Boys in ballet - really fucking annoyed

[Boyscandoballettoo]

Please excuse the ranty tone of this thread - I have just had enough! Took my male toddler to a ballet class, and the number of negative comments or comments laughing about it from so-called family and friends has been overwhelming.

Please can people tell me AIBU to think it’s a bloody unisex sport?!? There have always been male ballet dancers! I do NOT understand the ignorance over it and even if it were a female sport traditionally, how dare people be so bloody sexist and make fun of a boy for joining in.

I don’t know why but it’s really pushing my buttons!

Jeez have they not noticed or realised how many past and present famous male dancers or ballet dancers there are? Go do some google and slam it under there noses, a little hint andreas Wisniewski and Alexander godunov who played the baddies

In die hard were professional ballet dancers! If your son gets s lot out of it then good

Ffs this tread is actually making me cross. For all you posters who think ballet isn’t a sport go and try a class because I fucking bet you’d say different afterward. The senior ballet classes I teach you wouldn’t get trough the barre warmup let alone the whole class. Ballet uses all your muscles and you need a lot of strength and control. Boys need to be about to jump high and have the stamina to do it over and over again. Boys also need strength to lift female dancers and all of this ontop of ballet technique (which takes years to learn). Girls have to built up enough strength to go en pointe, that alone is hard enough. I have dancers at my studio who train up to 25/30 hours a week just to try and get contracts. As for people talking shit about something they have no experience in or no nothing about, just stop I don’t think you realise how utterly stupid you sound. Ballet is not just for girls boy who do ballet have more strength and stamina than a footballer why do you think professional football players take ballet classes.

Why does ballet have to be a sport to be a worthwhile or difficult thing to do?

Are "sporting" activities more worthwhile than expressive ones?

I don't really get the argument.

Many dancers are fitter than many sports people.
Many dancers don't dance competitvely.

My DD is a ballet teacher- and the fittest person I know. I have a BIL who does triathlon, a friend who is a black belt in karate, a friend who is a fitness instructor.

Ballet fitness beats them all hands down.

Still not a sport in my view, but doesn't have to be to be admired.

Not one bit of the rant above turns Ballet, which everyone agrees is a very physical activity which requires great strength and ability and stamina, into a sport.

Clue. Darts is a sport and can be done by fat blokes. Ballet isn’t.

Something being a “sport” has nothing to do with how for you have to be to do it

So if dancers, ballet or others, dance in competitions where they are judged against others and against set standards, get placed first, second whatever, win the competition or lose the competition what makes that not a sport? What makes rhythmic gymnastics a sport, what makes ice dancing a sport? Really confusing.

The same people who post that they have one of each and their girl is a real “girly girl” who likes pink, craft and dancing, but the boy likes gaming, guns and is loud and noisy. Reminded me of being out in a shopping centre, we were admiring a young baby, only weeks old, other lady said what a lovely dress and the mother said, "Thank you, she is a real girly girl." We tried to not laugh out loud but it was obvious we thought it was a funny remark. The mother got huffy about it but I ask you a girly girl in a pretty dress when she is 4 or 5 weeks old, I wonder what her mother would have thought if she'd said I want tracky bottoms and a hoodie.

@IsithomeTimeYet I feel your crossness. People who’ve never taken a class have no idea. I lift heavy weights and work out just to keep me fit and strong for ballet ( I’m 61 and do 3-4 classes a week still).

There’s actually a huge debate in the ballet profession about sport v art. It’s unfortunate because ballet is ballet. Dancers are hugely athletic but they are more than athletes.

And OP good for you taking your DS to Baby Ballet classes. Particularly when children are pre-verbal, physical movement is a really important form of communication. You’re giving him a skill for life.

And why people are questioning your motives for starting your son in ballet I cannot comprehend. Would people ask that question if it were Baby gym, or baby athletics or whatever? I doubt it.

'Why does ballet have to be a sport to be a worthwhile or difficult thing to do?'

Agree that's how it's beginning to read on here

No-one as said it needs to be a sport to be worthwhile. Quite the opposite, people are saying that to do it to any standard requires great levels of commitment, skill and overall fitness.

The point is that just because something requires physical skill or excursion doesn't make it a sport.

Some form of dancing are classed as sport. Ballet isn't and it doesn't matter how many times people say it is until it appears as a recognised sport it simply isn't one. Doesn't take away from the skills required to do it though.

www.sportengland.org/media/10266/uk-recognised-ngbs-and-sport-list-april-2016.pdf

Why does ballet have to be a sport to be a worthwhile or difficult thing to do?'

Again, people are massively missing the point people are making.
However, I've danced all my life and people have often told me what i do is not a sport in order to belittle my form of dance.

So if dancers, ballet or others, dance in competitions where they are judged against others and against set standards, get placed first, second whatever, win the competition or lose the competition what makes that not a sport?
Exactly.
A poster earlier claimed it's only a sport if you can cheat at it (?!) I can assure you that you can cheat in dancing competitions - it frequently happens unfortunately.

