To be permanently skint, despite being on a good salary?

[cherriesandapplesandberries]

On paper, we have a good combined income of around £85,000, although it varies slightly and can even go up to around 90 on a good year.

But we seem to be permanently skint, and I don’t mean not much money, I mean absolutely nothing in the bank accounts, scrabbling round for loose change, stressing about how we will get to work, skint. This isn’t a begging thread by the way, I know sometimes people post on MN wanting others to offer them money and I don’t, I’m just trying to explain how it is.

We do have debts, loans and credit cards plus obviously the mortgage, childcare fees, cars which cost then obviously the needs of a growing family.

I know back when I was a young ‘un I’d have fallen about laughing at the idea my current salary isn’t enough to live on, but I just seem to be struggling all of the time!

But that kind of repayment level means you e borrowed a shit load in the past

It's also the repayment level that means that it could be the case that you are at the stage where you need to do more than simply muddle along and hope for the best and need some formal advice/debt solution.

For the credit cards at least, you could simply be covering the interest and little more - compare the monthly interest payment with what you pay them - all that money you pay them could be doing very little in getting you out of debt. Which is why a more drastic solution or simply some epic belt tightening, could be in order.

OP you keep saying this worries me and that worries me but you seem like you can't or won't make changes so ....get on with it. Childcare costs are only a temp thing. Do you have regular take outs? Can you cut down on grocery bills? how much are you paying your energy supplier can you change to a cheaper one? Do you shop around for the cheapest fuel in your area or do you go to any old petrol station. Have you gone through all your direct debits to make sure there aren't any hidden ones you may no longer need, you would be surprised how much this happens.

There are many ways to cut down expenses if you REALLY want but you have to put in a bit of effort to change habits that have built up.

Also you probably just don't realise you may have many friends earning a pile more, which is why they don't appear skint.

One of my friends has assumed for the last 8 years that i still earn around the same as i got when I moved to my current job. In fact I've had £40k or so of payrises. We just dont live flashily so we don't feel skint as have plenty spare/saved for a rainy day.

You need to choose a lifestyle to afford the huge income you receive.
It's more than 4x our family income and we manage fine.
It's clear that your choices are to blame.
Move somewhere cheaper, half your income and live accordingly.
Childcare is a huge expense, maybe you should look to you both going pt to share raising your children to save money.
Maybe lose a car, cheaper house, and paying for stuff rather than debt.
I can't believe you can't manage on all that money, I'd be ashamed tbh.

Some of my older neighbours have never earned anything close to what we do & would consider us much more affluent than them however their mortgages are tiny in comparison.

"It’s my DC’s birthday next month which will cost hundreds yet they would probably just tell me to cancel the party (whole class expensive parties plus siblings pretty normal here)."

@DisorganisedOrganiserIf you can't afford it, you shouldn't do it. Perhaps if you don't everyone else who feels unnecessarily pressured also to do so will stop.

OP I get it, to a degree. You have made some expensive choices
and you are living with the consequences.

You had either bad luck or a lot of fun in the past and that is costing you now. That's the main problem. Is there another way of looking at consolidating your debts (and CC) and making a plan to pay it off, then you might feel less pissed off about the situation.

It sucks at the moment OP but once the debts are paid off and childcare costs reduce you're going to feel significantly better off. And it sounds as though your career is going pretty well so hopefully that trajectory continues and in a few years you'll have a higher income too. It sucks now, but plenty of reasona to feel positive about the future IMHO

I’m not being snipey, bear

You’re not happy about the thread, you feel you can’t offer advice, you don’t want to chat, so why do you want to post? It’s a reasonable question.

Like I say voddie there’s nothing I can do about it. I just wondered if I was alone.

Thanks to those who do understand!

Some of my older neighbours have never earned anything close to what we do & would consider us much more affluent than them however their mortgages are tiny in comparison.

Yes! This! There's one in particular who has been known to really sneer at us, but I happen to know that our income is several multiples of theirs

Op has mentioned childcare and mortgage and debt

Beyond those expenses you should have council tax, house and car insurance, petrol, water , gas and electric, £50 a month for phone//BB and £400 per month for family food bill ( no booze) , tv licence .

What else are you buying?

I Suspect that all else is likely to be considered a luxury choice by someone who is really skint.

I hear you OP.

DH and I both work full time and have jointly a similar income to yours, we never have any money though. I wish me could make mortgage overpayments and take the children in regularly really nice holidays (I miss travelling so much which we used to do a lot of ore children)

We have 3 small children and have been paying approx £1,800 nursery fees per month for many many years.

The youngest will be starting school in September so theoretically we should be able to start to sort ourselves out then. It depresses me though that we both work full time, couldn’t have left it any later to have children, earn good money and still have nothing left. It’s crap.

We have a car each as need then for work (no public transport where we are) , don’t want to sell our house and downsize as it’s nothing extravagant anyway 🤷‍♀️ Just a regular semi, And children love living here and we can work to school.

We have no car loans but we car is a 2005 plate and one car is worth Max £300, they are not extravagant at all !

We take lunch to work, no coffees etc, we have no tv , phones and internet is on a good deal.

We look at the figures every month to keep on top of it, there’s no wiggle room 😕

OP I think if you had posted something like - AIBU to feel fed up of having to struggle as we are paying off debts. So basically a support thread. Then I think people would have sympathised. We all get that paying off debt even if it is your fault, is a long slog and disheartening.

When you finish with the debt repayments, half of the money currently servicing debt can be diverted into savings. The other half can go towards clubs for the children and other incidentals.

