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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Zoom ettiquiete

134 replies

fuckinghellthisshit · 08/04/2020 11:53

I do a few hours of maths tuition a week as a volunteer working with looked after children. Since lockdown I have been doing this via Zoom.

One of the foster carers has been recording the sessions and told me this was to share with her own children which I wasn't keen on but didn't object to. I have now found out that her sister who runs a big scale tutoring business is sending these videos out as part of her weekly work pack for which she charges £30 (they get a class lesson as well).

AIBU to think this is not ok and they should have asked? When I questioned her I was told 'we're all in the same boat and need to help each other'. I have had to shut my business and have no income at present so I whilst I happy to volunteer and help vulnerable students I do not want to be creating content for a private business to use for free. AIBU?

OP posts:
SpokeTooSoon · 08/04/2020 12:35

I do a few hours of maths tuition a week as a volunteer working with looked after children

Is this separate from their normal schooling? Who pays you? Who has authorised you to continue the lessons via zoom? The local authority?

steppemum · 08/04/2020 12:37

make up a large card showed at the beginning & tell her she does not have your permission

Oh yes, have a card next to you in all videos saying - this video is for use by permission only. No permission has been givne to Ms YYY.

SpokeTooSoon · 08/04/2020 12:37

Which LEA have you agreed it with because I’m starting to think this would not be allowed with children in a protected group.

Surely only their teachers would engage with this level of private virtual teaching - in the Easter holidays especially.

Are you on the level here OP?

Hollyhead · 08/04/2020 12:38

No no and no again - she's violating GDPR and Copyright law.

sonjadog · 08/04/2020 12:39

Put up a card saying that you do private tuition, here is your number, you do not give permission for this video to be used by others, on your screen.

admission · 08/04/2020 12:40

Ignore the ethics of what has been happening but focus on the child protection issues here. The foster carer has been recording the lesson so it presumably has on the recording the faces etc of looked after children. That in its own right is questionable without your express permission to tape and the specific approval of the "parents" of the looked after children, who is in effect the Local Authority.
To then be passing the recording onto sister who is then sending the recording out all over the place is a significant child protection issue, as well as a data breach. The children involved are looked after children for very specific reasons and are the most vulnerable of children and should be being protected. As a carer they should be fully aware of the vulnerability of these kids.
For your own protection you need to send this person an email saying that having become aware of what she is doing you demand that she stops with immediate effect. You also need to say that you have reported the situation to the Local Authority Designated Officer (LADO). You then immediately need to talk to the LADO or whoever carries that responsibility at this time in the Local Authority and let them move forward to sort out this major child protection breach.

BraveLittleDragon · 08/04/2020 12:40

Definitely violation.

Are the children identifiable in it via the video recording - if so this is also probably illegal (when I record zoom videos, it shows the others in there). We have to get expressed consent and state how we are storing it and for how long, as well as what purposes the video would be revisited / reviewed.

Original poster
fuckinghellthisshit · 08/04/2020 12:41

I would never under any circumstances record any child or share any image. My main work is with victims of CSE so I fully aware of all safeguarding risks. I am not good with technology thou and it has been a steep learning curve. The sections she has shared are my 'explanations' and do not feature the looked after child, so about 20 mins of the 1hr session have been shared.

Thanks for the advice, the foster carer seems highly competent and has been fostering for over 20 years but I haven't met her sister.
It's such a shame if I stop volunteering.

OP posts:
notalwaysalondoner · 08/04/2020 12:41

Not ok, and it’s illegal in the uk to record anyone without informing them at the start of the recording, and illegal to distribute their image (for profit) without permission.

HermanHermit · 08/04/2020 12:41

I would try using your author’s and oerformer’s rights as author of the content and performer within the recording. Nobody is permitted to make a recording of your performance without your express consent. Damages would start with the full commercial value they’ve extracted from recording your performance and move up from there.

lostfrequencies · 08/04/2020 12:42

How did you find out?

Original poster
fuckinghellthisshit · 08/04/2020 12:43

Yes, separate to normal schooling, arranged and facilitated by the schools normally - I have a huge waiting list. I have been asked to continue support by the LEA.

