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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

... to think my sister is a CF?

98 replies

motherofadog · 08/01/2020 17:58

Warning: this is long and also about my mother. Continue at your own risk.

Basically, we never got on. She was an anxious, controlling perfectionist and I never quite came up to scratch. She used to tell me she loved me but she didn't like me, she preferred the animals, and once she told me I wasn't the daughter she'd wanted. She wasn't always like that, but enough to leave a mark.
We established an uneasy truce after I left home but I saw her as little as possible; our relationship improved when I had my kids in my late 30s and early 40s but we were never close. However I was close to my younger sister, and we spent a lot of time together. She had a better relationship with our mum, and 20 years ago when our kids were small, she and her family moved 500 miles away to her partner's home town and Mum went with them. For the first 10 years Mum was active and fairly independent, although she didn't drive and needed help with moving house and with her finances. She gave my sister and bil a lot of free childcare in return.

Mum used to come and stay with us; we had some lovely Christmases and summer holidays together and from my perspective our relationship improved. I still found it very difficult to stay with her (she has her own house) when we visited them, but when she stayed with us, it was ok. My sister has never visited me once since they moved, although they stay with her bil's family, about 100 miles from us, regularly. It's always been up to me, the skint single parent, to make the journey, because it's too difficult for her with two kids, a partner, and money to spare. I've always suspected that her partner doesn't like me, although we get on well superficially.

Moving on... Mum's had dementia for a while, her health crashed about 3 months ago, and she's been in hospital ever since. I went to visit a couple of months ago and it was clear that my sister is run ragged dealing with her, teenagers and working full time. And her partner has recently developed a potentially serious health problem. Mum was very happy to see me and came closer than she's ever done to apologising for (or even acknowledging) her part in our difficult relationship. It meant so much to me that I wrote down everything she said so that I wouldn't forget it.

I'd mentioned to my sister that I could move into Mum's house and be her full time carer. It seemed like a plan to me; my sister was overwhelmed, Mum would be happier at home, I'm a waspi, working for minimum wage to pay the rent, my kids have left home, and there's nothing to keep me here except my friends, who will still be here when I come back. It would bring the family back together, and give me a way of contributing and being part of it. And it would give us a chance of getting a little bit of money out of Mum's house, even if she had to go into residential care in the end. That would make life much less of a struggle for me, and although my sister doesn't need it, she deserves it. Spending time with Mum convinced me that I could do it, and I asked my sister to think about it seriously. She wasn't convinced; distinctly underwhelmed, despite the overwhelm.

So, radio silence apart from a few texts about Mum and presents, until a couple of days before Christmas when an envelope arrives from my sister. Expecting something nice, I open it to find a printed letter telling me that Mum has been assessed and needs residential care. Fair enough.

And then she tells me that Mum took independent financial advice some years ago (land registry says 5) and gave the house to her. She'd insisted that I wasn't to be told until she died. And my sister had gone along with it until it got too uncomfortable and she had to tell me.

She signed the letter with a kiss. She never does that.

I told her I could see why she hadn't told me face to face. And I said I was sad, not because of the money which was a lie, but because of the deception. She texted back: No deception. I was just carrying out Mum's wishes.

Since then, I've had a couple of texts (with kisses) and sent one back (without) about presents. I don't know what to say. I feel so let down. I feel like I've been set up. Like Mum conned me into forgiving her by lying to me. She was always so proud of treating us both equally; I should have realised it's no more true now than it was then. I'm pretty sure she wasn't capable of thinking it up and doing it all by herself; she's not usually so proactive; she used to leave all that to my dad, and now my bil. I'm remembering all the weird things my sister has said, which turn out to be actual lies. I want to tell her what deception is, because she obviously doesn't understand. I want to write her a letter, but I've no idea what to say or what I want the result to be. Mostly I just wish it had never happened, because it feels horrible. I feel like I've lost my sister.

AIBU? WWYD? WTF do I do next?

OP posts:
diddl · 08/01/2020 20:51

" a friend purchased his Mother's house, then charged her rent, I think this took place a few years ago."

That's ok iirc.

As long as it was purchased for a correct amount & the rent is at market value.

Notajogger · 08/01/2020 20:55

Your sister could have refused - it'd be interesting to ask her more about the conversations that were had at the time.

Also she could choose to equally split her inheritance with you (if the will is also unequal) after your mum passes. That would be entirely up to her.

If this thread were written from the sisters perspective though, there might well be a lot of comments about you only being interested in being there/helping when it looks like houses/money are involved.

