To think that it will be very difficult, if not impossible for a Labour majority again

[Rosehip10]

Even in this election the best result most labour supporters could hope for was a hung Parliament. I think it is going to be virtually impossible for labour to form a majority government again.

If you look at Labour's problems - Scotland is gone, I don't think there will ever be a time again when the vast majority of seats (or even a few) in Scotland are Labour.

Looking at the rest of the country, labour is essentially trying to appeal to two very different groups. The wants, needs and ideologies of seats like Putney, Canterbury or Cambridge (generally more middle class, wealthier, younger, higher qualifications held, more international outlook (i.e strong remain)) Vs places like Redcar, Wrexham and Workington - traditional "working class" ex-industrial seats, major economic challenges with a older, socially conservative, strong leave electorate.

I don't think any potential Labour leader can appeal to both those groups because it is probably impossible to. If you ramp up your appeal to the socially conservative group then you will bleed the middle class metropolitan and student centric seats. If this happened then a new party could rise or a party like the greens could become a major force.

Anyone got any views on this? If you are a labour voter or member what leader do you think may be able to overcome these difficulties? Is it even possible? Will the Labour party split?

England wants right wing government, it wants a denuded welfare state, it wants anti-immigrant feeling, it wants no NHS, it wants poor and disabled people to be left behind, discarded and preferably kill themselves. This is what England wants and this is what it will get
And that is why Labour will never get elected. Until they realise they are not morally superior and that they spout militant nonsense, no rational person will vote that into power. We d9nt want a dictatorship where having a different view gets you shot.

Don't* type fail there.

I am so so so sick of this drivel about terrorist sympathisers. Corbyn was not and is not a terrorist sympathiser. He met with Sinn Fein IRA members. So did Blair amd representatives of John Major. I got racially abused by English people due to having an Irish background because of the IRA, & I have never and will never support it or any other terror organisation. So yes I do think there is a strain among some English people where they actually want to hate anyone who they can put proximate to (even if for completely bogus reasons) terrorists or others against their interests.
Do you think I am a terrorist sympathiser because of my background and support for Corbyn?

Left-leaning isn’t extremist, though. There are several European countries where I believe the social spending is on a par with what Corbyn was proposing. Nobody is thinking of running a gulag here.

Regardless of the actual truth the vulgar "corbyn is a commie" stuff pumped out seemed to have an impact in northern seats.

I think the bottom line is that they won't win until they get rid of Corbyn, McDonnell and Momentum.

Labour has always been a broad church.

I think it’s perfectly possible the whole movement could be brought together again under the right leadership and with some clear, key messages about what we stand for that resonate with different parts of the electorate.

I can’t see it happening any time soon, though.

Whatever you think about Blair, ‘New Labour’ gave us some genuinely intelligent, thoughtful politicians. The current Corbyn front bench seem to me to be either as thick as two short planks or stuck in their student socialist worker party days of shouting people down.... or both.

The split is based on one group who have imposed a neoliberal ideology of identity politics over the other group who are old school socialists.

Until Labour drop Momentum and neoliberalism, they can never win a general election. Momentum should leave Labour and form their own party.

militant nonsense, no rational person will vote that into power. We d9nt want a dictatorship where having a different view gets you shot
For God's sake when did I ever say I wanted a dictatorship where having a different view gets you shot? Why do you make things up?
I don't think wanting disadvantaged people to be looked after is.militant.

Until Labour drop Momentum and neoliberalism, they can never win a general election. Momentum should leave Labour and form their own party.

Of course, in 1981, the opposite happened, when moderates left the Labour party to form the social democratic party, one of the reasons being the belief that Labour had gone too far left. Sounds familiar?

Perhaps it's time for Labour to officially split? But of course the "hard" left don't want that because they know they'll never be electable so they need to keep the "moderates" to make people believe they're not as left as they really are.

After all, they're happy to denounce Blair and "new" labour as not the real labour party. Yet were happy enough to support Blair so that they got themselves a whiff of power.

At the end of the day a "far/hard left" Labour is unelectable. The moderates need to make a decision - either take control back to work towards regaining power in 5/10 years or give up and leave Labour to the lefties to never gain power.

Labour can rule again.

However, they need sensible policies and engage again with their lost voters in the North

However, they need sensible policies and engage again with their lost voters in the North

The metropolitan elite don't even know where the north is, let alone know how to engage with them. Still, as someone from the north, this GE and the Brexit referendum at least put us back on the map and hopefully politicians of all persuasions will start thinking about policies to benefit the north, rather than everything being about London and SE, in the hope of winning seats in 5 years' time. If Boris doesn't come up with the goods, he'll quickly lose the Northern gains. If Labour don't come up with some proper policies (not just benefits and NHS), they won't regain the lost Northern seats.

@user1497207191 So what in your opinion does "the north" want?

I speak as a Tory voter.

It is absolutely important that the Labour party regroups, finds a middle ground and comes back strong. Without them, there's no real opposition and that sort of unchecked power is never good. Especially for the Tories.

I'm a labour member, looking back through history when there have been some disastrous election results, the next election they have won by a landslide. This time they offered too much, hopefully a new leader like Keir Starmer, some new faces on the front bench & some less radical ideas will bring them back again. I haven't lost any faith in the Labour movement & believe they will regroup & return.

So what in your opinion does "the north" want?

Investment in better public transport. Incentives for businesses to move/grow in the regional towns & cities. That's two for a start. We desperately need reasons for the young to stay in the area they were born rather than be forced to go to the already over crowded london/se for decent jobs.

My only saving grace is I still have my lovely Labour MP who doesn't take any crap from the Tories, she will fight tooth & nail for this area & I live in a mainly Labour city.

alanis never said you said that did I? I was alluding to the militant "you're racist, uncaring, scum" etc, simply for not voting Labour. Which is bollocks. It's simply a difference in how to run the country.

I think labour can do it again, but they need to move to a more centralist position, where the tories basically are. The issue is Corbyn and his cronies are hell bent on ensuring their legacy lives on in the new leader, which as their own back benchers are saying, will likely count them out for at least the next ten years.

Britain never has and never will be w hard core socialist society. Any party touting it will sway the fanatics and alienate the masses.

alanis never said you said that did I? I was alluding to the militant "you're racist, uncaring, scum" etc, simply for not voting Labour. Which is bollocks. It's simply a difference in how to run the country.
You put in a response to my posting! Which.makes it very much look like you want to associate me with those views, which I don't have.

'the North' want proper public transport systems, investment in East to West not just rail lines that go to London. Scrap HS2.

Businesses to come here and stay.

I'd like for people in London and SE, but particularly politicians to take time to understand life here. Understand why so many of us have to drive and can't use public transport. Find out what happens over generations when a village or town relies on one industry that is now gone.

In 2005 the tories only had 30% (roughly) of the vote and look at them now 😏 stuff changes, Labour will sort itself out

I live in one of the former staunch Labour seats that has fallen to the Tories. To be frank, the majority of people around here are small minded, ignorant, massively racist, hate everything and anything different or new and are very resistant to change. The population here are aging because most youngster move away as soon as they get the chance.

They will soon start whinging when Boris doesn’t start delivering Brexit the way they want and they get poorer. I can’t say I will have much sympathy.

alanis I was associating the attitude of tory voter = right wing, racist, scum, uncaring with it, rather than you specifically. My apologies, genuinely did not mean to do that.

Honestly I think Labour should disband. Scotland will leave the UK as it should, why should they stay now in union with a country which thinks so differently. England deserves to have permanent Tory government. Labour is dead, and so is Britain.