AIBU to think the Labour Party has more chance of success with Starmer?

[Mistlewoeandwhine]

I’m not a KS bot. I loved and voted for Corbyn but sadly I realise that this is not what the British people want. I’m thinking that Starmer (who for me would be a compromise politically) would give Labour a chance of a more widespread appeal.

I’m in the LP so will be voting on this issue. Most of my friends are Corbyn fans and are disappointed with me for not sticking to the true socialist path ( which really I do want). But at the end of the day, if most British people rejected Corbyn and what he offered then we’d be mad to just offer it again.

Anyway, AIBU to compromise on my beliefs and pick Starmer as a leader of the Labour Party?

I'm completely with you. I think a lot of people I know understand this but there are a few who are trying to convince me RLB and are disappointed at my choice.

While Starmer is in a way a compromise, it's not like he's Jess Phillips etc.

Some people hold his resignation in 2016 from Corbyn's cabinet against him although I think he did what he thought was right at the time and then he did go on to serve in his cabinet.

I think he's a decent man and has the best chance of bringing the party together.

I am however going to leave a lot of the left wing Facebook groups I'm in as they're conducting pretty toxic smear campaigns against him.

I’m voting for Starmer too. Hopefully he can attract back some of the red wall. He comes from a working class background, and is a peer of the realm. He’s a great example.

Don’t like little Miss Squeaky and Nandy was on the debate the other day, standing with hunched shoulders, definitely not showing an air of confidence.

The Labour Party needs to get into power. He’s the only one who can make it more attractive to centrist voters. I’m very left wing in my own beliefs, but the voters don’t want that. They want a vaguely left wing middle ground party. And electability is more important than ideology.

And he’s named after Kier Hardie, which love❤️🌹

OP surely your mates are astute enough politically to observe that this country is naturally fairly right wing and Labour will not get into power here unless it embraces the middle ground?

It’s all very well having high socialist principles, don’t we all. But we’re facing another decade of hard right government if Labour supporters don’t get realistic. Surely this lesson was learnt in the 80s? Do we really have to watch the same mistake being made all over again?

In the mean time Rome is burning.

Not only is Keir Starmer the only hope for the Labour party, maybe I'm being overly dramatic, but I'm increasingly viewing him as one of the few hopes for the country.

The whole country has lurched far too far to the right and is slowly tearing itself apart. We cannot carry on like this, and we will not. The natural path we are currently following is one that leads to total socioeconomic collapse. It's already started.

Meanwhile the rest of the Labour candidates have nothing to offer but forcing women back into a slavery that would be worse than ever it was, because we will not even be allowed to name it or male violence, and male violence will be fully excused under law. A totalitarian nightmare.

I was never a fan of Blair and his "compromise way", all it did was paper over the cracks, but I live in hope that it could lead somewhere better. In the meantime, I prepare for the worst: I'm becoming a full-on prepper.

Not only is Keir Starmer the only hope for the Labour party, maybe I'm being overly dramatic, but I'm increasingly viewing him as one of the few hopes for the country.

I think you’re right. It’s not just for Labour it’s for everyone.

Damn I keep hoping I am being too dramatic. We are not in a good place.

My hope is for Dan Jarvis to be in a high profile role. He can win back voters from the Red Wall and attract voters from the Home Counties.

Where are the John Smith’s, Harriet Harman’s & Tony Blair’s these days

Harriet Harman?!
The paedophile lover????

I am beyond disgusted that that creature is still in parliament.
Her involvement with PIE seems entirely wiped from memory.

Tony Blair is almost as bad.
He should be in prison for war crime.

The party is unelectable.

You’d think they would have learned from their catastrophic loss that Britain doesn’t want Socialism..

@frostedviolets with respect, I beg to differ

Hopefully the Labour Party will be able to stop getting sidetracked by minor issues and pull together to stop the madness of the Tories.

I am very much on the left of labour but am voting for Nandy for similar reasons

The Labour Party needs to get into power. He’s the only one who can make it more attractive to centrist voters. I’m very left wing in my own beliefs, but the voters don’t want that. They want a vaguely left wing middle ground party. And electability is more important than ideology.

So if Labour get in...it all switches to the secret Socialist agenda like a trojan horse? Or do you mean get elected on a centrist mandate and then govern with a centrist mandate?

Slightly devil's advocate here, but isn't that latter option contrary to Labour party principles? Shouldn't they/you live by those principles come what may?

(I say that as someone who would have been relatively likely to vote Labour for the first time in my life, had it been the New Labour type of party - although their policy on women precluded that in any case)

Richard Burgon has said today that he refused to sign the trans thing as the party risked massive division by sidelining feminists. I think that’s a step in the right direction.

I don’t see a move to centre as a Trojan horse. More that I’ll accept 60% of the changes I want rather than hold out for 100% and get none. I think eventually the younger generations will become more socialist in ten or twenty years anyway.

ilovesooty I also plan to vote for Angela Rayner, want a northern woman.

As for leader, not decided yet but think KS will get in - we will have mid table mediocrity with him, neither fish nor fowl.

Mistlewoeandwhine the issue of Home Schooling was discussed on Women's Hour a few weeks ago. A register was proposed as some children were not being "educated" they were just taken out of school (if they ever went there in the first place). We need to know where these children are and what "education" are they are getting.

The Werneth Wife, as a long term home educator, I feel very strongly about this issue but am avoiding commenting on it particularly as I didn’t want the thread to be derailed. I’m happy for you to start a new thread and get into a heated debate on there! 😊

Slightly sideways but a good reason for a list of home educated kids is that it would stop schools off rolling difficult and SEN children and then saying it was the parents' choice.

A register would allow parents to state the reason they are HE
and thus hold LEAs and LAs to account
while retaining the freedom to HE if they think it best

Mistlewoeandwhine "I don’t see a move to centre as a Trojan horse. More that I’ll accept 60% of the changes I want rather than hold out for 100% and get none."

That's a fair response, thanks.

Agree

oh shit voted YABU by accident

Patroclus 😂

I don't understand why anyone would vote for him, he just seems like an out of touch, middle class, London-centric Blair clone and Blairism isn't popular anymore. Neoliberalism has failed big time, that is why Trump, Johnson and Brexit happened, this is the sad reality, whether people like it or not and I think a lot of people liked Corbyn's policies, they just didn't like his character and didn't think he would be strong enough on the world stage.

Starmer and Rayner here too.. They wouldn't be my first choices, but I think Starmer is the best bet for keeping Long Bailing out of the leadership..

’Neoliberalism has failed big time, that is why Trump, Johnson and Brexit happened.’

Ahem

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/sep/11/brexit-ultras-triumph-neoliberalism

www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/10/05/right-plan-boris-can-turn-free-market-dream-reality/

Brexit and Boris are neoliberalism in action.

I'm a member and will be voting for Starmer, albeit a little reluctantly.

I'm a huge Corbyn fan, have been since the early 80s, but feel that Long Bailey is never going to win people over and that she'll be crucified by the press. I'm gutted that the left weren't able to put a better candidate, and would gladly have voted for Thornberry if she was still in the running. (But I really wanted Clive Lewis, so my support seems to be the kiss of death for any leadership candidate.)

I was toying with voting for Lisa Nandy, but any leader who doesn't think the membership should have the right to select its own candidates, regardless of whether or not they are sitting MPs is not a fan of democracy within the party imo.

Starmer is intelligent and able and a decent parliamentary performer. I also think he has the nous not to piss off the left. But I do have reservations that he's a bit of a Blair.