Ilady · 09/01/2020 08:41

Your sister has now been put into the awkward position of telling you that she has owned your mother's home for the past 5 years.
This was after you said I will mind our mother at home to keep her care costs down and so there could be some money left after she dies.
Did they not realize that you find this out. No wonder you think your sister is a CF. Why did she not tell your mother you can't do this X in regards to putting the house into her name?
I think you need to get some legal advice in regards to what happened with your mothers house. You also need to find out about funding the care your mother will need soon.
Once you do this I would have very honest chat with your sister about the house and what happens now with your mother. Being honest I can't see you putting your life on hold to mind your mother after this.

One of my friends (x) found out something similar a few years ago. She was unhappy over what she found out and confronted the main person involved. She was as much as told to get lost by them. Now X is making plans that will have an impact on several people in the next few years.

Yeahnah2020 · 09/01/2020 09:05

So your sister is planning on keeping the house or as much of it as she can after residential living costs, and leaving you out completely? That is disgusting. She doesn’t have to go along with her mother’s wishes. They both sound like a waste of space.

Cohle · 09/01/2020 09:17

I think you're being a little unfair. Of course this is a dreadful shock to you, but five years ago your relationship with your mother was very different. Your sister has been helping your mother for years and this was probably planned as a way of avoiding tax/care home fees. It sounds like at least some of your motivation of offering to make the move was financial.

Dustarr73 · 09/01/2020 09:32

Im sorry @motherofadog theres only 1 cf and thats you.

You left your ds looking after your dm all these years,and now you think you can swoop in and be her carer.

It doesnt work like that.I think the person who does the bulk work of looking after a relative should get the house.They have basically put their life on hold to be there for that person.I dont think you have any idea what caring for someone actually entails.

Which is why if your ds say your dm needs residental care,she knows better than you.

MegaClutterSlut · 09/01/2020 09:40

This is a tough one as I couldn't leave any dc out but the thing that unsettled me about you is twice you mentioned money. Seems that's the thing you care about the most not anything else just what you can get out of her so your mum made the right call imo

Damntheman · 09/01/2020 09:47

I'm so sorry OP, what a horrible situation. I am surprised by the voting though as I think (as gently as I can) that you're unreasonable to be blaming your sister. She was put in a bad position by your mother and has even broken your mother's trust to tell you about the house.

Zaphodsotherhead · 09/01/2020 09:58

Your mum has dementia and has been in hospital for three months.

I think it's unlikely that she'll be coming home, to be honest. The 'move in to help her' ship has well sailed.

Inappropriatefemale · 09/01/2020 09:59

Sorry what’s a CF?

Damntheman · 09/01/2020 10:17

@inappropriatefemale Cheeky Fucker.

Inappropriatefemale · 09/01/2020 10:18

Ahh thanks.

Aridane · 09/01/2020 13:40

I don't think your DSIS is a cf at all. She's been the primary carer for your DM. She's lived beside her for years.

I think you were very cheeky to suddenly suggest you'd move in with your mum and care for her in the hope of getting some money out of the house. You may have thought you were offering some grand family reunion. To your DSIS, it probably looked as though you let her deal with your DM for years and then when there was the chance of an inheritance you suddenly developed a pressing need to become involved and move into your DM's house

Very much agree with this

ShoesCoatBag · 09/01/2020 13:49

The 7 year thing is for inheritance tax, for care they can go back as long as they like.

There is nothing stopping your sister giving you half of what is left after care home fees are paid.

Crazycrazylady · 09/01/2020 14:28

I think your the cf in this instance.
Your sister has looked after your mom for years ( given you've freely mentioned you had a poor relationship for most of your life) and then at the end of your mothers life, you suggest moving in with her to become her "carer" all of a sudden with the hope of getting something out of the house.

Did you expect half the house even though your sister has provided all the care and has a close relationship.
What has your sister done wrong in the instance?

I think your real question is about legal recourse and I can tell you now that you have none, Your mother was in good health 5 years ago ( you cant argue diminshed capacity(and as you had practically no relationship with your mother in the years previous you wont be ale to argue that you were unfairly treated. Let it go if you want a relationship with your sister

SilverDragonfly1 · 09/01/2020 15:55

It wasn't okay for your sister to keep quiet about this under the guise of 'respecting mum's wishes'. She knew she was colluding in disinheriting you and the moment your mother said 'don't tell OP' it became deceitful. A decent person would refuse a condition like that and insist you were informed about the decision once it was settled if nothing else.

Hopefully the council will see that this is obvious DOA and insist the house is sold.

As for those saying 'you didn't have a close relationship', that was her mother's fault and frankly a small inheritance would be the least that could be given in apology.

Bufferingkisses · 09/01/2020 16:12

Pp are right about deprivation of assets. My understanding is that, even after 7years, there is a sliding scale applied. Your sister may well be facing a massive can of worms.

