National Anthem

[flapslack]

Just had an odd conversation with my 12 year old DS who asked me what our National Anthem is. Didn’t even know the tune.

Obviously I could have taught him but really I am just wondering if this is something not taught at school any more?

Pater noster, qui es in caelis, sanctificetur nomen tuum. Adveniat regnum tuum

I wouldn't mind the Latin version so much but it must be a rare priest who knows their way around Latin these days.

When I told the priest officiating at my mum's funeral I wanted a reading from xxx (insert appropriate book and verse) he turned a ghastly pale and admitted he didn't actually know the names off the verses off by heart.

I can’t remember where I learned it but never sang it at school. Never sing it now either.

I wouldn't mind the Latin version so much but it must be a rare priest who knows their way around Latin these days.

advantages to having a DF who was (literally) old schooled in a Catholic country . One of our relatives somewhere was a priest - which is why my parents were married in a cathedral.

As an English person (with some other ethnic influences) I feel we take this stuff less seriously and find it a bit bad taste Whereas those of us who are proud of our nationality are uneducated proles compared to all you sophisticated urbane types. Not liking the national anthem is one reason Jeremy Corbyn and his minions will be out on their arses in April.
Perhaps you would prefer this.
Stand up, damned of the Earth
Stand up, prisoners of starvation
Reason thunders in its volcano
This is the eruption of the end.
Of the past let us make a clean slate
Enslaved masses, stand up, stand up.
The world is about to change its foundation
We are nothing, let us be all.

Chorus
This is the final struggle
Let us group together, and tomorrow
The Internationale
Will be the human race.

There are no supreme saviours
Neither God, nor Caesar, nor tribune.
Producers, let us save ourselves,
Decree the common salvation.
So that the thief expires,
So that the spirit be pulled from its prison,
Let us fan our forge ourselves
Strike the iron while it is hot.

Chorus

The State oppresses and the law cheats.
Tax bleeds the unfortunate.
No duty is imposed on the rich;
The rights of the poor is an empty phrase.
Enough languishing in custody!
Equality wants other laws:
No rights without duties, she says,
Equally, no duties without rights.

Chorus

Hideous in their apotheosis
The kings of the mine and of the rail.
Have they ever done anything other
Than steal work?
Inside the safeboxes of the gang,
What work had created melted.
By ordering that they give it back,
The people want only their due.

Chorus

The kings made us drunk with fumes,
Peace among us, war to the tyrants!
Let the armies go on strike,
Stocks in the air, and break ranks.
If they insist, these cannibals
On making heroes of us,
They will know soon that our bullets
Are for our own generals.

Chorus

Workers, peasants, we are
The great party of labourers.
The earth belongs only to men;
The idle will go to reside elsewhere.
How much of our flesh have they consumed?
But if these ravens, these vultures
Disappear one of these days,
The sun will still shine forever.

Chorus

Whereas those of us who are proud of our nationality are uneducated proles compared to all you sophisticated urbane types.

Who (apart from you, obviously) has equated not liking the national anthem with not being proud of their nationality ? On this thread, leastways.

RC's do not say "The Lord's Prayer." It is the 'Our Father.'

And the Australian National Anthem is the biggest load of tripe on this Earth. Why they chose it instead of Waltzing Matilda is a mystery.

It is a miserable tune and antiquated lirics. When Queenie pops off we should change it. Billy Conelly once said we should use the theme tune for the archers

Who (apart from you, obviously) has equated not liking the national anthem with not being proud of their nationality ? On this thread, leastways. DGR I'm not that keen on GSTQ but will sing it lustily if required. I think we are all very confused about nationhood at the moment. English people are stuck with GSTQ whereas us wee nations have alternatives. I just don't get the disdain for the English flag, the singing of the National Anthem and pride in the UK. It doesn't make you Nigel Farage to like all of those things. Is it the same in France or Italy?

I just don't get the disdain for the English flag, the singing of the National Anthem and pride in the UK.

Is that a deliberately ambiguous sentence ?

(Reading it how I think it was intended ...)

Where have I (or anyone on this thread) slated pride in the UK ? I have no problem with anyone being proud of the country they live in - whether by choice or accident.

What I do have a problem is for people to try and slide vile racism, xenophobia and hatred under the cover of "I luvs my country". And because it's my country as much as anyone elses, I feel a certain justification in getting irked about it. After all, people are effectively trying to do it in my name.

I’ve been to some events where it has been played and universally the words around me are easy to learn it kind of goes like this.

Der, der der deeer de de, der der der da der de, hum hum hum hum huum her hum. And just repeats alone that theme with no eye contact and head down.

