To think this is unreasonable and this judge knowingly scentenced this man to death

[Sootyandsweep2019]

Just read a heartbreaking story in the paper about an 87 year old man, who given a 27 month prison sentence after he killed someone in a car accident. The judge was warned at the time by the man's doctors that this was highly likely to lead to his death; but went ahead and did it anyway. As predicted, he died nine days later. This was not murder, this was not malicious; it was a complete, tragic accident.

By all means ban him from driving if he was a danger, look at tightening the driving regulations around older drivers.

But our obsession with "making people pay," for genuine accidents has led to this utter tragedy .

The poor man must have been terrified. I really think this particular judge/ case needs urgent investigation; and we need a wider look at whether prison is always an appropriate response to car accident s like this.

Sadly I don't expect the judge/ CPS/ solicitors etc. Feel guilty at all.

Given how rarely custodial sentences are passed out for drivers who kill, this case must have been pretty severe. Add the lack of remorse, and I have literally zero sympathy for him.

He bumped into a bollard, got angry, then got back in the car, killed someone, injured another for life, and nearly took out a father and his children who just about managed to get out of the way.

I think that the sentence was more than fair - it was reduced as he pleaded guilty (despite not apologising). We're far too lenient on drivers, particularly those that kill and maim.

Age doesn't come into it - my mom is 75, and increasingly fragile. She recognises that her reaction speed and observational skills aren't what they once were, and you know what? She stopped driving, because it's safer for everyone.

I feel sorry for the killer's family, but I feel a damn sight more sorry for his victims and their families.

Do you believe he was a danger to the public?

He hit a bollard
Almost ran over 3 people (father and children)
Did run over 1 woman
and killed one more

And you believe that he is not a danger to the public!

My Grandfather was a boy racer till the day they took his car off him, he was given a mobility scooter and he was as much of a danger on that as he was in a car.

Oh and btw OP your comments about the judge are absolutely vile. ‘Knowingly sentencing someone to death’ - utter emotive bullshit. This man was responsible for his actions, no one else. The judge knew the details of the case; all the intricacies which aren’t in the public domain and made a considered judgement based on that.

You come across as very invested in this case- as if you have some personal involvement

YABVVU

He killed someone, felt no remorse and refused to even apologise.

Of course the old bastard should go to prison.

Although I don't agree with OP, I would dispute people saying this wasn't an accident. On another thread this week where a driver did the same thing (i.e hitting the wrong pedal) causing OP to have to take emergency evasive action resulting in her suffering a serious injury, people are queuing up to say it was "just" an accident and she should suck it up.

He lived for 23 years longer than his victim!

I'm sorry this is sad however the penalties for dangerous driving in this country are really lax. It seems you kill somone in a car and it isn't a serious as any other way of killing somone whether an accident or manslaughter.

I suspect the mistake re the accelerator was due to age. He loos very fail in the photo. He should have taken more responsibility for his self and ability and stopped diving. So it does sound like manslaughter rather than a complete accident.

I am also really uncomfortable with the idea of age being a mitigating factor in sentencing. Just because you've been alive a long time means you should catch a break?

On the other hand I do understand that if the judge had been told he would die that does make the sentence way more impactful. But surely it should work that you are sentenced and the consequences of the sentence depend on your circumstances. For example it could mean a mum having children taken away.

OP I am an AIBU voter. Our dear friend was killed by an 89 year old driver this year in an "accident". He drove the wrong way.

I believe he deserves to spend the rest of his life in jail. You would not be so blase if you had seen the devastation caused to a family by someone so arrogant they refuse to believe they should no longer be behind the wheel.

We all have a responsibility to stop elderly relatives driving when they are not safe. We, not in the uk, reported my father to the police when he refused to stop driving. It was hard but it was the only way.

The Judge said she struggled with her sentence but IMHO, she made the right decision. It’s not just the act that they consider but how the defendant deals with it. He put the family through a trial and showed no remorse. Had he dealt with it differently - admitted guilt and showed a bit of remorse about what he had done, he may well have got a suspended sentence.
It was his actions that put him where he was both in terms of the act and his subsequent actions.

