Boiled eggs on a train court case

[Iamthewombat]

Does anybody else feel sorry for the woman prosecuted for objecting (quite vigorously, I admit) to somebody eating smelly hard boiled eggs on an early morning train?

www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/city-worker-flew-into-rage-at-commuter-over-boiled-eggs-breakfast-on-train-from-chelmsford-to-a4284821.html

Because I do.

The boiled egg eater is the very definition of a drama queen. According to the story, she had already been told by a different passenger that the smell of her eggs was offensive but carried on regardless.

After being challenged by the woman who was later prosecuted, she pretended that she couldn’t speak English, then told the police about the altercation. Then pointed the other woman out to police when she saw her on the train five days later!

I know who I support, and it’s not the anti-social egg eater. Who apparently had to eat her eggs in a public place ‘because of her diet’.

I skimmed it.

Yes that’s wrong / but why can’t people also use common sense and understand that eggs stink?

There are people on here saying they like or don't mind the smell of eggs, and people saying the smell of bananas/tea/coffee/chicken make them gag. You can't legislate for every individual's specific likes and dislikes. It's not about 'common sense'.

Presea It went to a crown court!! With a jury. Dread to think of the costs involved for this when so much worse doesn't get to court. While the woman who was verbally abusive was of course out of order, I'd have expected the British Transport Police to have served a PND for this - minimal fine but making the point and no criminal conviction; if you don't pay that at first they can increase it (like traffic fines) and if you still don't pay, then it might go to court. Even regardless, I'd have said magistrate's court would have been sufficient for this case.

Wow! I'm shocked that a bunch of grown adults have such a pathetic reaction to someone eating a healthy snack! I might find the smell of some aftershaves or perfume noxious but I don't demand people stop wearing it! Some people seriously need to find something important to moan about!

Ok, That’s insane. Like I said I skimmed it, so didn’t catch the jury bit. I just saw court and fine, so just assumed it was a summary in front of a magistrate. That’s so excessive

If you harass someone while they go about their lawful business, you have broken the law
Then it is time the law is changed so that unscrupulous provocation is considered an offense too.

I feel sorry for the prosecuted woman. She behaved completely appallingly, needs anger management course law and may or may not be racist (those claims were dismissed), but prosecuted? Really? When the police is too busy to deal with burglaries and theft? We have had experience of both and the police had zero time.

Did I understand it correctly that the egg eater was asked (Presumably politely) to close her box by another commuter, ignored it and when the woman asked her, she pretended not to speak English? And then, when the woman tried to confirm that she understood, she decided this was racism?

I think they should be forced to spend two hours together doing some community service, hopefully both improve their manners and stop wasting the courts’ time. (Putting on tin hat)

For the record, without the prosecution, I would feel sorry for the egg eater and probably intervened if I had been there

I hate the smell of coffee. Can we ban drinking coffee too, please?

Or maybe I will just continue to accept that my dislike of it doesn't trump someone else's right/need/want to drink the vile stinky stuff.

So she concocts a cock and bull story about feeling ‘threatened and intimidated’ and because she was asked whether she spoke English, decided to season the complaint with a bit of pretend racism. Then goes crying to the first police officer she sees, and when that doesn’t work, looks out for the other woman for days afterwards to make sure that she is punished.

Well the court found the abusive woman guilty so.it can't have been that much of a cock and bull story can it? Why are you so.keen to defend the abusive woman who has been found guilty?

Why are people comparing the smell of eggs to the smell of bananas and coffee? If you dont like those smells, you are probably in a minority. However a MAJORITY of people would say eggs smell far worse.

So many selfish people on one thread. Ludicrous. Bet they all shout on the phone whilst eating eggs aswell

Have farts been mentioned yet?

Hate to lower the tone, but if someone has a bowel condition that causes wind problems, or even if they just find it difficult or painful to keep wind in - are they to expect ranty complaints and criminal cases because of the smell?

Just asking for a friend...

How the fuck can people deny that boiled eggs stink??? I just don't believe it. They must be wind up merchants!

With the caveat that I have no more access to facts than anyone else on this thread, I would hazard a guess that the convicted lady was offered an earlier chance to plead guilty, and rather than take it and the smaller sentence decided to put it to a jury - at which point the wheels did rather come off the case.

If I were invited to speculate further, I would imagine it was against legal counsel.

And given that background, I would not be surprised if the convicted lady continues going around telling everyone how biased everyone else is, and how she never stood a chance because and how it's political correctness gone mad, or some other trope to try and disguise the fact that at the end of the day, 12 fairly normal people did not agree with her.

