20 years ago. Was this abuse or just children experimenting?

[Ncsecond]

AIBU - for traffic (and because I don’t know where to put it)

I’m 30 year old female, and for some reason I keep having a niggling feeling that I should tell someone about what used to happen.

Myself and my siblings used to spend the odd weekend night with my grandparents. Up until we were teenagers I imagine. My gps also used to look after our two cousins. The oldest girl cousin who would have been about 12/13/14 (5 years older than me) used to always wait until no one was around and ask me to get under the duvet with her and kiss me properly, like tongues and grinding on me. She used to touch me and I remember finding it very strange but weirdly (and I think this is where it seems like abuse to me) I have shame and embarrassment that I enjoyed it as it was our little secret. I think it was because she was the oldest and coolest and I wanted her attention. I would have been around 7. I distinctively remember my sister who was younger occasionally catching us under the sheets and us denying anything. I wonder if I asked my sister now; she would remember it?
She is estranged from her parents now (not really sure why) we have always just been told “it’s because she’s difficult and doesn’t want to know us” but whenever I go to my gps and they bring her up I get a horrible feeling and it’s got worse. This must have been 20 years ago now, but I wonder whether I should tell someone?
I’ve obviously got on with my life and it’s not bothered me massively, just now i’m an adult and have children of my own i’m starting to question it more. Was she being abused herself? Was she just experimenting? I have no idea why she doesn’t speak to any of her family now and I just hope to god it’s nothing to do with her childhood.
I guess what i’m asking Aibu, is if I should reach out and ask her? Or do I just let it go and try and forget?

I remember reading somewhere that is much more likely in the case of children abusing other children that they were abused themselves

General consensus, last time I checked, was that it's more likely. But that it is still often not the case. Certainly nowhere near often enough to say "Its not normal play so your cousin was abused" or "It certainly seems likely your cousin was being abused"

and you really think a 12 year old doesnt understand that they are taking advantage of the younger child??

Still a child herself though. She's probably feeling horrified and ashamed herself now.

As far as we know she was just exploring her nascent sexuality with a family member she felt comfortable with

What the fuck

There was a case recently where a retired man was jailed for things he did to his slightly younger sister when he was about 13 or 14 back in the 1960s, so the authorities will still take it seriously.

You must do what feels right for you.

I also had a similar experience i have never forgotten. Older neighbour, me probably 8 her probably 11 or 12 asking us to each take turns in kissing the other ones in the pubic area with pants down.

I always put it down to experimentation, but the fact that i have never forgotten it and how grim it felt suggests it was abuse. Who knows what the other girl had either been through or was going through. I remember her parents being divorced, that’s all.

Hey OP,
I had similar experiences as a child with a relative with a similar age gap.

We are not estranged and I reached a point where I was able to move past it. I have never told anyone and never will. I thought about it at times, especially as a teenager but always felt that the damage it would cause to my family and me would be too much.

30 years on, I am glad I never said anything. The relative and I have never openly discussed it but I am comfortable that he realises what he did was wrong. I was the only female relative at the time so I don't think anyone else was affected.

Whatever you do now has to be about what is best for you. Because she is already estranged from your family, you may feel you are best served telling someone. You don't have to tell everyone. Maybe one person in your family would help validate your experience.

Regardless of her intention, she abused you. It doesn't automatically mean she was an evil, predatory person, but there is no doubt that you were a victim of abuse.

You may find that acknowledging this may be enough for you but you should do what you need to in order to help you move on.

Just to remind posters that not everyone lurking here has good intentions and describing your experiences of abuse may not be something you wish to do in detail.

I hope you can come to terms with what's happened in your past, OP. Whether it's abuse or not, if it's something that affects you, you deserve to feel better and seek any support you need.

OP, you sound like you are very confused. I would be too, my head would be spinning.

It’s very easy to sit behind a keyboard and screen and throw out advice like “go to the police”, “tell everyone in your family” and “LTB” posts from people without them even thinking of the consequence it would cause not only you but your family unit as a whole. I’m not trying to downplay what happened but reading back it might come across like that (please, do NOT think I mean it like that) but from your subsequent replies it sounds like you don’t know exactly what happened.

Could her mum (my mums sister), have known and taken the abusers side for example? I don’t know what to do. If anything

This is what I meant in the above paragraph. You’ve taken something abusive that happened to you as a child (even though you were both children at the time) and now questioning whether your auntie was effectively an enabler for her daughters maybe abuser that you don’t know the name of. That’s a whopping accusation to say about someone, if you did decide to bring it up.

I don’t know, I’m just as confused as you are. I feel sympathy for you and hope you can deal with it in the best way you choose that will be most beneficial to you. I feel a bit crap saying it and don’t want it to come across like “just forget about it” because I find those sorts of comments abhorrent. But your posts come across like you don’t know exactly what happened, you’re not sure whether it could be turned against you for leading her on (I wouldn’t believe that personally) and that your cousin could have been abused herself and her own mother was in on it but turned a blind eye.

It could all work out brilliantly in the end, it could turn out catastrophically by the end, or it could remain the same and you’d be none the wiser and (probably) feeling worse. It’s really hard. I haven’t voted on the poll as I don’t feel there’s any right answer.

I think you should definitely talk, to someone one-to-one or even people on here, to vent and rant, to seek advice, to get help, to get cheered up, etc. I honestly hope you get the resolution you want and need. Sorry I can’t be more help.

