To be permanently skint, despite being on a good salary?

[cherriesandapplesandberries]

On paper, we have a good combined income of around £85,000, although it varies slightly and can even go up to around 90 on a good year.

But we seem to be permanently skint, and I don’t mean not much money, I mean absolutely nothing in the bank accounts, scrabbling round for loose change, stressing about how we will get to work, skint. This isn’t a begging thread by the way, I know sometimes people post on MN wanting others to offer them money and I don’t, I’m just trying to explain how it is.

We do have debts, loans and credit cards plus obviously the mortgage, childcare fees, cars which cost then obviously the needs of a growing family.

I know back when I was a young ‘un I’d have fallen about laughing at the idea my current salary isn’t enough to live on, but I just seem to be struggling all of the time!

Which is why you need to pay off your debt. Once you have done that you can start saving a bit every month.

Maybe have a look at everything going out right down to things like Coffees, Papers,Take away food ? Can you batch cook or do double so some for next day.Maybe stick to own brands . Do you need 2 cars or can you do with one? Clothing maybe look on Ebay or wait for sales .Debts /loans /CC need to be addressed also .

You need to for a month keep a record of everything you spend. You need to understand where your money is going first. Then I would post this on MSN forums. The people there are very good at helping people budget better without judgement. But you do need to post everything.

Changing mindset does matter as well. So we have always tried to save something every month except in December - because of Christmas. Even if it is only a £10. Because it is getting into that mindset that saving matters. We then put some of this by for emergencies, and use the rest for holidays. When we can afford it, we do monthly direct debits to savings accounts. So £50 going out from each of our accounts is £1,200 a year. A substantial amount.

Everyone is saying "you shouldn't struggle on such a high income" but is all relative isn't it? Firstly you get taxed so it's not your nett income...the OP may have a large mortgage, debts to pay off from years ago, loans etc. Without exact figures it's impossible to comment about whether they should be struggling or not.

You have no wriggle room because of past financial decisions. You’ll feel the pain now, but plan for the future so you’re not in the same position in ten/twenty years time. Yes you are skint but as long as you are not getting further in to debt that’s ok. You’re just living hand to mouth, like a lot of people, just on a much higher salary. Just make some good decisions now. I am skint too. But I earn a quarter of your salary.

I already understand where my money is going. This is why I said I didn’t need advice, it isn’t intended rudely, although some have taken it as such, but if out of £2500 you know £500 is going on debts, £1500 to childcare and then the rest on phone, petrol, groceries, credit cards and other essentials, there’s not much you can do.

Absolutely cherry although it isn’t quite as stark as that. However I do agree in savings over debts where possible.

The childcare issue will end when both are at primary school. It's a temporary situation. Only maybe have after school club and I think you said you are a teacher so you won't have je c£1000 childcare holiday club costs that others have

Hang in there until the children go to primary school and you will be so much better off

But we both grew up very poor and are very good at managing money.

I sometimes think this is one of the most valuable things my parents passed on, the attitude to money and views on what were essential outgoings.

But the point is you don't just have £2,500 income a month.

Well if it's any consolation OP our household income is about £75 000 per year. And mortgage is paid off AND no childcare costs (teenagers) and I'm skint as well. When mortgage finally got cleared I got this idea that we had loads of cash now and after years of being relatively frugal went a bit mad spending, ran up debts and got an expensive car lease, started buying better clothes and beauty products, having holidays and treating DC. I came down to earth with a large crash when I realized that I had run up £14 grand in loans and credit cards with very little to show for it. I behaved like a total idiot, call it a midlife crisis, but that's no excuse. Now using Monzo to budget and trying to pay it all back asap. DP is furious about it he's very frugal by nature.

Don’t I!

Probably been suggested but have you moved your credit cards around to interest free deal? Consolidated your debt? I'm in the same boat but on less than half of your wages. On paper we should be able to live comfortably but after some very bad luck, an unexpected funeral to pay for then Ill health meaning dh was out of work for several months on ssp, Everything in the house breaking down - washing machine then the drier then the oven then the fridge then the car, quite literally we would get one thing fixed and the next would break, had to have some things paid for on cc, we struggle to make it to the end of the month.

Dh is better now, and moved to a new job with guaranteed hours and the chance of regular overtime. I have moved as much of my ccs as I can to interest free, used cashback sites to do this as well so got a little bit of "free" money doing this. It doesn't make a great deal of difference but has made a small amount.
Things will change but it takes time and it's shit whilst it is happening.

@VirtualHamster Me too. We don't have a large income and yet in spending and saving seem to have much more than a lot of people we know. We will have similar or even larger mortgages than people we know, but I suspect we are simply better at money management than a lot of people. It is a really useful skill to have.

OP why are you making such large pension contributions? Obviously it's advisable to put money in, but surely not at the expense of living now? Can't you cut them and increase when the dc are at school?