I wonder if she was offered a chance to apologise and admit guilt before it even got to court ? Which would have ended in a caution. Still an admittance of guilt, but a much cheaper way of getting there.

Why are people comparing the smell of eggs to the smell of bananas and coffee? If you dont like those smells, you are probably in a minority. However a MAJORITY of people would say eggs smell far worse.

I 'compared' them in the sense that there are people on here who gag at the smell of bananas and coffee (among other things).
I don't know about a 'majority' of people thinking eggs smell worse; everyone has smells they like and smells they don't like/can't handle.

But it's immaterial really. Until or unless all food and drink is banned on public transport, we all need to just put up with it a bit.

The whole thing is ridiculous, and a massive waste of tax payers money.

However, smell and taste is subjective and personal. What is offensive to one person isn't to another, and vice versa.

Have farts been mentioned yet?

We were waiting for you

The problem some people have - and it's understandable if you don't like the law - is that once you have a binary "legal/illegal" view of the world, like what the law does - it's impossible to impose any sense of nuance on it. So trying to establish the "Mumsnet scale of offence" in a handy cut-out-and-keep form for jurors to use in such trials isn't going to work.

If there is a scale of harm, then it has to be clearly laid out in the law - like the various forms of assault or thresholds for damages. (I get personally enraged seeing people read the Mail or Telegraph on trains, for example, but they're legal for now.)

A lot of people commenting about "in public", but the technically this happened on a train - which is a specially constructed environment as far as the law is concerned. I really have too much to live for to wade through train operator Terms of Carriage, but it's entirely possible there is something buried in there about "unreasonable conduct". However that would be a civil matter between the train operator and the passenger.

unscrupulous provocation

Eating an egg?

Ah @ProfessorSlocombe, I'm glad you waited!

My...ah...friend...yes, friend, has a problem with wind. Not a diagnosed condition, so not medically protected, but it can cause extreme pain or even be passed involuntarily. And stinks.

Could I...I mean, my friend...be prosecuted if someone decided to narrow down where the smell was coming from and complain? It's the same principle, isn't it?

She was cleared of a racially aggravated public order offence

Ah right. With a potential 'hate crime' box to tick the CPS will have left their senses at the door and gone in all guns blazing.

They recently pursued a case of 'transphobic hate crime' against a trans person. The judge threw it out and awarded costs against the CPS.

joaniwalsh.com/uks-first-transphobia-trial-thrown-out-trans-defendant-says-it-was-the-worst-10-months-of-my-life/

Could I...I mean, my friend...be prosecuted if someone decided to narrow down where the smell was coming from and complain? It's the same principle, isn't it?

That's the opposite of the case in hand, where the person complaining ended up in the dock. No one suggested the victim had done anything unlawful. Anti social, possibly. But not in contravention of a law.

In the case your friend describes, they would similarly have done nothing wrong.

There will be a clause in the train operators Terms of Carriage around "nuisance" - it's a given. But there are also clauses about getting the fucking train to it's destination on time, and reserving seats too, so you can work out how enforceable they are.

Ah right. With a potential 'hate crime' box to tick the CPS will have left their senses at the door and gone in all guns blazing.

The usual routine will be the convicted lady would have been offered a series of options to choose from before embarking on destination Crown Court. She could have accepted the behaviour and rejected the aggravating charge and most likely would have got a caution for the former and latter dropped.

By choosing to fight it all the way, both charges were put on the sheet. And a jury clearly felt there wasn't enough evidence to support the charge. Maybe they're all racists themselves ? Or maybe their view of what "racist" is, doesn't square with the CPS and the victims. Generally we have to suck up what other people tell us is -ist. But a jury has a unique opportunity to make it's own mind up in defiance of all and sundry. If it wants to.

*unscrupulous provocation

Eating an egg?*

Ignoring requests from other travellers, pretending not to speak English, bringing up racism, all attitude showing contempt.

I've read the Times report on this and am not really any the wiser why this ended up in court. Can only think the egg-eater is married to a Crown Prosecutor...

Ignoring requests from other travellers

What, do we have to accommodate all requests now? Don’t be silly

pretending not to speak English

She said she was confused and intimidated and English isn’t her first language

bringing up racism

Well I can see why she thought that.

None of that shows all ‘contempt’ and no eating an egg is not unscrupulous provocation, you’re sounding a bit unhinged.