About homeless people?

[Catabogus]

Am I being unreasonable (or more likely, dim) not to understand why there are now so many more homeless people on the streets than there were 10 years ago?

I’m partly talking about London - I have started going semi-regularly in the early morning for work, and I am shocked to see very how many people there are now obviously sleeping on the streets. It’s far, far more than 10 years ago.

But I’m also talking about the much smaller city where I live. There are now people almost ‘camping’ in doorways: they’ve set up sleeping bags and boxes and cardboard and are obviously there night after night, in the cold and rain.

There have always been one or two well-known “tramps” in my city, and one younger man who was suspected of actually having a nice home to go to at night despite making money from begging in the day, but these are now young and old, men and women, far more than I’ve ever seen before, and they are clearly living year round, day and night, in all weathers, on the streets.

AIBU to be shocked? Are we going backwards as a society? Is it the benefits system that is failing and causing this? Or other things I’m missing? I feel really depressed about it.

It's all to fo with drugs. The majority have been offered places to go but they wont accept the homes / placements as they come with a no drugs to be taken on the premises caveat. It's got nothing to do with Tory Britain!

Someone upthread mentioned low quality benzos, not come across that.

A lot of people round my way seem to favour drugs that promote highs and aggression.

There’s so many issues surrounding this, I went to Manchester Xmas market years ago & there was hundreds of homeless people, mire than I’d ever seen. It’s heartbreaking to think some will freeze to death over Xmas. At the end of the day that person is someone’s so/daughter, brother/sister & for whatever reason have found themselves in the situation.

Bedroom tax, universal credits delay payments, shelters won’t allow drink/drug users. More & note unemployed asking for houses as they’ve had children causing an overall shortage of accommodation.

Councils selling council houses to people who’ve lived in them for years for next to nothing. Then these council houses are not being replaced just sold. More & more help to buy houses that are overpriced, many working class can not afford them they need council houses. The systems a joke!

Most of the homeless people I've encountered in Manchester are British. There's a group of them who operate in my area - I recognise their faces. One is a young girl who usually hangs around with an older man. She asked me for money to 'get home' once, but evidently she never did. There's also a huge spice epidemic in Piccadilly Gardens. There have always been beggars here, including the Eastern European gangs - although I've seen less of them lately - but it's noticeably gotten worse. I'm sceptical of all the stories about fake beggars because I honestly don't know why anyone would choose to do it, especially right now because it's so bitterly cold. Why would you want to sit in the freezing cold and rain for hours, nothing to do, being ignored by people and moved on by the police, barely anything to eat, and having to rely on the odd bit of change (because people barely carry change now)?

@philswagielka there was so many & it was freezing, not one of them asked us for money. I saw an elderly man in the car park sat in the corner on his own he was freezing I made my DP go to the cash point & get some money for him. I know people say you shouldn’t but he looked genuinely homeless he had a small bag, sleeping bag that was filthy, his clothes were torn & dirty. He must have been 70-75 it broke my heart.

One of my family members was on class A drug’s for years, made homeless lost his wife & kids. Just because he is on drugs does that mean he should live on the streets & freeze to death? No! But unfortunately at the moment there is literally no other option - it’s so sad

1. Relationship breakups. Unexpected illness. Redundancy and job losses. Zero hours contracts.

Anyone who thinks homelessness can't happen to them and they're utterly untouchable might want to check that their relationships, with spouse, significant other, family, whoever, are quite as stable and secure as they think they are. Even millionaires can lose money and experience relationship breakups, and beauty, intelligence and education are no guarantee that you will always have a roof over your head. And even millionaires will probably find that environmental issues are going to have an impact on their cosy little lives any day now. Even business people (not necessarily millionaires) in Sheffield have been affected by the floods, for instance. I don't think the Rivers Don, Ouse and the rest are going to take any note whatsoever of filthy lucre, somehow...

1. The Tories. Austerity. The window tax. Universal credit. Cutbacks in public services. Combined with an "I'm all right Jack sod you it's your own fault for being stupid enough to end up homeless of course it would never happen to me I'm far too perfect" attitude prevalent amongst people who evidently don't get out much.

But hey, keep voting them back in, why don't you. As long as it doesn't affect you.

1. Not building enough social housing.

1. Pretty much everything being centred on London and a small number of other major urban centres (Bristol, Manchester, Cardiff, Glasgow being just a few examples although most are south of the Humber). Meaning there aren't that many job opportunities in many places, or it's very seasonal, like Cornwall.

1. Leaving the Armed Forces and other institutions e.g long-term foster care.

1. The housing market. Nobody talks about this much but in the longer term it's one of the reasons why people have ended up homeless. Since 2001, landlords have got greedier and greedier and people have started regarding bricks and mortar not as a home but as an ATM; Air BnB has also taken off as a "side hustle" in many places. Those of you who've suddenly noticed an increase of homeless folk in your towns and cities, has it coincided with an increase in Air BnBs, by any chance? And many landlords won't take benefits claimants, just as they won't take families with kids, or pets.

1. The truly ludicrous cost of living in the UK. The fact that so many places have had their hours cut back - lots of shopping centres will move the homeless on, and just have a look at how many libraries have closed, one of the few places left in the UK where you don't have to spend money to be welcome.

1. The poster wondering about why homeless folk like a lot of sugar in their tea/coffee/hot chocolate - sugar is one of the few comforts left that is still relatively affordable and gives you a huge energy boost. (Not as good as peanut butter, but not far off.)

