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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Fruit picking? Are they f***ing serious?

677 replies

emmcan · 26/04/2020 20:31

So whichever hapless muppet got dragged out today to do the daily lying to the gullible has suggested that furloughed workers could br picking fruit.

Fuck me, how fucking badly run is this shitshow?

The reason that we have had a two decades of migrant workers doing these jobs is because British people are too lazy and incompetent to do them.

And now they expect furloughed workers to head out into the fields and get their hands dirty?

It will happen, in a fashion, as they will just stop paying money to people who refuse to work, but it will be an appalling form of slave labour.

OP posts:
DrMaryMalone · 28/04/2020 07:47

For anyone wondering about social distancing on farms where staff live on site and work in close proximity, the latest guidance for farms can be found on the link below. This was issued on Friday and was jointly produced by the AHDB, PHE and Defra. I know that at least 2 of the supermarkets have asked all their farm suppliers to adhere to it.

ahdb.org.uk/coronavirus/social-distancing-farm-businesses

The AHDB site also has lots of other useful info for anyone interested in how CV19 is affecting farms.

firstmentat · 28/04/2020 08:03

@mathanxiety
Well, the Irish were the Eastern Europeans of their time, no? My children are half Irish, and I actually had a comment once from a (presumably well-meaning) elderly English lady along the lines of how incredible it is that Irish and Eastern European populations intermarry now. I still have not deciphered that one, but still sense some layer of unpleasantness underneath.

DrMaryMalone · 28/04/2020 08:04

To the poster who asked about wonky veg, yes that's exactly what I mean. Not all retailers have bought into the wonky veg movement. Some still require produce to be perfect or risk having either the affected cases removed or worse the whole consignment rejected upon delivery if the % of defects is too high. Example of 100 trays of 10 broccoli heads:

50 heads are under the specified weight of 360g by more than the 10% tolerance allowed = 5% defect
50 heads have stalks that are too long making the head to stalk ratio less than the specified ratio of 1:1 = 5% defect
50 heads have hollow stalk bigger than the specified diameter of 10mm = 5% defect
Overall defects of 15% would potentially see the whole lot rejected unless the customer really needs it and is willing to take the chance of the product not selling in stores or customer complaints..

The hollow stalk is a particularly difficult one as it can't be seen until the broccoli is cut so pickers can't just bypass it in the field. To be fair if we know it's an issue with a crop we can ask supermarkets for a temporary specification to allow it but they dont always make it easy.

Some crops risk damage if harvested by machine, such as soft fruits and cauliflower. And supermarkets don't want squashed berries or bruised cauliflowers months shelf.

DrMaryMalone · 28/04/2020 08:06

*on their, not months

FallonSwift · 28/04/2020 08:33

@mathanxiety

Come over to the people enjoy depressing others thread. It's a haven for those who don't think that furloughed people are all lazy and obese arseholes for not wanting to stick their kids in a hedge.

bluebluezoo · 28/04/2020 09:12

Let's not forget that people were furloughed so they could stay inside

I thought the reason for furlough is there is no work in many sectors within lockdown. If you can’t work from home or your pub/restaurant/place of business is shut what does your employer do? They have no income so can’t pay you, so they either sack you or “furlough”- unpaid time off but hopefully a job to come back to.

The govt them said they’d pay furloughed workers to stop layoffs and save jobs.

binkyboinky · 28/04/2020 10:13

@mathanxiety 👏👏👏👏

binkyboinky · 28/04/2020 10:20

And the Tories have managed to divide us to rule once again. While little people bicker among themselves over who isn't "doing their bit", the millionaires and billionaires are riding this crisis without a care knowing the government supports them regardless.

How do they do it? It's a talent, I tell you.

Tonemeth · 28/04/2020 10:26

bluebluezoo exactly. Furlough is about saving jobs, not staying inside. The scheme has been oversubscribed because workplaces that can stay open have closed.

starlight13 · 28/04/2020 10:27

What's the problem. If you need work and live near a farm then why wouldn't you take the job. Is it too lowly for you op? Do you like fruit and vegetables being available for you to buy at the shops all year round? You need to seriously take a look at yourself and your place in society.

Notverybright · 28/04/2020 10:53

bluebluezoo and why can't you work in those sectors during lockdown?