My grandma ( 80, very fit and active) was knocked over in the middle of a summer afternoon by a policeman who had come off-shift and been to the pub. She died two days later. He was over the limit (not much) with a breath test at the scene and taken to the police station where another test 3 hours later was under the limit. He got off scot free, never apologised even. Meanwhile my grandma suffered awful injuries and lost her life, her two daughters lost their mum, her brothers and sisters their sister and her two grandchildren their grandma.
He hit her on a crossing where the road narrows and there is a middle place for people to stand as they get half-way across.There are signs to say the road narrows, that there is a crossing and to warn drivers to slow down. There were witnesses who said he did not slow down. He claimed she walked out into the road, the witnesses said she was crossing the road when his car appeared over a 'blind incline' driving too fast. I don't know, I wasn't there. The road is overhung by trees so not great light. He did not set out to hurt anyone but he killed her, he had been drinking, he could not stop and he suffered no consequences. It was a long time ago now- 20 + years. Probably they would have other ways of checking what happened now. It felt like him being a policeman gave him some protection then. The inspector who spoke to my mum and her sister afterwards said second breath test should have happened earlier.

I should add, he wasn't arrogant but was suffering with early dementia and didn't recognise his driving was no longer up to scratch.

If anyone doesn’t believe the amount of drivers that kill and walk free

Google
Killer driver walks free

Today 11:02 Sootyandsweep2019

’No simonjt I would never murder anybody with my car, ( or anything else). If someone "murdered," a member of my family with their car, ( you know, deliberately drove into them), then of course I would want them charged with murder. But we're not talking about murder here, are we ? So muder is completely irrelevant to the discussion’

@Sootyandsweep2019 but ok for you, OP, to use totally untrue, emotive and vile language, writing that the judge ‘knowingly sentenced the man to his death’

Is it only driving offences that you think older people shouldn't be jailed for?

I know of a case where a 85 year old has recently been sentenced to a number of years which may well result in him dying in prison. Not a nice way to spend your last years, but it’s a consequence of actions.

So if someone drives into your relative and kills them while sober and in their own legally owned vehicle it's ok? You're fine with that OP? It's all just a "tragic accident"?

Owning and driving a car is a privilege. You should be fit to drive, in a car that is fit to be driven and drive by the rules. If you can't do that then you shouldn't be driving and should face the consequences.

After their Anne Soccalis remarks, I can only presume that OP made this thread with the sole intention of winding us up.

What was the purpose of locking him up ? Do you believe he was a danger to the public?

Yes. A car is a leathal weapon. He could have got back in a car and killed someone else.

I am disgusted by each and every person this thread making excuses and apologies for this. Just because he was 87. Even more reason he shouldn't be in a car. He killed so rone by his actions, he robbed another human of their life. He has left behind a legacy of grief for their loved ones. Of course he should be jailed! You can't kill someone and not be jailed in my opinion, regardless of your age. If he killed your child you wouldn't be on MN in some sort of spirit of injustice mood, you just wouldn't. I despise people who seem to side more with the criminals than the actual victims of crime. And if it had been my Grandad? Well if I loved him I would be deeply upset but that doesn't mean he shouldn't have been jailed.

I should add, he wasn't arrogant but was suffering with early dementia and didn't recognise his driving was no longer up to scratch.

This was the case with my grandfather too. My family took the car away, he wouldn't have given it up willingly but he was suffering with early dementia, he didn't realise how bad things were. There are lot of things that come into play when it comes to aging drivers. It isnt as simple as to write them off as arrogant and saying that they know they are a danger.

@ParanoidGynodroid probably

I feel it's really tragic when drivers of any age who have had a tragic accident, ( I'm not talking downing a bottle of vodka and joyriding)are imprisoned

So what you're saying is that driving over the limit, not being in control and causing a death is punishable, yet driving whilst in a rage, not being in control and causing a death is what?? just a harmless little accident? Both are preventable by the drivers not behaving like entitled dicks and BOTH had the same outcome so both should have the same punishment. An accident is when something happens that is out of the drivers control, neither of those 2 examples aren't!

I find your attitude reprehensible Op. People are responsible for their own actions and should be dealt with appropriately. Believing Anne Sacoulas shouldn't be punished for her actions is disgusting as is blaming the judge in this case when the man was clearly at fault and showed no remorse at all. He deserved his (very lenient IMO) jail time.

I see the Mumsnet jurys are out in full force but the poor sod was an old white male (their least favourite demographic).

Nope, sorry OP but YABVU.

A 84 year old woman had a "momentary lapse in concentration" and hit and killed my best friend when she was 16 years old outside of our school. She apparently was distracted for just a moment and didn't even realise she had hit my friend and continued driving, a kind stranger drove off to stop her. She placed blame on there being no crossing outside of our school. I accept that she never intended to kill my friend, but it was still manslaughter. She still drove dangerously and she deserved more than the punishment that she received in my opinion (3.5 years, she was let out after one year).

I don't care how old you are, how ill you or frail you are, whether its your first offence or not - if you commit a crime then you deserve to be punished.

YABU. He got a just punishment. I hope the victims families can move on and try to heal.