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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to get a bit fucked off at having to protect the NHS?

634 replies

Santaclauswhosthat · 25/04/2020 23:19

This is a healthcare system I've paid into all my life. I don't think everyone who works in it is a hero and the vast majority of them aren't underpaid. It's ranked 16th in the world and has the worst cancer outcomes for any developed country. It's not very good. Nonetheless it's the only healthcare system open to me right now. But I can't access it. My operation had been cancelled and I can't get a consultant appointment. The GPs aren't seeing patients face to face. I've already had one tumour removed that was on the turn. I'm worried that I may have another. I have no way of finding out if this is the case. A family member has already died of covid 19 after being denied treatment for three days during which repeated calls to the ambulance service were made whereupon his mother was told she should only ring again if his lips turned blue. He is dead. Right now. The NHS didn't protect him. It isn't protecting me either. What is the point of the NHS, exactly? Most clinics are closed or running at half mast. GPs aren't seeing anyone. NHS staff get shopping hours and free food and fuck knows what else and we are all dying protecting them.

OP posts:
Oliversmumsarmy · 26/04/2020 11:04

Chesneyhawkes1

Dp had a scan booked in February. He initially asked for one in November when he started to think something wasn’t right.

His scan was cancelled in February and moved to March but then was cancelled until further notice

And the hospital treating me have said no cancer treatments have been affected there. So I don't think so

Dps hospital aren’t doing scans for those on their books. New patients maybe but not if you were diagnosed a few years ago. So saying cancer treatments have not been affected doesn’t match with the reality

OneandTwenty · 26/04/2020 11:04

dontdisturbmenow
Have to laugh too at those who believe healthcare is sooooo much better elsewhere where just about every country in this world will complain about their own system, usually the exact same complaints. Have you lived abroad recently, do you follow foreign news? I bet not.

I have and I do. And it's exactly WHY I complain about our crappy system. HTH

Notthetoothfairy · 26/04/2020 11:07

You poor thing. I would totally have said the relative’s lips were blue to get them seen though.

sleepingpup · 26/04/2020 11:08

I have only had to sees a GP once in 15 years as I am probably the luckiest person in England - don't seem to get ill (so far touch wood)......

Long may it continue Xenia. I wish you well and hope you NEVER get your "money's worth" from all the tax you have paid.

We have unfortunately had much more than our money back in treatment.

Chesneyhawkes1 · 26/04/2020 11:09

@Oliversmumsarmy sorry to hear that.

I can't comment on people who have been diagnosed or being investigated previously.

Only my experience and that of my work colleague.

The scans I had were at my local hospital. They don't do the treatment there though. So I'm going to a hospital around an hour away for that.

sleepingpup · 26/04/2020 11:09

I should say cancer treatment.

LaurieMarlow · 26/04/2020 11:09

By the by, the advice to stay put unless the lips are blue is absolutely appalling and clearly leading to many preventable deaths.

The UK’s death rate is staggering bad compared to others. People should be protesting about this at least.

BatsEars · 26/04/2020 11:13

Laurie

Please can you share a government link where it states that exact instruction?

user1497207191 · 26/04/2020 11:13

So saying cancer treatments have not been affected doesn’t match with the reality

My OH had his treatment cancelled mid way through the course of treatment. Not even getting his regular blood tests done at the moment which used to be essential so the consultant could monitor various readings from his monthly blood tests. Just completely abandoned - they won't even return his phone calls.

LaurieMarlow · 26/04/2020 11:15

Please can you share a government link where it states that exact instruction?

I can’t, no. But anecdotally that seems to be what’s going on.

LaurieMarlow · 26/04/2020 11:16

The OP’s relative was told that, for example.

BunnytheHoneyBee · 26/04/2020 11:19

You have had a horrible time and I’m sorry but yes YABU. The NHS workers are all human and they are risking their lives every time they go to work. They’re also putting at risk people they live with. Nurses, healthcare assistants and cleaners don’t earn what doctors do but they are still putting themselves at risk.

They make mistakes but it doesn’t mean they are not saving lives and we wouldn’t be more fucked without them.

GrumpyHoonMain · 26/04/2020 11:22

Some trusts have basically used Covid as an excuse to cut costs everywhere. Others (including most teaching hospitals etc) haven’t. I have found GP surgeries in towns with teaching hospitals are still running. The decision to open (or not is probably based on the health and availability of the nurses and consultants seeing patients.

Mintychoc1 · 26/04/2020 11:23

I’ve lost count of the number of times I’ve said this.
Death rates look at hospital deaths.
In other countries without a “free for all” health service, people can’t afford to go to hospital, so hospital deaths are lower.