I would have thought this sort of experimentation in a family setting would have been long over with by the age of 12, let alone older, when it's more about looking outward/peers taking centre stage etc. So in my opinion this is not alright or something to hand wave away.

It's not like two five year olds being curious or a couple of toddlers in the bath.

I can understand why you're unsettled by it.

Not sure where you go with it. She would have been a minor, even one who should have known better. Doesn't help you much or mean that it's right. Plenty of horrible things have been done to children by children. I imagine this is a specific type of trauma and hopefully a counsellor can offer guidance about where you go next.

I've put YANBU because you could reach out to someone, but not to her.

She's hardly going to admit that she abused you. Probably she'll say she can't remember/ it didn't happen.

A lot of cousins get off with each other, but that's a big age difference at that age and you were a young child. I'd say that's abuse, and that you feel uncomfortable about it suggests that, too.

That other people aren't speaking to her suggests she's bad news in general. You could chat to other family members and find out why some people don't speak to her? I wouldn't necessarily tell any of them until you find out the lay of the land- who really doesn't get on with her, who you can safely confide in etc.

If you feel it'd be beneficial, you could seek counselling. xxx

@BearimyJeremy I've know a fair few people at around age 15 or whatever have fancied or got off with cousins. But they were similar ages.

And people can be sexually assaulted at any age anyway, I suppose. When I was 15 a 16 year old boy got off with me. I consider it to have been abuse really as it wasn't something I planned on, and I was very innocent/ignorant.

Blimey just because you're NC with your family doesn't make you bad news.

I would have thought this sort of experimentation in a family setting would have been long over with by the age of 12, let alone older, when it's more about looking outward/peers taking centre stage etc. So in my opinion this is not alright or something to hand wave away.

Given the ages this would have taken place in early 2000s. A lot has happened and moved forward towards LGBT in the last 20 years. I know the OP mentioned the cousins boyfriend in one post but if she was sexually attracted to females as well, the year 2000 wasn’t really that open for gay people... But, AGAIN, I’m not condoning it and I hate that both my posts so far come across like they are, but i don’t believe it’s as easy to dismiss everything straight away in such black and white terms when there could be so many more factors at play at the time and posters are keen to put forward what they would do. Maybe that’s just par for the course for AIBU but this isn’t something that can be decided on a random Internet forum IMO.

OP, please talk to someone, even if anonymously

When I was 6, I vividly remember my elder brother (dads child, not mums) who would have been 11/12 demanding to play hide and seek where he would feel my private parts. I felt sick.

Every time we would go our cousins, (me being the only female thank god) my older cousin would trap me on the floor and try to grind on me. my parents divorced shortly after so I never had to deal with them again.

I can hardly remember the good parts of my childhood, but these memories are as if it happened yesterday.

My husband, also confided in me, that when he was around 5-10 an older teenager female cousin used to make him kiss her private parts.

It seems like this happens a lot. it is not normal however, I believe our parents should have been supervising us a lot more, but no they just trusted because they are "family" its recently come to light, my 16 year old male cousin has been abusing his sisters, (11 && 14), When I confided in my mother what happened, I got responded with
" why didn't you speak up then?"

I would recommend going to therapy, because I think I will start because my abuse combined with other childhood traumas, is really starting to affect me now that Im a mother myself.

I hope you find peace, but it probably won't come from family.

where a retired man was jailed for things he did to his slightly younger sister when he was about 13 or 14 back in the 1960s
are you sure that was all there was too it, I'm not trying to defend him at all but I'm surprised that there was a conviction based on what he did at that age, were there other attacks when he was of adult age do you know?

@5sugarsplease what you just said about not remembering anything else from your childhood is hitting me like a tone of bricks. This has become a long running joke with my family about how I don’t remember any of my childhood. It’s because of this isn’t it?! Ffs i’m absolutely sure of it now. I could tell you about this for sure but have forgotten everything else; even school friends etc.

Just checked with my mum. There is actually 6 and a half years difference between us. It’s getting more and more disgusting the more I think about it.

How many years did she do this, OP?

Reading through this all. Even if I do nothing and just let it lie, i’m so grateful that I have at least aired it here. I’m going to take advice and see someone. Isn’t it terrifying that so many of us have similar stories?? Hold on to your kids tight as it really is a scary world

I think it is generally considered to be abuse rather than 'experimentation' if the age gap is more than 5 years, i think I got that from this org, or something similar
napac.org.uk/

@annamie this is where i’m now more confused. Just casually asked my mum our age difference, she said 6/7 years. I know that we never went once we went to big school so must have been for a few years when I was at primary. I know I wasn’t old enough to say no and I was very confident so must have been around 7-10

Would you consider having some talking therapy about this? I’m just wondering if you unpack your feelings around this with a professional you might be able to process things before you decide if you want to bury it or open up about it. You might be able to remember more about your child hood too.

So when you were 10 and she was 16 and a half she was still doing it to you . I’m sorry to say that I don’t think that’s experimentation.

You owe her nothing OP. Please do what’s best for you and talk to whoever you want to.

Have been in a sort of similar position but much smaller age gap . There was never any physical touching or forcing though but a complete lack of boundaries beyond what should exist (masturbating in the same room) .

I understand now that sexual abuse was behind it .

I’ve never been able to discuss it with anyone .

If you can talk to someone confidentially I’d do that .