To despair at the growing level of racism and xenophobia in this country?

[AlexaShutUp]

I have just been told by the security guard at my local shop that the coronavirus is a "good thing" because it will stop people from traveling and it will therefore "keep them foreigners out". I am ashamed to say that I couldn't think of a good response quickly enough, and just muttered something disapproving but pretty incoherent back to him. Have so many much better responses going round in my head now, and I am annoyed that I didn't challenge him in a more articulate manner.

I know that there have always been racists and xenophobes, but I'm sure that there was a time when such hideous views would not have been expressed to a stranger in public. Over the last few years, it seems that there have been more and more comments of this nature, and it makes me so sad to see the ignorant, unwelcoming little nation we have become.

What sort of fuckwit thinks that a global pandemic is good news? And what sort of society makes people think it's ok to voice such opinions?

There are always flickers of fascism in Europe that need to be confronted. Some administrations are more friendly towards it. De Pfeffel I wouldn't go as far as saying encourages it but he's not overly critical either. Immigration policies/decisions are racist in nature and have long been capricious and unaccountable but the last few years there's been a worrying trend of stripping back tacit rights associated with former colonies. That's definitely a new one.

I think you have to see it in context. Economic uncertainty always sees a rise. Outside of the EU, there's a lot of it about in Russia too. Massively undemocratic at the moment is Russia and Turkey isn't much better due to war on its border that the rest of the international crew aren't doing anything much useful about. It all adds to the mix.

I don't know that individual anecdotes are all that useful because there are always fuckwits around and if anything general day to day discourse is probably better informed than say thirty years ago but in terms of general environment there's been a dull broad trend of increased difficulty for maybe 15 years or so across EU and neighbouring countries taking various matters into account.

Ive worked on security. No one talks to the security guard in shops ever

I used to have a chat with the security guard in the Tesco express round the corner from where DD used to live in London. I used to take toddler DGD in. She was very shy at the time. He used to try make her smile and would have a chat with us whenever we went in. He used to wave to her when we left.

@contentedsoul what do people get as opposed to expect.
David Lanny and Diane Abbot are extraordinarily good constituency MPs who quite reasonably call it as they see it.
The term ‘using the race card’ is tawdry and generally flags up a racist.

There is little point in replying
Everything I say is twisted out of context.
Clearly your views are different to mine.
I’ll walk on by.
As for Lemmy and Abbot - I totally disagree as does the vast population too.
But again you’re entitled to your views as I am to mine.

Only put YABU as I don,t believe it is growing I think it hsa always been there.

White middle class women havnt seen all this 'so called' racism? well I never.....

I have seen horrendous racism and xenophobia in the U.K. recently. There really seems to be a view in many English people that they are "better than everyone else". We, all of us, (even us who feel we would not say anything racist), need to sit down and analyse this trait in ourselves.

Do any of us feel "better" because we are English? Nationalism rises to hate, and thinking that we are "better" makes some one else that they are "worth less".

I have seen such vile racist abuse around the U.K lately. We need to tackle this.

Being English does not nake us better than anyone else

I do think, we from a young age in England, are brought up with a skewed version of ourselves. That we are the best. That we have had a very succesful history of being one of the best countries. My granny used to constantly talk about "the British Empire". No we weren't the best. We invaded and enslaved and hurt many people in many countries.

We have always had a touch of this in our history, that we are the best, and other countries are inferior.

It is time to look at this behaviour in our country, and see how we can improve.

It really is the same little group of nasty, petty, grasping alchys going around the site having drank too much again that evening and demaning evidence for racism, claiming it doesnt happen, playing whataboutism, and desperately trying to say brexit had nothing to do with hate crime rises despite them and us knowing the truth.

I see their delightful hate letter to Diane Abbot from late last night has gone.

Comments about dangerous viruses being good so we can keep "foreigners" out are utter shit and an embarrassment to the person who says them.

There is however no evidence that racism in the UK is "growing"--what golden age are you comparing to? By most criteria, people in the UK are less racist than they used to be. The UK is also one of the world's least racist and most tolerant countries, as measured by most criteria. Not because the UK is perfect/amazing but because most of the world is so much worse. And countries which theoretically score "better" than the UK in terms of antiracism are often a lot less tolerant and accepting in practice. When people in countries like Sweden are surveyed, for example, they are good at repeating anti-racist platitudes, but when it comes down to people of different colors actually working and living alongside one another, Sweden actually has a really poor track record.

Are you white and British @kokeshi123?

Oh my god I actually shed a quiet tear over contended's bravery. Like Nelson, or Joan of Arc but instead of dying for ones country, ploughing on bravely being wrong about things and talking out of your arse. Captain my Captain.

*Why? Why should the UK be seen as a safe haven?”