Funerals are so expensive

HOW MUCH IS YOUR MORTGAGE each month?

Seem to have written that the DH brings home £1700 (which goes on childcare) while OP is also paying £1500 on childcare (each month).

I don't think the childcare bit was that confusing? It costs about £1500 a month, and OP was using the fact that her husband brings in £1700 a month to show that one whole salary basically goes on childcare. I don't think she was saying I pay £1500 and he pays £1700, more than the cost is almost his entire salary meaning everything else has to come from the other one?

Yes sadly I do know how expensive funerals are. I also know how costly being ill for long periods with no sick pay, and being a temporary carer is.
That is why I recommended MSN forums because there are no judgements. Whether debt is through tragic circumstances or spending it all on clothes and nightclubs, they will help. You don't have to be a "deserving" person in debt, just someone struggling who needs advice.

Constantly not having money at the end of the month is stressful and it is very nice of you can just have enough and avoid counting the pennies. Your income is good and of course many people would be envious of it but your outgoings are the other important factor. A bit of spreadsheet modelling and measurement to get a handle on this can be very valuable, if tedious. Then you can think about savings or indeed a targeted income to be on top of things. Various advice is available from money saving websites, banks and even paying for some independent financial advice can in some circumstances be cost effective to choose good investments and maximise tax relief. Sadly I haven't got to the point where I don't have to ever think about money but I have found budgeting, including going for a mortgage I felt I could afford, a big benefit. Keep your spirits up, your income is good and I am sure there is a path to feeling more relaxed.

Sorry OP, but YAB totally ridiculous. I understand that you’re feeling sorry for yourself at the moment but that’s not going to help you or your family in the short term.

Imagine how you’d cope if one of you became seriously ill and was unable to work for a couple of years. Unexpected illness/serious accidents happen to hundreds of people every year and realistically, it’s much more likely to happen to you than you winning the lottery.

You mentioned about needing a reliable car for work but you can still buy an older car and pay occasional repair costs. It doesn’t need to be newer or bought on finance.

Nobody needs a phone contract. There are plenty of excellent PAYG deals.

You are choosing to live in a certain way and it’s causing you to stay in debt for longer. You could make different lifestyle choices and pay off your debts more quickly, but you don’t want to.

You can choose to make some changes to your outgoings, but your sense of entitlement means you don’t think you should have to.
That’s fine. Your choice.

But you are so far from being genuinely hard up, it’s pretty shocking that you don’t seem to realise how privileged you are.

You’re not working at a job on zero hours contracts where each week you don’t know if you can afford money for the electricity and for your family to eat 3 meals a day.

You’re not working hundreds of miles away to send money home or working evenings and week-ends outside of the home and not getting to see your children regularly.

You’re not standing in the supermarket late in the day waiting to buy the drastically reduced foodstuffs so you and your family can eat a decent meal.

You’re not queueing down at the food bank each week wondering if they’ll be any fresh veg available this week?

You actually are very well off compared to many other families.

Maybe start counting your blessings and accept that you could make different choices but you’re actually happy with things as they stand?

The MSE Debt Free Wannabe board was a lifesaver for me. I was in humungous debt despite a reasonable salary. There really was no way out. The posters on that thread are so knowledgeable and supportive - because they have been there and there's no judging.

First thing you have to do is do a "statement of affairs" which lists all your incomings and outgoings. It's amazing how much can be saved by switching suppliers (so many people pay a fortune for satellite TV they don't watch). You'll get brilliant advice on tackling credit card and loan debt - that's where a fair bit of my salary was going. Be ruthless about invisible spends - coffees, drinks after work, lunches out.

The good thing is that on a reasonable income you have more wriggle room to resolve the debt issue. There are people on the board who manage to conquer debt despite being on very low incomes.

Good luck.

That is why I recommended MSN forums because there are no judgements

Assuming you mean MSE, they won't take too kindly to the OPs 'poor me' attitude, especially as it's a much less affluent demographic than here, so people are used to living on much lower incomes with the commensurate more modest lifestyle. Plus the fact that she's refusing to divulge her housing costs.

We take home about 90k between us (gros), live in a bog standard 3 bed house which needs work and we do ok but really only since the youngest started school have we been able to save as well and think about a holiday (UK). We hadn't had a holiday in nearly a decade . We drive an old car which we own outright, we don't eat out except for birthdays and we don't buy a lot of clothes etc. We're pretty frugal. I also meal plan. I can see you know it wil get better over time, doesn't mean its not weird to be bringing in so much money but not feel like it!

We have an older car, minimal eating out, UK based holidays, cheap phones, buy second hand clothes, no hobbies for ourselves (just children), and try to do food shop as cheaply as we can.

We do all this, with a good income, but we still only make ends meet. I can see how you can get into debt. It'll get easier when childcare costs go down.

A diary on expenditure is a good idea.