Because your not supposed to be going out. Such an idiotic argument to say that it's only to save jobs and not to save us from getting a higher peak.

Notverybright · 28/04/2020 10:56

starlight13 yes know your place hospitality and retail workers, you clearly don't know what hard work is 🙄.

RufustheLanglovingreindeer · 28/04/2020 11:14

If you need work

They don’t need work, they’ve been furloughed

BoredInLockdown · 28/04/2020 11:20

Do you mean to be so rude?

imsooverthisdrama · 28/04/2020 11:27

*I thought the reason for furlough is there is no work in many sectors within lockdown. If you can’t work from home or your pub/restaurant/place of business is shut what does your employer do? They have no income so can’t pay you, so they either sack you or “furlough”- unpaid time off but hopefully a job to come back to.

The govt them said they’d pay furloughed workers to stop layoffs and save jobs*
Ok so the furloughed scheme was introduced so that employers would not make redundancy during these difficult times , Boris had already said don't go to restaurants and bars so overnight these had impacted . The furloughed scheme was on the Friday 20th March on the same day bars and restaurants were closed . The lockdown was on the Monday so the majority of employers had no option but to furloughed staff due to lockdown as many couldn't wfh.
Furloughed staff are not unemployed, they are not claiming benefits. So we are not picking any bloody fruit as we want to do our job . !!!
Some of us have worked all our lives since age 15 , a global pandemic happens not out fault to not work and the way treated on here is disgusting.

Localocal · 28/04/2020 13:07

What I don't understand is why they are suggesting furloughed workers do this. Furloughed workers are getting paid. The people who need money are all those who don't have jobs and aren't getting salaries or benefits. There are lots of people in this country who have fallen through the cracks in the government's financial support schemes and now have no income at all. Those are the people who need these jobs and will doubtless take then willingly if they can find one and get to it. The other group the government could have called on os uni students. There are hundreds of thousands of them, young and healthy and with nothing to do at the moment.

DrMaryMalone · 28/04/2020 13:13

Around this time last year when we were facing seasonal labour shortages due to Brexit I attended an industry meeting which included a presentation from someone at DEFRA on the governments plan on where the labour could potentially be sourced from. It included:

The unemployed
University students
Recently released or on day release prisoners

Waxonwaxoff0 · 28/04/2020 13:17

@starlight13 furloughed people don't need work, they have work. I'm not on Jobseekers allowance. I have a job, I just can't do that job at the moment.

peppermintcapsules · 28/04/2020 13:18

I'd be willing to work double rather than see my uni age daughter press ganged into slave labour for less than min wage living in unsafe conditions as a guinea pig for the virus.

peppermintcapsules · 28/04/2020 13:22

Exactly, binky!

Ihaventgottimeforthis · 28/04/2020 13:40

DrMaryMalone the AHDB guidelines are good in theory but I can't see them working in practice, eg the cohort idea is workable up to the point where one of the cohort become symptomatic.
Defra have their head in the clouds regarding farm labour - it was evident during brexit and it's more evident now.
Day release prisoners? It's like Cool Hand Luke.
Would you want to supervise a bunch of day release prisoners with machetes trimming cauli?!

bananaskinsnomnom · 28/04/2020 13:47

What a lot of posters on here are forgetting, whilst pointing the finger at the furloughed, is that many (including me) have applied to be fruit pickers, and the vast majority have been turned away. So it’s not just “not wanting to” by any stretch of the imagination, or the fact that it’s low pay or living in a caravan with strangers. We are not the people the farmers are after so they aren’t taking us on. For multiple reasons discussed multiple times on here, largely to do with wages, workers rights, lack of experience and most won’t be available for the whole season because, let me remind some people again, they are still employees for their job and will be needed back before the fruit season is out. It’s not just turning up with a basket.

It’s also very easy for someone not furloughed to say “Well if I was furloughed or if I get furloughed I will be out there working and volunteering straight away”. Oh will you now? Because it’s really easy to say it, the reality is very different. If you’ll allow me to explain my experiences over the last few weeks as an example, everywhere is different I know but I don’t think my area is that rare:

So since furlough, I have been instructed that I am still an employee of my current employer but can take on additional work (paid or not). However I must be ready to return when they need me. Notice could be minimal.