OP posts:
notalwaysalondoner · 08/04/2020 12:43

I’d just tell them explicitly “You do not have my permission to record or distribute my videos in any form following my discovery that you have been circulating them beyond your own personal use. Please immediately delete all videos featuring me and ensure your sister does the same and no longer distributes them, as it is illegal to distribute my image without my permission which was never granted”

Original poster
fuckinghellthisshit · 08/04/2020 12:44

I found out because one of my sons friends uses the tutorial service, he sent it to my son asking if I was working for them now.

OP posts:
worriedmama1980 · 08/04/2020 12:49

At a minimum, send them an email - the paid for tutoring service- saying you want to see their GDPR policy as you believe there has been a breach.

State your content has been shared in breach of contract and against your wishes, and you expect a response from them.

When they reply, tell them you have not given consent, expect payment for the content already shared, and a written explanation of how throw has happened.

Are you sure there is no voice recording of the student, if it's 20 minutes is there no point at which they have asked a question or similar? Because I really do think you need to raise this with the LEA if they are facilitating this arrangement and have asked you to do it remotely for now. And I really would stop engaging with that student and foster mother. I actually think you're down playing how bad this is.

Gemma2019 · 08/04/2020 12:49

Why are you even doing free tutoring for her foster children if her sister runs a big scale tutoring business? Why isn't her sister doing the free tutoring? That's what she will have to do now when you tell her you can no longer do the sessions. I wouldn't even trust her if the recording is switched off on zoom, as it's just as easy to film it with a phone.

DrierThanANunsNasty · 08/04/2020 12:49

Wow, this is ultimate CFery. If it was something like an open YouTube video, fine, as it’s just a link to a resource.

However, this is a private session and you are well within your rights to kick up a massive fuss. I’d be demanding a percentage of their profits if I’m honest!

JustinOtherdad · 08/04/2020 12:53

This would be theft of intellectual property, breach of copyright, unauthorised use of your image (if you're visible) and quite probably a child protection issue.

You need to request that she stops using these immediately and removes any of your created content from anything she is or has sent out. You should also send her an invoice for the creation and use of your content that she has profited from. Your Zoom work is not in the public domain and she has no right to use it free of charge for her own profit.

How many people has she sent this to at £30 a time, and how many times?

A copyright lawyer would have a field day with this!

Appuskidu · 08/04/2020 12:54

This is dreadful!

OoohTheStatsDontLie · 08/04/2020 12:56

Ask for a contribution towards your salary since we're all in this together and need to help each other!

tribpot · 08/04/2020 12:58

I think it would be fairly easy to prevent this happening again. If you host the Zoom meeting you can control who can record it (i.e. no-one) - some info here. However, I would certainly be reporting this to the Local Authority - just because the video you have seen doesn't have the looked after child in it, she could make a mistake and release another that did.

I would definitely make clear you do not give permission for any video to be distributed, and would be tempted to follow up with a cease and desist letter. It is outrageous that she would think this was okay.

Btw I record a work meeting we do once every two weeks, where we demo new features of the software. Recording it means people who aren't able to attend can watch it later. I always ask for consent before I start the recording, even though I've been doing this for a year (to the same audience every time).

AmelieTaylor · 08/04/2020 12:59

200 votes 100% YANBU. that should tell you all you need to know. Take whatever action you can.

MyOwnSummer · 08/04/2020 13:01

oh my days... OP I mean this in the nicest way, but why the fuck are you even asking us? Talk to a solicitor and sue the living daylights out of them. They are very clearly in the wrong here.

Casablanca78 · 08/04/2020 13:02

Absolutely unacceptable and she is a CF.
I'd make a sign and have it visible in all future calls advising such.

Original poster
fuckinghellthisshit · 08/04/2020 13:02

I'm being deliberately vague about the fostering set up/LEA to avoid any chance of outing the family, so apologies I can't be more specific.
It's maths GCSE work so I do a demo at the beginning with explanations and a whiteboard and then we do exercises together.
It'd be a great shame to stop as this student is keen to be an accountant and has the ability, but poor concentration and low self esteem. I have links to a company offering work experience etc and would like to help him - he deserves support. I am working with 2 others in this way and it's going well - except the videoing!
What I offer is 1:1 focused very specifically on academically mentoring a child for 2-3 years, the tutor does not offer anything like this and her group sessions would not engage them, unfortunately.

OP posts: