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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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AIBU? How do I reply to this text?

99 replies

OfMe · 06/02/2020 17:21

Ok - so I'll change names to try and preserve decorum, but this might all be quite outing anyway.

DH and I worked for 'Christopher's creative project for two years and saw it through from start to finish. DH mainly gave up weekends and evenings for a fair few months, I worked on the project the whole time, working very long hours. Our compensation was 'in kind', but as we wanted to get started in the industry, we didn't mind, and it was a good opportunity. Roll on to now, the project completed last Summer, and we've been waiting to see if Christopher would get another one off the ground, however, due to external events, he recently informed us that the next project wouldn't be starting until the Summer.

So DH and I thought we would do a very small project of our own, that would take a month or two to prep, maybe a month more to complete. We thought that (as we are supposed to be part of the company) that it would probably be ok to borrow some equipment for a day, if we insured it ourselves. So I asked and Christopher said yes, that would be fine.

So I then asked if I should email the other partners in the company just to keep them in the loop. I was very clear that we weren't expecting any of them to help us with it, that DH and I would do it on our own with some other external colleagues.

Two days ago, Christopher said yes, that's fine, just make sure the equipment is insured and that it happens under the company name. He wanted to see the specifics of the project so I sent them over.

However, when i asked again today if I should just email the other partners so that they aren't surprised when they see it appear on social media (because it would have to be), he then texted back, saying; I'll check with the other partners, but my instincts are to put any side projects on hold until after the next project.' To presy the next paragraph, he essentially said, he doesn't want too many projects happening at once, it's just bad timing'.

Firstly - somehow, this has gone from being a small project completely belonging to DH and I, to a 'company' project. Secondly, AIBU to be quite upset that we've worked so hard for his project, and now he won't extend us the courtesy of lending us equipment for a day? Thirdly, as I've discussed with DH, we are just now going to go and do our project ourselves, even if I have to spend hundreds of pounds to get our own equipment or hire some, but then the question arises of, how do I tell Christopher that we're going ahead with the project politely - and without losing my rag at him. Every starting phrase I can think of ends up sounding shirty at best, and fucking livid at worst. I know I shouldn't assume that it would have been ok to borrow the equipment - but DH has previously borrowed the equipment, returned it, and it's been fine. So it's either because he thinks the other partners will want to get involved with our project, which will take them off his (which I've already said I wouldn't ask for), or he is either embarrassed to have our project linked to the company, or alternatively, he thinks our project might be creatively better than his? We're at a loss, but I don't think we're going to find out directly from him. AIBU to be so angry about this? Or is there something I'm missing here?

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SmellMySmellbow · 06/02/2020 19:57

You really, really need to stop with this guy. He doesn't want you doing your own project as he doesn't want you coming to the realisation you have no need for any further association with him. He doesn't want to lose his free labour. He's not going to find someone else that will do that amount of work for free for him. He needs you for project 2. Fuck him. He is representing everything that's wrong with the industry. Much easier for you to get a director in for your own ideas than it is for him to get all that you did, trust me.

SmellMySmellbow · 06/02/2020 19:58

And do not drop the project.

LionelRitchieStoleMyNotebook · 06/02/2020 19:58

This kind of twatty behaviour plus having to chase every last person for payment for months (yes including the wonderful BBC), is why DH left the industry all together after more than a decade of earning a good living.

coolwalking · 06/02/2020 20:02

@OfMe I would seriously cut all ties with this guy and his company.

How successful has the project been?

Again, my apologies but you sound naive with regards to the industry. Stick to working with your DH and if you ever need anyone else and their skills then pay them. Mixing camera work and editing is fine for a low budget no pay movie but not a professional approach to work. Anyone who expects camera people to edit as well is a HUGE red flag.

OfMe · 06/02/2020 20:04

@LionelRitchieStoleMyNotebook - yes, at least (as far as I know) everyone professional outside of the company got paid, and within a month of the end of the shoot.

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OfMe · 06/02/2020 20:06

DH only did a bit of camera work for a pre-prod promo, the rest was all just editing, and yes, we did pay the DoP/ACs etc. And yes, I've made no secret of being new to the industry, and understandably have gone through quite a learning curve over the last couple of years!

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YasssKween · 06/02/2020 20:08

Argh. You need to be savvy as fuck and thick skinned in this industry too, you need to be able to stand your ground and have difficult conversations.

I really hope you can get this all worked out but don't be surprised if he doesn't play ball, he's got no reason to think there will be any consequences if he doesn't Thanks

Sewrainbow · 06/02/2020 20:13

He can say no to you using his equipment, he doesn't get to say you can't do additional projects until his is complete, even more so if he isn't even ready to proceed yet! He's got used to you being at his beck and call and has forgotten he doesn't actually employ you...

I wouldn't want to be beholden to him in anyway, so wouldn't use his kit now even if he offered with no strings attached.

Just say "thanks for the offer of your camera but we've decided to source our own to continue with our project which won't infringe on any other projects we take on in the future. Happy to discuss project 2 with you when you are ready to proceed. Look forward to hearing from you...."

AddictedToLoveIsland · 06/02/2020 20:14

OP he may not have wanted you to use his equipment in the end, so that was his excuse. Or, he had crossed wires. I suggest you write an email and say that you have now sorced the equipment needed but thank you so much for all your help and that you are looking forward to working again with the company soon. That's all you need to say. Good luck let us know what happens. Xx

Wilmalovescake · 06/02/2020 20:19

“Ok, thanks for letting us know, thats a shame but no worries- we’ll source a camera somewhere else. Have a good day, Speak soon, OfMe”

OfMe · 06/02/2020 20:22

Yeah, I'll just have to think of a very informal way to say it. Just feeling a bit miserable about it all now.

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OfMe · 06/02/2020 20:23

Wilma you might be spot on there.

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Wilmalovescake · 06/02/2020 20:26

It’s shit. He’s being shit. But don’t do or say anything now you might regret later x

OfMe · 06/02/2020 20:32

No - DH has just asked me NOT to send anything, as a) it's now ages since he texted me this morning, and b) DH has to work with him next week, which is fair enough, so I'll just leave it, and at some point if it comes up we'll just let it drop that we're going ahead with the production anyway. The chances our tiny wee day-long shoot interfering with his next project - if it gets off the ground - are so minimal, I'm happy to take that chance, and if it does, then he's just going to have to pay for a different PM and an editor.

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OfMe · 06/02/2020 20:35

But thanks everyone - you've talked me down from being massively angry and upset to just a 'meh, it'll be what it'll be' kind of thing.
With the amount of other people he ended up pissing off over decisions, I can't say I'm really that surprised, I just didn't think it would be over this, I thought it was going to be a 'We can't pay you for the next project' fall-out, so I guess it was coming anyway.

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KatyCarrCan · 06/02/2020 20:35

Playing devil's advocate, it absolutely isn't usual for two partners to decide they don't want to wait for the next scheduled project but will instead have a 'freelance' project using the company equipment, trading on the reputation they've built on the previous company project - without having a formal discussion/meeting with everyone involved to see if they're ok with that.

I'd assume Christopher thought this was a low-key internal project you were undertaking for experience and has now realised it's more than that which fudges boundaries and could cause you to be seen as competition.

I'd suggest meeting with him, explaining there seem to have been some misunderstandings and actually determining how the company sees the role of 'partners' and whether that works for you and your DH , or not.It might be time to part ways but, as you say, you don't want to burn bridges if you can manage any split amicably instead.

Dozer · 06/02/2020 20:37

The legal situation with you publicly listed as “partners” in the company sounds weird and risky.

DH should seek workspace elsewhere. Don’t do any more free work for Christopher.

JamesBlonde1 · 06/02/2020 20:45

Sounds like a bloody waste of time. 2 years WTF and you just did it for fun? What the hell have you been making, a copy Millenium Falcon or somat?!

OfMe · 06/02/2020 20:47

@KatyCarrCan, you might be right about him feeling that our project is 'competition', but the whole thing arose BECAUSE I wanted to email the other partners just to keep them in the loop, knowing that as it's a small, no-budget, short - originally just intended for DH and I to see how well we worked together, to give me a chance to write something, for us to make something together - while we were waiting to work on Project 2, and we didn't see any harm in borrowing the equipment and permission to do it all ourselves with other actors not used in Project 1. I think he didn't want us to contact the other partners because he wants them focussed on his project - at least, that's what he's said.
And @Dozer, we're only shown on the website as being part of the company. There is nothing legal tying us to it, as the contract we signed was under the business name of the project, a subsidiary of the company. But DH's employer has only just (after months of wrangling with THEM) managed to get the office-sharing going. But definitely yes, no more freebies.

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JamesBlonde1 · 06/02/2020 20:48

Sorry see you posted what it was about!

MintyMabel · 06/02/2020 21:21

Presy?

Mycatwontstopstaring · 06/02/2020 21:25

Keep an eye on the balance of power here OP. It’s weird to me that you have nothing on paper saying that you are partners (I don’t care what the website says, that can be deleted in seconds), yet borrowing some equipment seems to be a very formal process. Either it’s all formal, or it’s all relaxed and arty. But this sounds like anything that benefits you has to be formal and anything that benefits Christopher is paper trail free. It wouldn’t have taken long to give you shares (if it’s a company you should have shares... companies have shareholders, partnerships have partners, usually). Or even just an email stating how decisions are made etc.

Is it really usual to work for free for YEARS? Even the movie business isn’t this bad.

Christopher isn’t a very good friend to you if he’s trying to veto your project / won’t loan equipment when it doesn’t cost him anything to do that, yet owes you a massive favour for free work. Something about the set up feels like you’re being exploited.

KatyCarrCan · 06/02/2020 21:39

OfMe oddly enough I posted before I could see your posts describing what the business was. Having been involved in some similar projects, I think it's even more likely that he sees it as competition. ime the short film/awards circuit is absolutely riven with internal fighting, vying for supremacy, wrangling over credits, etc, etc. He thinks you and your DH are trying to usurp his role.

I think it's time you and DH decide if you're staying with Christopher's company or branching out on your own. I don't think the half-way house is going to work.

OfMe · 06/02/2020 21:48

Yeah, (sigh), this isn't really news to us, we were aware that although he referred to us as being part of the company, it's very much one rule for him, one rule for the fundraising partners, and another for us, but we sucked it up because how many chances does one get to get an EP credit - we just didn't expect our involvement to end up taking years, but it just kept being the case that things needed to be done, and there was no-one else to do it, and from my end, part of why I did it was to help DH get out of his boring FT editing job and get us both in the door of the creative side of things, but I've never kept that a secret from Christopher, and in fact, he took a script of mine ( a tv pilot ) to Cannes one year (I couldn't go, because DH had a job away for his FT job), so Christopher took it and pitched it to someone for me, which was very kind. But yes, it wouldn't have taken long to set up some shares (an issue I've raised previously) nor would it take very long to set up a proper agreement between all the partners, but we've found them all to be quite flaky, so we're quite glad we're not tied in now and can just walk away. I guess I'm just disappointed that it's all over something so trivial.
(and I meant precis, @MintyMabel sorry!)

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