To despair at the growing level of racism and xenophobia in this country?

[AlexaShutUp]

I have just been told by the security guard at my local shop that the coronavirus is a "good thing" because it will stop people from traveling and it will therefore "keep them foreigners out". I am ashamed to say that I couldn't think of a good response quickly enough, and just muttered something disapproving but pretty incoherent back to him. Have so many much better responses going round in my head now, and I am annoyed that I didn't challenge him in a more articulate manner.

I know that there have always been racists and xenophobes, but I'm sure that there was a time when such hideous views would not have been expressed to a stranger in public. Over the last few years, it seems that there have been more and more comments of this nature, and it makes me so sad to see the ignorant, unwelcoming little nation we have become.

What sort of fuckwit thinks that a global pandemic is good news? And what sort of society makes people think it's ok to voice such opinions?

That is great @AlexaShutUp, and it is great that you are on here challenging racism

@AlexaShutUp would you like to share any things that were said to your DH/ child?

Homophobia also seems to be increasing :-(

Methods for recording racially motivated/aggravated attacks have changed over the years. The category of "hate incidents" has been included fairly recently. So even statistics won't tell you the truth.

I agree that the atmosphere seems more hostile but is it really? A lot of that perception is probably due to pessimism about Brexit. I can remember the 70s and 80s when there was open support for and violent intimidation by NF, blatantly so, on streets and in social situations. Police were openly racist also. I mean they are now still, but back then they were even more so. So I dunno.

Obviously right to reside is the big change and clearly people affected by it are targeted but others who are also not British will ultimately benefit - there's always winners and losers when there are changes to immigration laws.

Thanks angel. What's fascinating to me is how many people have come on the thread to insist that I've made it up. It doesn't really matter if they believe it or not, but it's an interesting insight into the way that people deal with information that they don't like. It's actually a little worrying that people can be so sure that something didn't happen when they weren't there to witness it.

@AlexaShutUp I actually posted a thread last year about a racist incident that I witnessed.

I also had numerous people saying that I made it up.

It tells you alot about society. I think the people that say "we made it up" are exactly the people that would be quite happy for racism to continue, because it benefits them. Ignore those people.

@ginghambox did you forget that personal insults are not allowed?

Angel, my DH has has all sorts, some subtle and some blatant. I don't care to repeat what was said tbh, but you can probably imagine the kind of thing. Right outside our house on one occasion, which was upsetting, and then the guy pissed in our front garden.

In addition to the racist slurs, he also gets a fair bit of Islamophobic abuse. He isn't actually Muslim, but he is South Asian, so I think people sometimes make assumptions.

Thankfully, dd hasn't had to deal with much stuff directed towards her - people don't always realise that she is mixed race - but she has a couple of friends in school who have had some really nasty stuff said to them. Again, I don't want to repeat it.

I do think British people have had this over inflated sense of self stemming from the days of the Empire. (I am white British.) However we were moving to being very tolerant but that tolerance was pushed to the limits because of the massive waves of immigration for cheap labour in areas like Boston, completely changing the demographics over a short period of time. Or asian no go areas in some parts of London and the north. There is the lack of assimilation too.

Also there is a crime epidemic like asian grooming gangs, or drug cartels. Or county line gangs. Muggers. You only have to look at newspaper crime reporting and the names tell you that there is a problem with immigrant crime. I know that is not a popular view on here, but it is realistic. I also know that we have our own grown criminals but lately most of the crimes seem to be committed by certain sections of the community. Or some communities bring their disputes from their own countries over here and carry on the fight here. And then we have all the recent terror attacks showing quite high levels of barbarity. Or acid throwing, a recent import. The demographics of this country is changing rapidly at a pace that most people were not happy with, but were not allowed to vocalise.

I live in an area with wealthy Indians, they are very vocal about stopping immigration themselves. Other communities work hard, get educated etc but some come here and want to live in the same way they did in their own countries with their own ways and laws. No person in their right mind would see anything wrong with someone who came to live in this country to work hard and contribute. But lots seem to want to live a life of crime.

We are told that we have benefitted from immigration in this country, but it has come at a cost. Nobody wants to be a closed off island, but nor do we want to be a welcome mat which people wipe their boots on.