One of the four fundamental British values as determined by the government is “Mutual respect and tolerance of those with different faiths and beliefs”

We have a recent history of trying to make the UK a safe haven. My family came here early last century to escape the pogroms that would have wiped them out had they stayed in their Lithuanian ghetto. Ugandan Asians came over here in the 70s and there have been minorities from many other countries who have been given refuge here.

I would say those coming to the UK don’t generally expect a lot. I would say that many immigrants just want to basic human need to live free from persecution, war and privation. Those from the EU countries are looking for a better life for themselves and their kids. The majority are not entitled and a fully prepared to work in jobs British people often consider too lowly and poorly paid.

It breaks my heart that border after border has been closed to those tryIng to flee from Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, Somalia and other crisis ridden countries. When my family needed a place of safety, Britain took us in. It’s not been easy and there has been racism (more so since Brexit) but I’m very grateful. I’ve heard some astonishing remarks over the last few years regarding Britain being closed to foreigners and know of people who voted for Brexit simply because they didn’t like their neighbours who are of South Asian heritage. Quite where they fit in to the Brexit equation is unfathomable.

Sadly keeping foreigners out is now a priority for many people.

The people saying 'but its much more racist in Europe, on here and people like Laurence Aryan4daBantz Fox, thats absolutely nothing you can take any bloody credit for or pride in. The brass kneck

There is however no evidence that racism in the UK is "growing"--what golden age are you comparing to?

I'm well aware that there has never been a golden age, and I don't have any solid evidence that I can share. I'm talking about my own perceptions and lived experiences. I'm aware that this involves a series of anecdotes, nothing more, but I see what I see. I have no idea whether people in my local community have always been this racist and/or xenophobic, but I am convinced that they have at least felt more able to express this in recent years.

My DH has experienced more overt racism in the last five years than he did in the twenty years that we were together before that. My dd has encountered more racism too. So have various friends and their children. The primary school of which I m a governor has recorded more racist incidents. And I found myself dealing with an increased number of incidents in my former job until I left at the end of last year (we were a reporting centre for hate incidents).

I don't know what the national statistics say - contrary to what Justanotherlurker might think, I'm not ignoring these, I'm just talking about what I see in my community. If this is not replicated elsewhere in the UK, then that's fantastic. If this is what it has always been like elsewhere, then that's very sad. I don't believe that things have always been this bad around here.

Really, there are no "British people" and there are no "foreigners".

We are all people of the world. Just for some time, we have put a strange amount of value on the place where we were born.

We are all the same.

One of the four fundamental British values as determined by the government is “Mutual respect and tolerance of those with different faiths and beliefs”

Good point! According to not-so contentedsoul, we have far too much of this particular British value!

'Britain is one of worst places in western Europe for asylum seekers

UK has some of harshest policies, and bureaucratic delays leave many people destitute or homeless, analysis reveals'

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/mar/01/britain-one-of-worst-places-western-europe-asylum-seekers

'UK offers some of the least generous benefits in Europe

The UK offers the lowest unemployment benefit of between €66 or €84 per week, depending on age, for up to 26 weeks, while Ireland provides a flat rate of €188 per week between 22-33 weeks. In terms of sick pay, Britain also offers the lowest benefits'

realbusiness.co.uk/uk-offers-some-of-the-least-generous-benefits-in-europe/

'“So-called 'health tourism' costs just 0.3% of NHS spending”.

fullfact.org/health/health-tourism-whats-cost/

The allegation that new migrants are jumping the queue for council housing and housing association homes was nailed as a myth by research recently published by the Equality and Human Rights Commission.

'The myth of immigrants and social housing

The government wants to give local people greater priority for social housing but research shows that only 5% of new lettings are currently going to foreign nationals

That study found that more than 60% of new migrants who had come to Britain in the past five years are living in privately rented accommodation, and most newly arrived migrants and asylum seekers are actually banned from access to social housing.'

www.theguardian.com/uk/2009/jun/29/immigration-social-housing

I don't like when white, English people on here see that they never see racism. To me, that just seems really ignorant. Of course you are not going to see it! I am white, and I know it happens, because I talk to people. I was talking to an Indian man last week who told me that he gets told to fuck off back to pakistan nearly every week.

Some of the white, British, people on here need to read: "me and my white privilege" - it is a book that is out right now, currently in the NY best seller list.

I want to ask people on here a genuine question. Have you ever felt "better" because you were English?

Yeah, I was certainly oblivious to a lot of it until I married DH. My eyes were opened in ways that weren't too pleasant.

ffs copy something original.

Personally, nobut, angel, but I had quite a cosmopolitan upbringing, so I wasn't ever taught to think like that.

@AlexaShutUp when many people are in pain around us, us as white people, have a reaponsibility to help stop it.

ginghambox, if that was aimed at my OP, I haven't copied anything.