home to me how lucky we are and yet dh is undeterred. I think he’s being naive but can’t talk to him about it.

OP posts: