High Earners not in "bullshit jobs"?

[VirginWestCoast]

Inspired by a couple of recent threads, the"bullshit jobs" one and the one asking how posters became well off.
Mumsnet seems to have people on generally higher incomes than the UK as a whole, with people quite nonchalantly saying that they and/or their DH are on 150k+ and a lot of people were saying on the Bullshit jobs thread that they were very well paid.
In the other thread, lots of people out their success down to sheer hard work, which I don't doubt, but lots of people work hard in worthwhile (ones which are pretty much universally recognised as worthwhile) jobs but are never going to be on 150k+ like nurses, teachers, cleaners, care workers. I know there are others and these are the ones most often trotted out but bare with me:
So it cannot just be working hard, it has to be working hard in the right areas (finance etc, I'd assume) to be well off if you aren't born into it or inheriting it.
And yet, while you may have, for example, doctors on 70k or so, the 150k+ group don't seem to include the typical "worthwhile" jobs (though I know this may well be down to me not being very familiar with the jobs in finance, senior management etc)

So my question is this:
If you are a high earner, do you feel that your job is socially useful? "Bullshit job"? Something else entirely? Do you think that what you're paid is fair?
Also, with regards to hard work, what did you have to do to qualify for your job role/ how long did it take?

This is just for personal curiosity so any answers are greatly appreciated.

I am always agog at the salaries I see on here. But I guess it's just not my normal. I'm perfectly happy with what I earn (around 30k) and I don't have a particularly stressful job. So no jealously from me. However I think tax could be done more fairly so that public services could be paid for properly and to help those really struggling. All those companies exploiting tax loopholes doesn't seem right to me.

We're both in the high earning IT sales sector and while our products make life easier for people and businesses, no way should we be paid at the level we are. We both earned £250k + last year which is a combination of basic salary and commission on multi million £ deals. I think it's a throwback from when IT was mysterious 🤣
Lots of luck, hard work and an outgoing personality is required, you just need to be able to understand business and create solutions for them. No way are we worth more than what a Dr or Nurse etc. are paid.
I'm leaving it soon, I've realised that I want to spend more time with the children before they fly the nest and I feel extremely lucky that financially we can make that decision.

"If you are a high earner, do you feel that your job is socially useful"
Yes. Lawyer. Without the law we would be in Lord of the Flies chaos, murderers would go unpunished, the state would never be held to account etc etc.

""Bullshit job"? Something else entirely? Do you think that what you're paid is fair?"
Yes is fair. I work for myself. I am only as good as my last piece of work.

"Also, with regards to hard work, what did you have to do to qualify for your job role/ how long did it take?"
To qualify - graduated in law aged 20 with law prizes etc. (3 years), then a year at law school for post grad. Then 2 years training in a law firm before qualifying aged 23. So that stage took 5 years. Then you build up your professional reputation and get experience over the years after. from leaving school to read law I m now in year 41 of full time being involved in law including my degree. I hope I can do 20 more years.

I set up on my own in 1994. Before that I worked in City law firms.

"Bullshit job"?

Yup totally

Do you think that what you're paid is fair?

I'm paid on my performance so I think so. I also charge substantially less than firms doing the same as I do, so have created myself a nice little niche.

It was complete and utter luck quite frankly!

"Also, with regards to hard work, what did you have to do to qualify for your job role/ how long did it take?"

No qualifications, learned on the job (although I have other non-related professional qualifications!).

I started up 6 years ago and don't need to work full time.

They do not pay for themselves.
Surely every service we offer is paid by someone else not by ourselves. . The only difference is whether that service or good is paid.for out of the public purse which is money that is paid collectively or by an individual who decides individually what is spent.

It is also very frustrating how everyone seems.to be deliberately misunderstanding what @RansonLondoner is saying. At no point have they said communism is a good idea. It was just used as an illustration of the fact that private industry does not pay for the public sector. That is an economic fact, albeit one that can be difficult to understand.

DP works in research, earns £150-180k ( performance pay means the amount can shift) . I don't consider the job to be BS at all, although it can be a struggle to explain exactly what DP does it is valuable to DP's company and the research world.

Oh, and DP is qualified only through life experience - being a good leader and communicator, and an 'ideas' person. Literally has no formal qualifications for the position as they don't really exist. It's all project based.

There are plenty of people that work hard, but don’t get paid enough. However, there are also many people who think they work hard and yet they don’t realise that many who make 150-200k plus work loads more.

Example given, those who work from 9am to 6pm five days a week and then the higher earners who often work longer hours. My dh works from morning (usually starting 8am to 8/9pm most days and sometimes until 10pm, usually no lunch break other then quick bite while working!!). He regularly works several hours during the weekend as well. He NEVER takes a sick day. And while on holiday, he will regularly work most days at least a couple hours or more. I assume he must love his work, otherwise how the heck can he put those hours. But anyway, I think most people don’t realise how hard high earners usually work.

I am freelance. I write and produce tv/media/content for broadcast and corporate. On the scale of 1 (being utter BS) and 10 being a medical scientist, my job is around a 2/3 on the BS Scale.

Last year I earned over £100K gross but the year before that about £55K. So not supercash but more than many far more important jobs pay.

Now, I am unemployed, not furloughed and unlikely to qualify for any financial support. I live in London and my outgoings are high, and currently, unchanged from when I was earning. If anything we are spending more on food....

I am a higher earner but nowhere near 150k - senior management in a biotech company that makes new cancer drugs. Not bullshitty in the least.
It look a long while to get here: STEM degree, Masters, PhD and 20+ years experience. 55-60 hour weeks are normal.

I run a high end antiques company. Antiques are not "necessary" for society but as 95% of my items go abroad I am one of those people who are generating wealth which comes into the country. Antiques are also the ultimate form of recycling as so much of what is produced today is flimsy rubbish and not intended to last.

I did not do any specific qualifications for my occupation although I am qualified to doctoral level in various fields. Like most dealers I began as a collector in my youth. I was lucky enough to inherit the entire contents of my grandmothers house, which gave me my start. I my line of work it is all experience, research and business acumen.
Personal contacts are also very important.

And yes, there is a certain amount of bull*t involved in buying and selling.

Investment banker, so generally considered a bullshit job. However, what I do is help FTSE 250 clients manage their exposure to interest rate risk.

For example, if Richard Branson managed to get his £500m loan from a bank, I'd help him ensure that as and when interest rates do go up, he is protected against that. My team also work with social housing and education clients where an increased interest cost would matter.

Clearly not in the scope of doctors, teachers etc when it comes to value to society, but I like to think we do have a role to play.

Masters degree, used to work in the financial sector. Specialised role, vital to my employer as it is a FCA requirement, and in theory the role can definitely add some value. On a daily basis however it felt like 99% of what I did was unimportant bs which nobody really needed - my time to shine was about once every quarter when I presented to the board of directors. My working days were boring.

Like some of the previous posters I do nonetheless feel that the good salary was justified, as it was an essential function with a lot of responsibility.

Mama, yes. Eg not that many mumsnetters would do what I did - work until I went into labour, 2 weeks of annual leave off (or a few days with the twins as I was self employed by then) and then back full time. I work on just about all days of the year 365 days a year, some busier than others for example, even on holidays abroad I will do at least an hours work at day. A client wanted me after 11pm one night this week (I was asleep) so I was dealing with their stuff the second I got up at 7am. Obviously lower earners work hard too - my son drives groceries for a living full time and does a shift from about 12.30pm full time. It is hard to compare jobs really sometimes. Clearly his career choice earns him less than his lawyer sisters and his working life is extremely simple and regular and anyone with a driving licence could do it.

• help make rich people richer. So very valuable and worthwhile. I have a client who is a billionaire, who told me that if it weren't for me, he'd probably have no more than £800m.

Made me feel all warm and fuzzy, you don't get that kind of satisfaction as a social worker, teacher or in the charity sector

If this is sarcasm I don't get it

I am not entirely sure what is the point of this thread. We need businesses to meet the demands of consumers and the economy. Profitable businesses can afford to pay their employees well (the gap between the CEO/executives and the rank & file employees who keep the business running in many banks/FTSE corporations is another subject, but on balance, even a young analyst in morgan stanley is paid well). I don't see anything wrong with people earning lots of money if they are not doing morally wrong and contributing their fair share of tax. . The UK should also have a sovereign wealth fund; if not we are literally always pouring the tax revenue into a bottomless pit.

How could I go from my job into one that pays more?
What would I have to do?

I don’t think I know any high earners in bullshit jobs. They’re all either business owners providing value to their customers and jobs to their employees or work in the service sector keeping our society functional (you can’t have prosperity without a decent legal system or a healthy finance sector for example) and big companies (which are important to providing goods and services as well as employment and training) flourishing.

Senior corporate comms. Right now my job is vital supporting key workers. Often it really isn't.

Not sure the original poster really has no ulterior motive. The thread is full of virtue signalling. Some people may earn lower basic salaries with better pensions, longer holidays, more allowance for sick days and no particular performance targets to reach in a role that may be virtually unsackable. Think millions of state/govt jobs. Running any kind of blog/cleb site/influencing is bullshit. Those running international businesses both selling and exporting for this country, not very bullshit but really hard work and not much security. Inventors - sometimes genius, other times failures. Musicians, artists, writers can be very successful or not but bullshit? Endeavour is a demanding path. It isn't for everyone. But success unrewarded? who does that suit exactly?

Please explain then: if a dr earns £100k from an NHS appointment, where does that money come from? The NHS costs around £140 billion each year. There has to be generation of wealth and employment elsewhere to pay for it. Or are you saying that the tax of 20 nurses pays for it? If so, where does their income come from?

If you had 100% state funded industry you just run it for your state. Sales go no further. The Chinese worked out that didn’t work.

Chemical engineer, I design and optimise process operations especially for overseas clients in a niche metallurgical field. My job helps set up process plants so countries rich in mineral deposits can process them and export them where they are needed (mainly platinum group metals) so that stuff will be use in computers, chips, cell phones, medical equipment and jewellery etc,.

It isn't bullshit in the way that it helps develop and grow local economies (have clients in Africa, South America, Australia and Asia) but it can be when you are helping certain countries who stockpile ore on the cheap from poorer countries and make astronomical profit. I genuinely find my job rewarding as I grew up on mines all over the world and saw how much the local economies depend on the mines and process plants so refurbishing or repurposing a disused plant or make a process more efficient has a tangible benefit I can actually see.

On the negative they are usually energy intensive and there is are challenges with pollution and contribution to climate change, but the technology is improving and there is often opportunities to do some really cool stuff to minimise impact. I love my job. Because I mainly work in design and travel for commissioning and optimisation, my work so far hasn't been impacted except for projects that will be postponed or have stalled but design continues

The only people that think anyone could earn 6 figures with hard work alone, is a bit thick.

I agree.

Someone above said £37k wasn't a lot for a senior engineer but to be fair I'm in Scotland where £37k is a pretty decent salary and I wasn't charterer, I did an apprenticeship and was only 5 years time served (26) so earning more than my peers.

Strangely enough I was also earning more than all of the people I qualified with who were still at engineer or associate level, even though I'd taken two maternity leaves in my career so was probably disadvantaged. I think that was kind of an example of hard work / commitment playing a major role as we were all educated to the same level, varied backgrounds but I was definitely the most working class. I did only take 3 months maternity leave after each child and gave my job 110%.

BUT I don't think "hard work" accounts for my success now.

I had the shittist of upbringings but I remember one thing my old grandpa said to me and that was "don't sell your time, sell products". Even when I worked for someone else and sold my time I always had a side hustle on the go to make more money. And then I got lucky that one of those side hustles really took off.

DP works in journalism which I'm sure 99% of you think is a BS job. He earns roughly the same as his best mate who is a hospital consultant. DP's job brings pleasure to many as people are always coming up to talk to him about it. Music, art, sport, they all add to our lives.

I also work in journalism but I'm not on six figures - DP has a few years on me tho so fingers crossed.