The middle class arrogance here is amazing - people saying they’ve lived in other countries and had better health care etc. Has anyone lived in a country without a state health service, where they’ve had no insurance and no money? In the UK a homeless person who owns literally only the clothes they are wearing can walk into A&E having a heart attack. They can receive tens of thousands of pounds of medical/surgical treatment for free, as well as a bed and food for the duration. No system is perfect, and the NHS has had to operate on a shoestring for decades, but I still think you would find it hard to find another country where treatment is given in such circumstances.

MooseBreath · 26/04/2020 11:24

You're not being unreasonable. I don't blame the doctors, nurses, cleaners, admin, etc., but I certainly blame those in upper management and those funding the NHS and individual trusts. The service is not good enough, and considering the amount of tax paid by the general public that should be going towards healthcare, the state of the service is disgraceful.

SylvanianFrenemies · 26/04/2020 11:25

I am an Allied Health Professional in the NHS, currently wfh as shielding. My colleagues are all in work, doing whatever they can, while other people are furloughed at home.

I agree that the hero worship overall isn't necessary or expected. Noone I know is getting freebies, apart from scrubs bags. People working across the NHS are risking their lives (partly due to inadequate PPE). Your anger is misplaced. But it is understandable.

BunnytheHoneyBee · 26/04/2020 11:25

I agree @Mintychoc1 I’m no leftie but I think it’s admirable we live in a country where we can access medical treatment when we need it and not worry that it will either bankrupt us or we’ll turn away.

LaurieMarlow · 26/04/2020 11:27

In other countries without a “free for all” health service, people can’t afford to go to hospital, so hospital deaths are lower.

Other countries are recording their total death rates, not just hospitals, with nursing homes a significant percentage of that.

The UK death rates are appalling, even without taking that into consideration.

Comparisons are being made with countries like Italy, Germany, France, Switzerland, Netherlands.

No, people aren’t dying here because they can’t afford hospital. They all have sophisticated, relatively well functioning health services.

GrumpyHoonMain · 26/04/2020 11:28

** I’ve lost count of the number of times I’ve said this.Death rates look at hospital deaths.
In other countries without a “free for all” health service, people can’t afford to go to hospital, so hospital deaths are lower.**

Agreed - South Korea is a very good example of this. Most of the population is very poor (a large chunk don’t have mobile phones and so can’t be tracked) and don’t visit hospitals at all - I doubt the authorities have any idea how many have truly died.

Truthpact · 26/04/2020 11:29

How much I wonder would it cost to run the NHS to a good standard? Where we have enough staff, can treat people without it being a postcode lottery etc?

And how much would it cost us extra in tax?

Disquieted1 · 26/04/2020 11:33

DP's cancer follow up was cancelled.
My neighbour had breast cancer, follow up also cancelled.
A family member has a brain haemorrhage and was discharged early with no care plan, no monitoring, no follow up. Has had another haemorrhage and went back to hospital.

Everyone I know can relate similar tales. It seems that for a while we did not have a National Health Service at all, we had a National Covid Service.

Matt Hancock I think has now recognised this. On TV yesterday he said four times that people should try to access NHS services as normal.

Pinkblueberry · 26/04/2020 11:34

I think it’s admirable we live in a country where we can access medical treatment when we need it and not worry that it will either bankrupt us or we’ll turn away.

The part about not being bankrupt I totally agree with. But too many people have experiences where actually they don’t have access to the medical treatment that they need. Waiting lists are for various treatments are extremely long, and occasionally too little too late - or not worth the wait and people give up and don’t seek treatment for things that in a 1st world country shouldn’t be conditions that people need to live with.

BovaryX · 26/04/2020 11:37

Have you lived abroad recently, do you follow foreign news? I bet not

@dontdisturbmenow

I live abroad. As I have already described, the time scale of finding a lump, seeing a doctor, having an ultrasound, mammogram, biopsy, diagnosis? Three weeks. Ultrasounds are a standard diagnostic tool used frequently. MRI is another diagnostic tool used when required. Do you have any concept at all what a functioning health service looks like? I pick up the phone, make an appointment with a doctor of my choice at a time convenient to me. The reason the UK has one of the lowest cancer survival rates of the developed world is because early diagnosis is critical in successfull cancer treatment. How long does it take to get a doctor's appointment in the UK? The fact that cancer appointments have been cancelled will result in unnecessary deaths. This is a discussion which is long overdue. If the NHS is not working at its most fundamental level, which is to provide a healthcare service to patients? Something fundamental needs to change.

sleepingpup · 26/04/2020 11:46

As I have already described, the time scale of finding a lump, seeing a doctor, having an ultrasound, mammogram, biopsy, diagnosis? Three weeks. Ultrasounds are a standard diagnostic tool used frequently. MRI is another diagnostic tool used when required.

Actually my OHs diagnosis and radical treatment took less time than that. In this country.

BovaryX · 26/04/2020 11:49

@sleepingpup

Really? Let's hope that less than three weeks to finding a lump to getting the biopsy result is the standard experience of NHS patients.