First thing I did was look for supermarket jobs. Have worked in one before, as a student and not. Lots of adverts for 4 week contracts and such to tide over the busy period. Sent off the ones on walking distance (so 5 supermarkets - jobs varied) Had one rejection letter “due to sheer volume of applicants” and the rest I heard nothing. Good friend works in one of the big ones, lower management level.
She told me they received tons of applications. The jobs went to the younger applicants, largely students as the minimum wage is lower. Delivery driver jobs went fast (more age spread however) generally to whoever was fastest at getting to interview and had a clean licence (well I can’t drive so that job was out of the question anyway)
Those temporary jobs are now done with as the mass panic buying has ended - people employed as such are mostly on zero hour contracts to be used as cover of sickness if levels rise. Long term positions generally went to unemployed rather than furloughed in case they had to leave.

Fruit picking? Discussed at length. Only one reachable and not even that local and wasn’t wanted.

Not much employment happening for obvious reasons around here.

So to volunteering. I, like thousands across the country, joined the volunteering hub for my local
Community. I put myself on the list to do other people’s shopping, collect prescriptions etc. There’s been about 5 occasions in the last 6 weeks where people have been asked to go out shopping. I think people are asking family and friends rather than the volunteers (I’ve done it for a friend - nothing to do with the community hub!) Nor is this area particularly badly hit (yet). So whilst I and many others are ready to help, it’s not yet been needed. This also goes for the care homes shopping etc

Food bank - I am a regular donator to the food bank - food when I can and I send a weekly direct debit donation. So I was sent a letter regarding the crisis. They needed drivers to drop food to houses rather than collection. Well I can’t do that. I put myself forward to sort food or whatever was needed but likewise, they needed drivers to go and buy food, and they were extremely nice about it but ultimately had enough people on their rota to pack and sort, but I’m on the list if needed. Social distancing prevents multiple packers at once. That’s fine, better to be turned away than them being short.

Care homes - let’s think about this for a second. Your average Joe out there has no experience with caring for people. Anyone with an ounce of common sense knows it’s not as simple as just giving them a cup of tea and walking them along a corridor.

Now consider, your parents in that care home. You’re possibly paying thousands for it, or loosing your inheritance for it. Do you honestly want them being cared for by furloughed people who have skills in different areas but no clue about how to care for Elderly people? No clue how to properly administer medication? No understanding of the early signs of a stroke? No true understanding of just how clean a home needs to be? No food hygiene certificate? No experience of getting someone dressed, cleaned up without hurting them and costing them their dignity? I wouldn’t know! Care homes want and need experienced carers, not furloughed staff who are normally serving drinks/sat behind a computer/ fixing roofs/cleaning windows/working at a child care facility / chefs / DJing - whatever - so many jobs out there!
Or if that’s not enough, think about it being you at the receiving end of this care!

And the normal volunteers are not wanted right now because it puts the residents at so much risk. Easy to say “in ya go! Go volunteer earn your keep!” and then complain, be devestated and threaten to sue when your loved one contracts the virus because so many volunteers were going in an out.

Likewise, do you want an inexperienced care staff member looking after you and your family if you get admitted to hospital? The hospitals want experienced care assistants.

So actually my volunteering around my area has come to a halt. The areas I’ve volunteered in for years are for children so are not currently running. If every furloughed person was out and about doing other jobs, and the kids at school, lockdown would be almost pointless. It’s also very easy to say “you should be out there doing your bit” when you’re not furloughed but working safely at home, unexposed to the risk. which I bet many pointing the finger are.

I’ve earned my keep thank you very much, and will continue to do so now and when I return to work.

I’m sure the loudest complainers also complain when they see anyone leave there house. It’s been on here enough - “my neighbour goes out everyday, not in uniform so she’s not a key worker! It’s disgusting I’m going to report!” Maybe they’re a furloughed volunteer???? Just a thought.....

FallonSwift · 28/04/2020 14:01

@bananaskinsnomnom. Completely agree

peppermintcapsules · 28/04/2020 14:03

Don't know any care homes who have on-site laundries. All contracted out.

wrongsideofhistorymyarse · 28/04/2020 14:04

bananaskin excellent post.

I've been told that I'll have 48 hours notice of going back to work.

Voluntary organisations in my area are swamped with applicants so I can't even volunteer.

I'd rather be working and not worrying about my job.

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