Are the police being U?

[WeHaveSnowdrops]

Friend "Em" witnessed a crime earlier this week. She gave her name and address to the police and said she'd be prepared to make a statement. They said they'd call round in the next few days. She said to phone first as she has a young family and would need to time it around school hours.

5 to 3 yesterday a knock on her door and two PCs wanted to take her statement. She explained they should have phoned first because she was on her way to collect her DS from school so it wasn't convenient.

The female PC apologised but the male said they could insist. And made as if to go in through the door. She told him to back off as she was not leaving her child with no one to collect him and to phone for a more convenient time. And she shut the door in their faces.

She put her coat on and her youngest in the pushchair and went down to the school. The police car followed her. Once she was there it drove off but they were obviously making sure she was telling the truth.

AIBU in thinking they had a monumental cheek? She thinks she won't bother with the statement now as she's very pissed off.

I'd make a formal complaint. Anything less will simply be ignored and therefore not worth bothering with at all. And it's not up to a civilian caught on the hop to be all reasonable and make arrangements for a better time, it's up to the police. They have to be able to do that all the time as part of the job and clearly are far better acquainted with the system than she is. She should still make the statement though.

Mind you I remember the very bad old days when black teenagers would sew their pockets shut because of evidence planting and if you were cheeky, back of the van for a kicking. That's well within living memory for many communities.

I can remember when the Met was being cleaned up by Robert (later Sir) Mark in the 1970s. The detectives tasked had to be stationed outside of London in secret offices, change cars and carry guns as there was a very real threat of violence from the corrupt police they were investigating.

The worrying thing is when no one remembers (or believes) it, then it'll start again. Just saying "but it's 2020" isn't a magic spell.

Yes they were BU but of course she needs to make the statement for the sake of the victim

They are over stretched and only doing there job.

Being a bully isn’t in their job description though.

I have also seen a change in attitude depending who is watching

Yes. I think a lot of posters on threads like this would be shocked to see the reality.

They are over stretched and only doing there job.

I sincerely hope that bullying isn't their job. Or is that a justification ?

As for the op's friend: make a complaint then give the statement.

Absolutely make a complaint- bullying behaviour like this could certainly be part of a wider pattern that needs identifying.

She should
A) Aake a complaint - She really should make a complaint. The officer lied to her and made an attempt to enter her home without the authority to do so, that’s not the worst abuse of power by a long shot but it’s not insignificant either.
And B) Give a statement to another officer (because the victim has no control over whether her case gets dealt with by a jerk).

To be honest, if all the OPs friend saw was "someone tampering with car doors and finding an unlocked one removing items" their statement is of limited use. All it would do it establish a timeline if the police happened to catch the suspects and had other proof of the offence. It sounds like an identification would be unlikely.

On occasion the police can arrest someone, and require witness testimony while they are in custody in order to be able to proceed with a case. Which can make it pressing as the clock is ticking. However in such cases they are able to take an initial statement over the phone and most certainly wouldn't "pop round on the off chance".

I work in a police team, we would ALWAYS consider a victims supporting statement as priority and fit in with them. YANBU

Can police be expected to run an appointment system? Can you imagine them not turning uo to a crime scene because the victim doesnt have an appointment and/or they were due elsewhere?

That said yes the male sounds like he was heavy handed but maybe there were fsults on both sides?

I'm finding this all a little hard to believe.

A police officer would not enter a property uninvited, they simply cannot unless they have grounds to do so and they did not.

The officers cannot force the OP's friend to give a statement. Forcing her to do so would not be in their interests as they would want her to assist with their enquiries.

To the above poster, without talking to the friend and knowing what she saw, you cannot say her account would be of little benefit.

The police don't always work by appointment basis. Yes, in an ideal world that would be great but it just doesn't always work like that.

And as for following her to the school, the OP cleared that one up. They stayed outside the address, probably updating what they needed to and drove down the lane past her...this is slightly different as how she phrased it in her first post.

Can police be expected to run an appointment system?

I guess it depends on how efficient they want to be ? If they like traipsing up to peoples doors on the off chance they might be in, then I guess they don't really need to bother with anyones convenience. I'm surprised they'd have the time though, what with being so overstretched. Apparently.

Can you imagine them not turning uo to a crime scene because the victim doesnt have an appointment and/or they were due elsewhere?

That's not really what's under discussion here. In this thread anyway.

That said yes the male sounds like he was heavy handed but maybe there were faults on both sides?

If it's the OPs friends job to help the police, then yes. If it isn't then I'd put the fault on the side of the people being paid to do their job.

It might surprise starfishmummy to learn the police often arrest people by appointment ....

A police officer would not enter a property uninvited, they simply cannot unless they have grounds to do so and they did not.

And yet he tried to ... And Em felt intimidated by his action.

I won't see Em again until tomorrow by which time I expect she'll have calmed down. I'm sure she will make a statement but I shall urge her to complain about the male officer.

This isn't inner city London where he would have felt safer off the street and in her house, which would perhaps be understandable. This is a village in the shires!

The people trying to break into the cars is probably our first crime this year.

Christ I thought you said the policeman was trying to get into her house ? If so he’d have trapped something when she slammed the door shut, So all we know for definite is that he moved and then she told them to back off and slammed the door in their faces

I wouldn’t say that he was being threatening or bullying, I will save my sympathy for the victim, who I hope is not desperate for this statement to help arrest someone

A police officer would not enter a property uninvited

It's quite amazing how many policemen (word used deliberately) have "heard", "smelled" or "seen" something that requires them to make entry. And once they are in, they are in, game over.

This isn't the US where there's a cast iron protection from illegal searches. This is the UK where the police can break as many laws as they like and cases still get heard.

male officer said they can insist she make a statement ? what are they going to do, beat it out of her ? she needs to do this for the victim.

male officer said they can insist she make a statement ? what are they going to do, beat it out of her ?

Well, it wouldn't be the first time ....

I have also seen a change in attitude depending who is watching. I've worked with young men and women of colour, homeless people and addicts. You'd be stunned to see the difference some white, middle-aged, middle-class eyes on a situation makes

This doesn't surprise me . When I had ti give a statement to the police ( voluntary witness ) the police officer couldnt have been nicer . We ended up having a bit of a laugh.

The messages left on my voice mail in error meant for someone else were of a slightly less friendly tone. And given I called straight back within second. Think answering door time and no answer the second chase up message may well not have even been the fault if the other party given they Made the same.mistake with contacts twice we cant exactly be sure they received what the messages claimed they had sent.

I'd definitely complain the male cop was rude

”The female PC apologised but the male said they could insist.” added a ring of truth to the narrative.

Made it seem less likely to me. Designed to make some kind of sexist point. Why not just say one apologised and one insisted? Much more of a sensational story of she can throw some alleged sexist bullying in there.

Oh shut up mabel. If you're going to assume someone is lying because something sexist happened you can discount the majority of mumsnet. Or the wider world.

@LetsPlayDarts
I'm finding this all a little hard to believe.

A police officer would not enter a property uninvited, they simply cannot unless they have grounds to do so and they did not.

I'm finding your naïveté or willful ignorance hilarious, sad, and angering all at the same time.

Can police be expected to run an appointment system?

When I witnessed an assault the investigating officers made an appointment to come and take my statement, so I'm guessing at least some forces do have such a system.