FWIW, i have never heard any of the considerable number of professional dancers or dancers in training that I know refer to themselves as athletes or to dance as a sport. I would think that the majority of dancers, particularly ballet dancers, consider themselves artists. I don't know people in every genre of dance obviously and it may well be that some ( freestyle or acro maybe) are closer to sport than art, but in my experience, the thing that differentiates between dancers, beyond a certain point, is generally artistry rather than athleticism. In the same way as lots of musicians can play the right notes in the right order, so can many dancers dance the right steps in the right order, with the right physical facility. But what makes the difference is the ability to move people, and that is an artistic talent, not a sporting one.
Obviously its a spectrum. Things like artistic gymnastics and figure skating are sports but also have an artistic element. And aesthetics come into even sports that wouldn't be considered artistic at all, like cycling - some riders just have a beautiful riding style that looks fabulous whereas others may well win races but look awkward whikst they are doing it.
But if you asked the majority of the audience at a dance performance whether they were watching an art form or a sport, I think that the vast majority would say art form. Therefore, the performers are, in my opinion, primarily artists.
Which is not to say of course that dance cannot be enjoyed purely for fitness, or as a competitive pursuit, or just for fun. Sport or art form, its dance, and it should be accessible to those of any age and either sex to enjoy.

Not a sport.

But that doesn't make it lesser, it's just not a sport. It's like the nonsense that is calling computer gaming esports.

I don't know people in every genre of dance obviously and it may well be that some ( freestyle or acro maybe) are closer to sport than art, but in my experience, the thing that differentiates between dancers, beyond a certain point, is generally artistry rather than athleticism

I teach competitive Irish dance. The competitive form is closer to a sport. It's technical, there are strict rules and people are training for huge national and international competitions.

A poster earlier claimed it's only a sport if you can cheat at it (?!) I can assure you that you can cheat in dancing competitions - it frequently happens unfortunately. I missed that, how brilliant, the defenition of sport is you can cheat at it.

Personally I don't like sport, never willingly done any of it, only ever watched it if my kids were doing it but I don't see why something can't be artistic and a sport and I know dancers who will say they are athletes and I think they have every right to.

Just thought I did once go to a football match willingly but that was because I wanted to see George Best in the flesh, nothing to do with the sport I'd have been as happy to go and watch him dance.

The cheating definition would presumably make A level maths a sport then?
I must try suggesting that to my son...I will start telling him he needs to do his training instead of homework.

MAFIL I always found the best motivator was, "If your not doing your homework can you start sorting out your room." It was amazing how attractive homework suddenly became.

My friend's DS did ballet with my DD and it would be too outing to say too much but rest assured he is now mega successful not in ballet but similar. Carry on and ignore.

With all due respect this is a 'toddler' ballet class that the Op has chosen for him to attend. IMO it's getting a wee bit crazy.

If anyone comments just ignore them

My little boy does a toddler ballet class and it’s roughly a 50/50 split boys and girls. Main difference seems to be most of the girls have been bought pink tutus by their parents, I haven’t bothered buying my son special ballet kit and neither have the other parents of toddler boys. When it comes to the dancing the boys and girls seem to enjoy it equally. Ignore the stupid comments.

Main difference seems to be most of the girls have been bought pink tutus by their parents

What is it with pink tutu’s?

I did ballet fairly seriously as a youngster and our “uniform” was a black tank leotard. Pink socks and ballet shoes- exams were a white tutu at the lower grades and the black tank for higher. Boys had black shorts and white t shirt, black shoes.

It seems to be a parental drive for pink. Until recently I hadn’t come across a “serious” ballet school who’s uniform was pink...

bluebluezoo the RAD girls'uniform for pre primary and primary grades was pink with a short chiffon skirt when my DD was little. Every RAD school I know of used that until a few years ago. It has changed to a sort of pale lilac now though. She had a fairly horrid navy tank leotard with a belt from grade 1 to 5 and then fortunately rather more flattering camisole leotards for 6-8 and the vocational grades. No tutus though, other than for performances.
(Oh I tell a lie...I remember buying a black practice tutu at one point, maybe for adv 2)
I think a lot of little ones wear princess dresses and the like for the kind of classes that the OP is describing though. Most schools I know of don't expect uniform until pre primary.

My daughter tried out a toddler class and the dress code was essentially fancy dress, fairy costumes, play tutus, those Hello Kitty net dresses they do in H&M etc.

The next class up was lower school uniform.

I think it worked quite well, it meant the classes had a sense of fun and occasion but parents weren’t shelling out for ballet-only clothing

Once they went into the infant ballet class, they were already hooked on the dance aspect, and the teacher started to expect discipline in behaviour and attire.

My daughter wasn’t into it. The hall was too draughty 😂

Which was a shame for me as I had done both ballet* and tap as a child and wanted to relive it vicariously through her. Kids tend not to go along with that stuff huh? 😅

*I initially went to an ITSD school that had a turquoise uniform leotard (circa 1980) with attached skirt and then moved to a RAD which was a black leotard with separate chiffon skirt and pink elastic belt. Much better!

*ISTD even.

Just googled it, looks like some schools still use turquoise (‘aqua’ officially) but the fabric at least looks better now!

Traditionally ballet is a male sport and women were not allowed to participate. How would ballet productions without male dancers work?
I hope your toddler enjoys his class. Your friends are idiots and best be ignored.

When my DD started a dance class at 3, we would all watch in fascination as the teacher, in her mid 60s, warmed up. She usually ended up by doing cartwheels round the hall followed by back flips down the middle, she knew the children were fascinated and she obviously still liked to impress an audience. I think the parents were in awe, I know I was. The little ones were the first class so the older ones missed this. The whole warm up was impressive but the finale was amazing a bit like watching the floor exercises in the Olympics.

She is well in her 80s now and we are due to visit her in a couple of weeks. My husband was just saying last night that he wondered if she is still doing back flips. Hopefully she won't feel the need when we take her out to lunch but maybe we should factor in the size of the restaurant just in case.