Wrt the relationship, honestly I would suggest it us time for you to draw a lone under it all and move on with your life. Concentrate on making your life what you want it to be for yourself. Your family is never going to be what it should be, time to protect yourself now. Flowers

memberofseven · 09/01/2020 16:23

If your mums had a dementia diagnosis prior to the house gift then your sister is on shaky ground. If not, I think it's fine. It's normal tax planning to minimise inheritance tax. We don't turn 65 and then suddenly not have freedom to spend our assets and I do wish posters would stop commenting that something will be considered to be a deprivation of assets. It might well be, but there needs to be intention and there can't be intention if you are well. The seven years relates purely to inheritance tax (which the vast majority of estates will be under).

Your sister is a CF and despite what has happened should be offering to share the residue of the estate with you when the time comes not being a grabby bitch.

howabout · 09/01/2020 16:30

Your sister has done the right thing in telling you. However as pp suggest the transfer of the house to her will not prevent it being used to pay for care. It is impossible to tell if anything will be left to divide at the end.

Sounds unlikely you would be able to cope with looking after your DM in her home and probably not the best option for either of you or indeed your sister. She would have to pick up the pieces and potentially end up responsible for you also.

Grumpelstilskin · 09/01/2020 17:16

Well, I would not help with the care at all then. Let your sister deal with it all.

motherofadog · 11/01/2020 08:23

Sorry for posting and running! I was expecting notifications, didn't get any, have only just had time to look for my post. I haven't read the whole thread yet; just responding to page 1.

Thank you, lovely people. Mum is in the care home now. I can't talk to her about it because she's too confused and it would upset her too much. And it wouldn't help. I've been thinking that I should write to my sister and I probably will, when I know wtf to say.

@Slashlover, @BloggersBlog I was just being honest. It would be disingenuous to insist that I'm not bit upset about the money, given my financial situation, but there was always a possibility that the house would have to be sold to pay for care. I'm much more upset about their behaviour.

@AlsakaElfForGin is it relevant? They moved 500 miles away 20 years ago.as I said, I couldn't go with them because I couldn't take my children away from their fathers. I have one child (A) I see all the time, another (B) I see rarely because they live a long way away. My relationship with B has been difficult at times ; should I give all my (hypothetical) assets to child A and insist they don't tell child B until I die? Would you do it?

OP posts:
motherofadog · 11/01/2020 08:40

Just to make the timeline clearer, Mum gave the house to my sister 5 years ago. She was diagnosed with dementia about two years ago, I think, maybe 2.5. My sis and bil got power of attorney at about the same time, obviously while she still had capacity.

OP posts:
motherofadog · 11/01/2020 09:10

@Dustarr73, @CrazyCrazyLady I didn't leave my sister to care for my mum; they moved away. Thee was nothing I could do about it; as I explained, I had two children I couldn't take away from their fathers.

My sister hasn't put her life on hold; she has a partner, two kids, a career and a normal family life. It's only in the last couple of years Mum has needed any extra help, and only in the last year it's got really intense. My sister has never done any of the personal care; Mum had carers for that.

I can see why it looks as if I "swooped in" to grab the money, but if you read my OP properly, you'll see that I wasn't free to help until my kids left home, and they didn't need any help anyway. Now I'm free, and from my perspective, it looked as if I could actually do something to help at last.

I was not involved in their decision to move 500 miles away, and there was nothing I could do about it. Before they moved, I suggested that I could move closer to Mum (she was 70 miles away, in the same city as my older child's dad) but she clearly didn't want me to.

If inheritance is purely a payment for services rendered (it isn't), shouldn't the ten years of free childcare Mum gave my sister be taken into account?

OP posts:
GabriellaMontez · 11/01/2020 09:23

Your Mum sounds awful. I'd probably not have anything else to do with her.

I have sympathy for your sister who was put in a difficult situation by your mum. The house is your mum's to leave to who she wants. She asked your sister to keep that secret. But I'd let her know how hurtful it is. I'm not sure how I'd manage that relationship in the future.

Sorry, what a tricky situation.

maddy68 · 11/01/2020 09:33

In fairness to your mum and your sister, it seems as though your mum has advice to sign over the house (often done to offset residential care costs, and it's a sensible thing to do , otherwise the state claims your mum's house to cover costs)

That's not your sisters fault. And your mum is being sensible to do so

Your mum moved away with your sister and your mum clearly wants to recognise that by leaving the house to her

Your mum is still alive, for all you know(and entirely probable) she's left you money or other assets in her will

I totally understand you feeling very hurt but this is something to not blame your sister for at all