that this whole crisis shows that EVERYONE ought to learn how to use technology?

[WhatTheHellHappenedArgh]

Just that really. I have divorced grandparents, both in their 80s. My gran uses whatsapp, shops online, has a laptop, has broadband internet. Obviously it's shitty for her not being able to go out right now but she was able to get all her shopping delivered no bother, can chat to us on skype/facetime, can use social media etc. So it has massively helped with her loneliness.

My grandfather, OTOH, who has a long term respiratory problem, has point blank refused to ever have the internet, learn how to use a mobile phone etc. With the result that he's now feeling extremely lonely and cut off from the rest of the world and we don't live anywhere near him so are unable to offer any practical help. Have to rely on volunteers which he hates and because he had no online shopping accounts we were unable to get him any slots at all.

I see it frequently on here that "old" people don't know how to use the internet, can't online shop etc, and my question is why? Isn't it incredibly patronising to assume they're incapable of doing and learning any of the above? And wouldn't have been so much better for them, in the middle of this current shower of shit, if they could?

Definitely not unreasonable but many, in order to become proficient, need to start before their 80s.

My mum tried in her 80s but learned things by rote so that if she got mixed up the computer did something wrong, she was stuck.

My aunt also wanted me to teach her, in her 80s, she struggled to focus for long enough to do anything meaningful and it was as though it was new to her every week she had her lesson. However, another aunt used hers well into her 90s but had started much earlier.

I don’t think people necessarily assume old people can’t use the internet and all that you mentioned but sometimes, as in the case of your granddad, they just don’t want to or are intimidated to. And you can’t teach someone something if they refuse to learn or listen.

Can't you do the order & get it delivered to his address?

I agree that it would be better if they did. A relative of mine informed me the other day that she and her husband have taken £1k cash out and are keeping it at home to pay tradesmen, deliveries etc during the lockdown. They don’t use online banking because it isn’t safe... I’d feel much better if they had no choice, I think they’re so vulnerable with all that cash sitting around.

In an ideal world, yes, but if people haven’t every used tech before, say in their work life, then they don’t know how to do ANY of it, and it just feels huge and scary. My mum is only 72, but she’s never used a computer or had email on her phone. . She was a teacher, but retired about 20 years ago, before tech was routinely used in the classroom.

I agree.

This isn't just older people though. I see number of posts on forums like this from posters who think they are morally superior by not using Facebook or other social media platforms.

Our local community Facebook pages are an absolute mine of information. They say which shops are open when, which places have closed, which local companies will deliver etc. There is also another forum where people can offer their services to help those who are unable go shopping themselves.

I have seen posts from mumsnetters who are stuck at home due to self isolation and don't know anyone who can shop for them. The answer is get on to Facebook and register with the local community pages.

My SIL won't use social media and is getting more and more isolated because of this. She is under 70 and knows how to use a computer. I offered to get her sorted out with Skype, but she won't consider it. Now she won't see her granddaughter for ages.

All of my department are working from home now. We had a "meeting" on Teams this morning. DH and I planning on doing an online quiz night for DD and her friends as they used to go to one every week while at university.

Modern technology opens a whole new world, but people need to understand how they can make it work for them.

I agree.

Technological illiteracy in the year 2020 is essentially a choice to be ignorant. They’ve had 20 years to learn.

My parents are in their 70s and can shop online, make FaceTime calls etc.

I'm not voting either way. YANBU to say older people should be familiar with tech. However I've noticed men especially of a certain age (late sixties onwards) who relied on secretaries to deal with tech are at a disadvantage, as are those of both sexes whose lives and work hardly involved tech at all.

YABU on other grounds. Eyesight, lack of dexterity, rheumatism, Parkinson's etc all make it harder for even tech savvy people to use tech. You get tech fear as well - many applications are over complicated. Anyone selling a pc package where people could switch on and just touch screen to have email/skype or similar/newsfeed would make a fortune. A phone with large buttons with switch on/facetime/access photos ditto. With an interactive system saying YOUR BATTERY IS DOWN, CHARGE IT or YOU NEED TO PRESS THIS BUTON TO RESTORE SOUND or PRESS HERE TO ENLARGE THE PRINT.

There's also the rarity of good tech teachers - I've been using computers, even tailoring software and teaching people to use specific applications since the eighties/nineties, mobiles since the early brick. BUT I know I'm not a great teacher any more since I forget how little non-tech people my age know and skip steps and get impatient. And my DC get impatient with me since I now know less than them.

My gran who died at 85, 5 years ago, had severe osteoporosis and she had the latest iPhone, a laptop, printer, digital camera... the works. She even had a tamagotchi back when they came out in the 90's. Did all her own shopping online, used to play scrabble online and communicated with friends and family on facebook. Nobody really taught her except us giving her pointers from time to time when we came over. Despite severe osteoporosis she remained fully independent till she died.

Whereas my OH's gran who has only just turned 80 this year and is completely able bodied cant work even a simple mobile phone and makes no effort to learn.

Theres no excuse, you are never too old to learn. There is only willingness and having motivation to move with the times.

Theres no excuse, you are never too old to learn. There is only willingness and having motivation to move with the times.

And you need money, and it helps if you have someone to help you out.

My DGM never really got the hang of computers/tech, despite our best efforts to encourage her. It just wasn't how her brain worked, she struggled with touch screens even. Not everyone is the same, and she wasn't against the idea like DHs DGF, she just didn't get it no matter how hard she tried.

My FIL has just loaded up Zoom on his Chromebook. He is early 70s. We got him a Chromebook years ago as it is so easy, no viruses, updates in seconds. Not complicated at all.

We talked him through it on his mobile. We used Microsoft Teams to have a virtual birthday get together for a friend. Was great to all be there together, and seeing each other.

My Dad is almost 80 and has an iphone. He does struggle but that is nothing to do with his age and more to do with his personality

But being able to access so much information online from opening times of shops, local support for those in isolation not to mention online shopping (when available) even click and collect, YouTube and if you fork for it Netflix or Amazon Prime for an absolute wealth of films, series, documentaries, stuff for fun, stuff to educate.

We had our Aunt and Uncle here at Christmas, they are in their late 60s and they were telling us about a train trip they had been on across Europe, we were able to find a YouTube video of the same trip, their minds were blown! They have basic mobile phones but that is it. No other tech, no car, rely on buses. But my Uncle has an encyclopedic knowledge of bus and train times

Yes. There was a story I read a while back about someone's elderly dad who fell at home and couldn't get up. He used his Amazon dot or similar to ring his family. He wasn't due any visitors for 5 days or so, this tech probably saved his life.

I she family in 70s and 80s who have no issue with tech... on the other side have a friend in her mid forties who couldn’t understand how to download an app and run it yesterday. I do think sometimes the ignorance is wilful.

Dad is 76 and has never bothered with the internet before. He's now getting to grips with an iPhone my Dbro gave him. Hopefully we'll get him on further than that.

I wouldn’t bother with tech if I didn’t have to. I buy groceries on line because I don’t have a car. Books and clothes the same. No Facebook or anything else. I text my kids and come on here. This is the only thing I do that I don’t have to.

Why Lllot5?

Even my MIL, who is only early 60s for crying out loud, won't even contemplate a mobile phone. It is biting her on the bum now because she has to self isolate due to an underlying condition and she is incredibly bored.

And I can't order his groceries for him and have them delivered because I cannot get a slot now. I started warning him about this a good 6/7 weeks ago and begged him to let me sign him up for online shopping so we could book his slots in advance. Did he listen - did he fuck.

@Ginfordinner I don't use facebook or social media due to privacy issues. I also have never posted my children on the internet. Once again for privacy issues. Nothing good comes from facebook. Nothing but drama. Be careful about posting needs etc on Facebook. This situation is the perfect breeding ground for criminals especially thieves

You can’t force somebody though, can you. And some people can’t afford much technology, or prioritise other things. I have an iPad now, but it was given to me by a relative when they no longer needed it. I have a smart phone which was also given to me and my parents have given me their laptop so that my son can do his schoolwork. My phone is slow and old but I can’t justify an upgrade when I can still use the basic functions. I am quite young but it means that I’m often out of touch with newer technology because I can’t afford to buy it.

However, if money is not a problem then yes, I think it’s a life skill. My husband’s nan is ninety and still very independent. She has a smart phone, a tablet and uses social media sites to stay in touch with relatives who don’t live near. She has a smart doorbell so she can see who is at the door and now has an Alexa which she can use for all sorts of things. She has sometimes taken a little while to pick things up but doesn’t like having to rely on other people so perseveres until she knows how to do the things she needs. She is very up to date and knowledgeable about current events despite not getting out much anymore.

@Ginfordinner simply not interested.
Alexa shouldn’t work unless you say please instead of just barking orders.
I just don’t understand the fascination.

@Ginfordinner I don't use facebook or social media due to privacy issues. I also have never posted my children on the internet. Once again for privacy issues. Nothing good comes from facebook. Nothing but drama. Be careful about posting needs etc on Facebook. This situation is the perfect breeding ground for criminals especially thieves

You can open an account with Facebook, set your privacy to the highest settings, post nothing on it and have no "friends" on it just so that you can access loads of information about what is happening in the community.

I don't understand where you get the idea that having a Facebook account allows thieves to find your house if you don't post anything on it. In any case FB doesn't ask for your address. This is what your Facebook account would look like if you do the above.

I don't post any pictures of DD on my account BTW.

@Ginfordinner...There are plenty of ways to find out reliable information of what is going on in your community. Such as online newspaper,school,police department and county websites. There is too much misinfo being bandied aboit on Facebook. My main concern now is even on this thread that people say post on your community facebook page to ask for help when you or your family members are vulnerable. You are advertising to the whole community that you and your loved ones are vulnerable. As the economy goes further in the toilet people will get more and more desperate and now the most vulnerable are at risk from people meaning to do harm. You are advertising that you are unable to care for yourself and have no family to check in on you. That is putting yourself and your loved ones in danger

@Leaannb- Used in the right way Facebook and other social media can be a great way to help feel connected and part of the community. A lot of good can and does come from it!

My mum (82) used to email, Facebook and shop on line but she has early stage dementia and now finds it confusing. TBH her saying that they are making these things more complicated was the first sign.

Such as online newspaper,school,police department and county websites.

Sorry but you will get absolutely nothing useful out of the aforementioed places. There is an army of volunteers in my local area delivering food, medicine and other basic supplies to those who are self isolating for whatever reason. You wouldn't know they existed if you weren't on facebook.

BTW, money is not an issue, he has loads of it.