You’re feeling the pinch at the moment because of your debt repayments. If you are disciplined with your increase in disposable income once you’re no longer in debt, you’ll be able to have some of the security you crave for the future, plus the extra spending money that you would like.

But you had a vote on AIBU ... it wasn't as vote of "Am I Alone"

If your share of groceries is £200, how much are you spending? Meal planning is one way to cut down waste, and if you are working, it's easy to rely on convenience goods and takeaways ( been guilty of that myself).
Slow cookers and pressure cookers and being organised is one way to cut down your grocery bill. I just filled my fridge and cupboards for less than £100 ( Aldi's with a top up in Morrisons), and this will feed 3 adults ( sometimes 4) for almost 2 weeks . I only need to top up with milk/fresh veg / bread next week. I will only take cash so not tempted by " special offers".
You can do this OP. Money saving Expert is a great place to sort your finances out. Once we concentrate on needs not wants, we get on better.

True feet but then it does give you that as the default option. I should have checked I suppose.

Ok karen shall we leave it at that, as I don’t think we are finding one another helpful or likeable.

School will also help (although costs do rise as they get older. And don’t believe the myth that it’ll be cheaper when they’re teenagers. It won’t!).

You need to keep your eye on the future, I think - your pension contributions will matter a great deal once you’re retired. You don’t see the benefits now, but someday you will. The debt will eventually be gone. Things will feel lighter then.

That amount of money is more than enough to live on. It sounds to me as if you're just not living within your means, which it your choice.

If you have a large mortgage, move to a smaller house.

Get less expensive childcare, a smaller car with lower fuel consumption, etc.

I still struggle to think what the hell you could be doing with more than 5k a month after tax, even if your mortgage is 2k or even 3k, but whatever. You need to sit down, write everything down, and think about where you can cut back.

Myself and my partner are perfectly happy, and live on a combined income of less than half of what yours is.

OP, I posted because I didn’t understand what you hoped to gain from this thread.

You don’t want to listen to any advice, you spend / have spent more than you earn yet you seem to be surprised you’re skint

The comment about it not being a begging thread was very telling IMO.

The fact that it even occurred to you that people might offer you money indicates you don’t think this is your fault or that there’s anything you can do about it and you think others will feel sorry for you

Likewise the comment about spending hundreds on your DCs birthday is the perfect example of why you’re in this predicament.

You can’t afford it, you don’t need to do it yet you still seem to think it’s non-negotiable

Until you change your mindset over things like that then things aren’t going to change - in fact they could get a whole load worse if you can’t continue to service your debts

Karen
Totally agree. But if you are surrounded by friends in the top 5%, you are relatively poorer and will feel it.

I think too many people have inflated ideas of how good their income is, particularly in the young child era - in reality almost everyone is left skint by childcare and the costs of maternity leave etc.

I think you said you have loans coming to an end so when they do use that to get rid of the credit cards. Once the debt has gone you’ll be a lot better off which will mean you can start saving and have some available for hobbies etc.

Once into teenage debts no childcare and loans and you will have a lot more money, this is the worst bit.

Ok then bear, you think it’s. a begging thread (seriously ) so now you’ve voiced your suspicion, how about you find another thread?

post definitely, about £80 will be released in April and then another £200 in august which will be a big relief.

We really don’t have a combined income of 5k, not even quite 4.

It sounds annoying but it also sounds like soon there will be relief.
Draw up a monthly projection for every month over next few years. Then you have loan 1 ending in April? Then reallocate that outgoing to something else - which may be stopping you going more into other debts (ie balance the books) or pay off other loan quicker if possible (or start emergencies savings), then loan 2 pays off august? And when childcare costs go down, do you can see light at end of tunnel. I assume if you earn more then you would maybe lose child benefit as around 50k level? But maybe husband could do something extra for a few months?
I am staggered at times when people earning 100k+ get an end of year tax bill for sat £2000 and can't afford it easily but happens often at my work.

YANBU currently in a similar situation, I know where it’s going: we’re being crucified by childcare fees 🙄

@cherriesandapplesandberries - dh and I could have posted your OP, almost word for word when the dses were little. We'd start each month in the black, having paid off the overdraft from the previous month, and by the middle of the month, we'd be heading towards another overdraft.

What helped for us was setting out the budget - on pay day, dh would start with his take home pay (I didn't work), and would immediately subtract all the fixed outgoings - mortgage, energy bills, council tax etc - and what was left was divided up between the other outgoings - food, family fun, running the car etc.

We also kept a detailed record of everything we spent, so we knew exactly where the money was going - so we could see what was necessities, and where we could cut down on our spending. Each month dh would print out budget sheets for the different bits of non-fixed spending (food, car, his and my allowances, family fun etc), and every time one of us spent money from one of those budgets, we wrote it down and kept the receipt. It was tedious, but it really did work.

I started doing a detailed meal plan too, so that we did one big shop for the week, and had everything we needed in the house for the meals and the dses' packed lunches, and didn't need to nip back to the shops during the week - one thing that we noticed from keeping track of the spending was how going to the shop for a loaf of bread never ended up being just a loaf of bread - other things 'fell into' the basket on the way round, and we'd spend a fiver instead of a pound - and that adds up.

It wasn't easy, but we did manage to get control of the finances, and after a while we were able to stop recording all our spending in minute detail - but dh still has the monthly budget on an Excel spreadsheet, and we have internet banking (not even invented when the dses were little) so he can keep track of what's being spent, and knows when we might be straying towards overspending, so we can cut back.

Apologies if this seems like a lecture - I don't mean it to. I just know how frustrating and worrying it is when there is always too much month left at the end of the money, and I wanted to share with you what helped us get on top of it.