English people are stuck with GSTQ

I may have imagined it but I'm sure they used to use Land of Hope and Glory for the Commonwealth Games, which is a better tune.

I may have imagined it but I'm sure they used to use Land of Hope and Glory for the Commonwealth Games, which is a better tune.

My late DM was a big fan of LoHaG and often said it would be an ideal national anthem.

Is Elgar still OK these days ? Being in Brum, "The Elgar Trail" is a perennial "must get around to it" event (When the weather is OK, of course).

Ooh - reading the Elgar Wiki page, it seems he knew the soon to be Canonised Brummie Saint Cardinal Newman, leading us through the Catholicism door again.

What I do have a problem is for people to try and slide vile racism, xenophobia and hatred under the cover of "I luvs my country". And because it's my country as much as anyone elses, I feel a certain justification in getting irked about it. After all, people are effectively trying to do it in my name. Fair enough

I’d much prefer Land of Hope and Glory, I must say - much more stirring tune and lyrics.
And I bet everyone forgets to change the words of God save the Queen to God save the King, when Charles starts his reign! Old habits die hard.

And I bet everyone forgets to change the words of God save the Queen to God save the King, when Charles starts his reign!

If he chooses to keep it. I really hope he decides to ditch it.

Did anyone see QI over Christmas ? If you think GSTQ is dire, you might want to stop reading ...

www.comedy.co.uk/tv/qi/episodes/17/9/

- In Britain, the song that people sang before the national anthem was invented was Britons, Strike Home! Written by Henry Purcell in 1695, it is fifty years older than God Save the King which was first publically performed in 1745. Britons, Strike Home! was written for a play about Boudicca, and in the play the song is sung by a Druid to whip up resistance against the Romans. It was so popular that in 1797 the entire House of Commons sang it spontaneously when Pitt declared war on France. It was also played onboard ship during the Battle of Trafalgar. It was last used as a patriotic rallying cry in December 1914. A performance of it by the Academy of Ancient Music is played and everyone in the studio then sings along to it. The lyrics are:

"Britons, strike home!
Revenge, revenge your Country's wrong's
Fight! Fight and record. Fight!
Fight and record yourselves in Druid's Songs."

- XL Tangent: "Rule Britannia" was performed in the same year as "God Save the King", 1745, by the band at the Theatre Royal, Drury Lane, where it was played nightly in defiant response to the Jacobite victory at the Battle of Prestonpans.

Of course we could always have a bit of Souza ...

@DGRossetti surely he's not allowed to just change it?

He's not actually allowed to make any other decisions really so I'd be surprised if he can do that.

DGRossetti surely he's not allowed to just change it?

Course he is. The UK doesn't have an official national anthem. Just "by convention". It's not written into any law (unlike other countries).

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_Save_the_Queen

Like many aspects of British constitutional life, "God Save the Queen" derives its official status from custom and use, not from Royal Proclamation or Act of Parliament.

So day one of the New Carolingian epoch, and Chuck just needs to say "Er, I say, would you mind awfully if we sang something different when I'm around ... I'm a big fan of Parry, you know ...."

Oh Flower of Scotland - is that is the anthem you mean? Pretty well known amongst Scots kids I know.

England now uses Jerusalem in the Commonwealth Games. Scotland uses Flower of Scotland, but used to have Scotland The Brave.

Elgar lost some of his best mates in WW1 (see Nimrod) and hated the jingoistic words added to his composition without his permission.

Elgar lost some of his best mates in WW1 (see Nimrod) and hated the jingoistic words added to his composition without his permission.

There's probably an entire website that could be devoted to asking the question whether a national anthem is inherently jingoistic or not ...

England now uses Jerusalem in the Commonwealth Games. Scotland uses Flower of Scotland, but used to have Scotland The Brave.

I've always preferred Scotland the Brave as a tune but can't get past the Scots Porridge Oats association.

Can't stand Jerusalem but that's not my problem.

The problem with Flower of Scotland is that it's a folk song not written for a military or police band, who usually give it a comedic Ooompapa-ooompapa.

I refuse to accept it’s my national anthem. Ooh look it’s ok we took out the racist verse so it’s all ok now....no fuck off! If that part had been about any other ethnic group the song would have been forgotten about. England can keep it if they like it so much. My friend from India asked my why the English teams use the UK anthem and don’t adopt one since only one country were playing and not all 4 like team GB.

The Official National Anthem of Scotland is God Save The Queen. The Scottish Parliament has declared itself competent to choose an alternative, but declines to do so. Perhaps because they like booing it so much.