I do fear that BREXIT has allowed racism to rise. Any debate around immigration was shut down before then so now you see lots of years of resentments coming through now. Shutting down the conversation around immigration over the last few years has meant that now the opportunity is here, it is all being unleashed all at once. However, I do think it will settle down.

make that 4. copy and paste .

OldHarrys, I'm sure you're right about the 1970s/1980s. I was a child in those days and blissfully unaware. I guess I'm talking about the last 25-30 years at most. It might just be my perception, but it really does feel like a more hostile environment right now.

That was a very well thought out post @Sarcelle.

I agree that many of us had an over inflated ego. I also agree that we should be able to have control over immigration to the U.K. That control over immigration, is important to be able to run efficiently as a country.

I also completely disagree with racism thrown at anybody.

Well, the U.K. as a country - we are stepping into a new future. We can only improve I hope

Homophobia also seems to be increasing I think hate is general is increasing, racism, xenophobia, homophobia, youth stabbings, sexual assaults, home invasions, people say the world is no more dangerous than before, On a day to day basis I believe it is far worse.

That was a very well thought out post @Sarcelle.

Well thought out? It's full of idiotic crap that isn't even worth disputing.

@linoventura I meant well thought out, in that she tried to look at it from both sides.

@LinoVentura I agree with some of her points, that we have an inflated sense of ego, and tha Brexit has caused racism to rise.

I don't agree with the rest of what she said, but coming from the viewpoint that she is at, I liked that she tried to see the other aode; that we do have an ego problem, and that racism is on the rise.

If that makes sense.

*see the other side

@Patroclus

Thank you, you've saved me a job.
This thread is proving it's own point.
Why on earth would OP make that story up?

Look at the facebook posts on the dark tone plasters tonight - full of white people saying 'what a waste of time' etc.

Brexit absolutely has a lot to answer for - it's not easy to have nationalism without it's nasty little friend xenophobia. The misinformation and myths peddled by the right-wing tabloids about 'floods' of immigrants - all deflecting from the real reasons our services are struggling which is austerity budgets. And if I hear one more person say that's due to Labour I will FUCKING SCREAM BECAUSE ANY GOVERNMENT WOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE SAME POSITION IT WAS A GLOBAL BANKING CRISIS...and breathe.

To give just one fiscal spending example: the UK spends slightly more than Romania on age-related public spending - and half of the average for the EU. Are floods of ancient Poles tottering round on zimmer frames? Are the geriatric beds in hospitals and care homes jammed full of Romanians with broken hips? I think not.

I work in retail. I work with many eastern Europeans who have a work ethic that put many of our natives to shame. Shortly after six am every day I see east Europeans doing their food shopping, maybe on their way home from a night shift. They are clean, quiet and polite. They are not shopping in grubby tracksuits, leggings or (and I see this last surprisingly often, always British people) pyjamas.

Very likely, people all over the world have an innate tendency to be racist. I do think the majority of people in this country are kind to foreigners. God knows, our economy depends on them for tourism enough. But the Brexit nationalistic spirit seems to have given, shall we say, the less 'woke' among us permission to speak their nasty little minds more freely in the misguided belief that they are flying a flag.

I also despise the fact that woke is being used as an insult - surely it should be an aspiration tor rise above political incorrectness?

@contentedsoul

There is little point in replying, Everything I say is twisted out of context Judging by your comments on the freedom of movement thread I don't think anyone is twisting your words, it is very clear how you feel. Your comment was charming on elderly expats who paid tax and probably fought for your Great British empire.

Also there is a crime epidemic like asian grooming gangs, or drug cartels. Or county line gangs. Muggers. You only have to look at newspaper crime reporting and the names tell you that there is a problem with immigrant crime...lately most of the crimes seem to be committed by certain sections of the community.

Hmm. I wonder what papers this is in? Words like 'epidemic' are highly inflammatory. Media content is determined by what the paper wants published, and the majority of the papers are owned by people who support Brexit. For example, many more people die each year in the UK from domestic violence than from terrorism. Big fuss in the papers - no.
IF it is in fact true (I don't know either way) disproportionately committed by ethnic minorities, what is true is that ethnic minorities are less likely to have had good educational experiences and more likely to be impacted by economic difficulties, both of which are sociologically linked with crime. To blame it on the very nature of being from a different race, that is racist and xenophobic.

I don’t think it’s necessarily about racism in isolation, I think that a lot of people have an arguably misconception that they come here to take advantage of our welfare state and nhs.