So minimum wage won’t be going up to £9 in April 2020 as pledged

[Lardlizard]

What a suprise
Not going to call it, living wage as it isn’t

Conservative Party Manifesto p14 for the 2019 general election:

In our first months, we announced an increase in the National Living Wage to two thirds of average earnings, currently forecast at £10.50 an hour, and widened its reach to everyone over 21. That means an average pay rise of £4,000 per year for four million people by 2024.
assets-global.website-files.com/5da42e2cae7ebd3f8bde353c/5dda924905da587992a064ba_Conservative%202019%20Manifesto.pdf

So technically it may well be correct to say Johnson didn't pledge this – his manifesto merely repeated that someone else had.

Bit like that bus saying "$350 million" and "NHS" – and Leavers turning round the next morning saying, "But we didn't say that money actually would go to the NHS."

(We even had our very own MN Leaver who said exactly that. I remember them well.)

Why are people surprised? When has Boris ever spoken a truthful word.

And?.... why is anyone surprised by this?

BTW, I sometimes see conspiro-babble along the lines that benefits only exist to foster state dependency in order to create blahblahblah-socialist-government-control (I never quite get the details).

As a PP points out, for many people, higher wages would mean they claimed less in benefits and became less dependent on the state.

In fact, the primary demand for working age benefits comes from people whose wages don't meet their essential outgoings – a significant chunk of which is usually for housing.

If TrueBlue SmallState rightwingers really did want to free the oppressed people from the moral hazard of welfare dependency, they would be in favour of higher wages and lower rents – since it's the gap between these that creates the demand.

It's within the gift of the private sector (employers and rentiers) to render workers free of the need for welfare payments.

Any takers?

Hello? Hello out there...?

As some upthread have already established this is fake news but also: can’t imagine for one minute that anyone went into the voting booth thinking about this issue. Whether blue, red or yellow there were far more pressing concerns on December 12th. (Not to belittle MW, but frankly it’s the least of our problems at the current time.)

Isn't the full time NMW salary around £16k a year? That's really quite a large sum if you're just stacking shelves, pulling pints or cleaning toilets. Where is the incentive to better yourself if you're getting a £2 per hour pay rise for nothing?

Part of the reason I didn't vote Labour was that I didn't want minimum wage to rise to £10ph. I'm on a few pounds more than that. Prices would have risen but my wages wouldn't and I (and many others like me) would have been in a worse position. It would have been great for some but terrible for others.

I own a small business and employ people for some fairly basic work, I really cant afford a minimum wage increase at the moment. I'd have to let people go.
I do have a development structure in my company and as soon as they're showing signs of progression I promote and raise their wage.
But for entry level jobs I still need a minimum wage I can afford.
Sorry if that sounds mercenary but that's the reality of a small business at the moment (well mine anyway).
Especially as of course I pay pensions, taxes (including corporation tax) and import fees.

So if you're 'just' stacking shelves or cleaning toilets you don't deserve a 'living' wage and in particular £16,000 because that's too much for just pulling pints ? I agree with the concept of self improvement but ffs if you are barely covering your living expenses, if at all, you're not going to be in the right frame of mind to better yourself.

Of course it won't, it was never their intention.

But for entry level jobs I still need a minimum wage I can afford

And people need a wage they can live off.
In a country with high employment - a job that is entry level but someone else is paying more - you have a problem

So how do you solve that?

The manifesto says by 2024. It is only 2020 so a rise each year until then.

Get your facts right OP. You look stupid.

I’m actually really pleased with my 6% pay rise.

@MissChananderlerbong It's not mercenary it's the reality.

@Katharinblum I disagree that £16k isn't enough to live on. I could live on that - I wouldn't be living the high life but I wouldn't be struggling to survive on Pot Noodles either.

Clavinova

You aren’t meant to introduce facts into the thread. It’s no fun!

So comforting to see Labour bots are still gainfully employed, as I feared they were now on the dole. Please don't let the facts get in the way - obviously fake news is more fun.

(Not to belittle MW, but frankly it’s the least of our problems at the current time.)

It wouldn't be if you were dependent on it.

Many people don’t choose to have a child on minimum wage At one time, minimum wage was entry level, and expected to be mainly young people at the beginning of their careers - indeed most supermarkets were advertising "above minimum wage salary". Now increasing numbers of jobs are MW, and increasing numbers of people are finding it difficult to get out of MW and into the diminishing number of above MW job. If we accept that MW isn't enough to bring up a child, that's a lot of people who are going to be childless, with a knock on effect to population age structure and support for those unable to work through age or infirmity. Or we accept we need a large number of young immigrants.

DerbyshireGirly you might be able to just about survive on it but what about any dependents who need to eat too, household bills, rent, unexpected outlays. Simply haven't got a clue.
And keeping mw low to encourage people to better themselves - where did such victorian attitudes suddenly come from ? Smacks of the philosophy that the poor and low paid are poor because of individual frailties, fecklessness.

Love how all the Labour bots have went silent.

Brexit Johnson has fibbed on this as well. What a surprise

That's really quite a large sum if you're just stacking shelves, pulling pints or cleaning toilets.

And what if you're 'just' a nursery nurse, or 'just' a HCA or carer or 'just' a teaching assistant?

What if 'just' being a shelf stacker is all you can manage because of your mental or physical limitations?

Everyone in work deserves a decent standard of living, whether they are 'just' pulling pints or performing brain surgery.

I disagree that £16k isn't enough to live on. I could live on that - I wouldn't be living the high life but I wouldn't be struggling to survive on Pot Noodles either.

That would be approx £1,200 a month after tax and NI, @DerbyshireGirly. In this area, you'd be very lucky to find a one-bed flat for less than £700 a month. That would leave you with £500 a month.

Council tax (less single person discount) would be around £100 pcm, at that income you wouldn't be entitled to council tax reduction. Energy costs would be around £50 pcm, approx £25 for water, tv licence £12 and a cheap mobile around £18, with good data allowance so you don't need broadband. That reduces the disposable income to just a tad under £300 a month.

Spending £30 a week on food, toiletries, cleaning materials etc would account for another £130. If you need to travel to nearest big town for work (very limited employment opportunities locally), your fares would be £25 pw, so £100 a month.

That leaves £70 a month for absolutely everything else: any leisure activities/hobbies, prescription/dental/optical charges, clothes, haircuts, holidays, replacing household stuff, travel to anywhere apart from the nearest town (you could use your saver for that!).

Yes, you could do it, just, but it would be beyond grim. I'd regard that as existing, rather than actually living.

I have colleagues living on that sort of income. They are so hard up. They have to do things like not get all the items on a prescription because they can't afford all the charges, and can't afford routine check-ups at the dentist. One colleague had to apply to HR for a hardship loan because she couldn't afford dental treatment.

Then there are the staff on approx £21k, which should be much more manageable, but they have to provide a car to do their job, so that cost wipes out their additional pay.

And keeping mw low to encourage people to better themselves ... which somehow doesn't apply at the other end of the income range, where you have to pay people more to encourage them to better themselves.