And people being snooty about folk on the streets taking alcohol, drugs, whatever, for "charidee", it might be enlightening for you to go and spend a night or two outdoors in the freezing cold with no money and nothing between you and the elements but a sleeping bag or a bit of canvas. I'm fairly sure you'd be taking whatever you could get to just get through the hours too.

(Oh, and for the purposes of this experiment, you are not allowed to ring your spouse or other relatives up, weeping down your iPhone, to come and collect you.)

I have come very close to homelessness twice. I'm educated, reasonably intelligent, and have family - although it was due to friends that I'm not on the street. Evidently coming close to homelessness was all my own fault though and nothing whatsoever to do with any of the above.

Thank you canny I never knew but that makes absolute sense. I always grab a handful of sugar packets anyway. Re the drugs I'm not being at all snooty - I know just comforting it is (I'm actually getting back on script and rattling a bit myself, as my last relapse increased my tolerance hugely). I don't condemn anyone for using and my reluctance to give money isn't from a sense that I still want to dictate what that money goes on.
It's more that many addicts use heroin, and gear is cut with all kinds of shit. I have a friend who's urine sample showed traces of fentanyl because that's what the gear was cut with - fentanyl kills. So does rat poison, and I'd absolutely hate it if I contributed to someone's death in that way. If there was a way to buy methadone or subbies or gear not cut with poison, I would happily hand over money.
Good tip around the peanut butter, too thank you. They do peanut butter bars and chocolate bars now so I could always offer those too, after checking allergies of course

It's got nothing to do with Tory Britain!

You should be on the stand-up circuit with comedy lines like that.

"It's got nothing to do with Tory Britain!

You should be on the stand-up circuit with comedy lines like that."

Well, when you know that every one of the homeless people in my city have been offered homes or placements over and over again and they prefer to not accept them, you tend to think it isn't actually the governments fault. The government has the resources and has offered them to the homeless and they wont accept .

Well, when you know that every one of the homeless people in my city have been offered homes or placements over and over again and they prefer to not accept them

You know every one of the homeless people in your city do you? Wow.

*It's got nothing to do with Tory Britain!

You should be on the stand-up circuit with comedy lines like that*

Why is it the tory’s fault? Genuine question. What are they doing to cause homelessness that a labour government didn’t/wouldn’t?

I see “it’s the tories!” increasingly as an “explanation” for a lot of issues. Thing is there’s a lot of “knock on” effects- for example I worked in the nhs in the late 90’s-2010 and saw the labour policy of back door privatisation, and mismanagement of budgets. Some of which the NHS is now struggling to get out from under. Yet the state of the NHS is “the tories!!”

Full disclosure- i am neither a labour of conservative fan. I will not and can not vote for a party led by BJ next month, and will probably need to vote labour in my constituency to keep them out. But I’d like to know what I’m voting for.

"You know every one of the homeless people in your city do you? Wow."

I said if you know that everyone of them have been offered homes or placements... not that I know every one of them.

@Madein1995 I'm the same about street drinkers because my mum being an alcoholic has made me more sympathetic to addicts - she's lucky in that she's got a good support network. She's been in rehab a couple of times and she's been on the wagon for 2 years. Quite a few men she met there had been homeless. Nearly everyone in one place had been raped or sexually abused, men and women both. Tbh if I was living on the street, I'd drink for the simple reason that it warms you up.

Good point about the sugar - if I buy a homeless person coffee/tea, I'll get some sugar for them as well. Even if they don't drink it, it'll keep their hands warm.

bluebluezoo try reading the thread, where there are plenty of detailed explanations of why austerity, which is a Tory ideological choice not an economic necessity, has had such an adverse impact on homelessness.

A lot of homeless people in London boroughs get paid for one way tickets to the nearest town if winter accomodation can’t be found which I think can explain some of the seasonal increases in London commuter towns.

TabbyMumz, as I'm sure you realise, the question is how do you know that every homeless person in your city has been offered homes or placements?

I want to know which city has enough housing stock that they've offered every homeless person appropriate accommodation. Please do share Tabby, they could help people in other areas if it's apparently just sitting there empty...

@DarlingNikita and @mrsmaiselsmuff.......I'd rather not say as want to remain confidential on here. We know the exact number of true homeless in our city and they have all been offered placements /accommodation on a number of occasions and they wont accept because of drug taking /begging. The other people who appear to be homeless already have homes or bus themselves in every day to beg, then return to other towns etc which are outside of our area. I suspect they have been offered accommodation in their areas too. They have also been offered drug rehab and other support and food vouchers etc.

That's convenient, Tabby...

In any case, 'drug taking /begging' are symptoms of a bigger problem and absolutely have to do with the prevailing economic/political/ideological situation.

You're not going to be identified by telling us the city you're referring to.

If you can't provide any evidence to support your claims then we can safely assume you're lying.

@mrsmaiselsmuff......what benefit would I have to lie? I have no need to tell you and I'd rather not thanks. Suffice to say I know it to be true and I have no need to try and convince you certainly as you seem determined not to believe it. I suspect other cities are the same.

"In any case, 'drug taking /begging' are symptoms of a bigger problem and absolutely have to do with the prevailing economic/political/ideological situation."

If you really think so, fair enough. I tend to think that drugs are unfortunately prevalent everywhere these days, pubs, parks, kids playgrounds, you name it. I'm tending to not think that's the result of any politics. But if others believe differently that's fair enough.

I know of one particular homeless person that support workersxm went out to three times in one day to try and convince him to take the accommodation and he just wouldnt.

We also have a centre where they can go during the day for a shower, food and to get fresh clothes, and keep their belongings safe. Some of them prefer not to shower or to take the clothes.

Insecurity of employment. Can be sacked at any time without reason in first 2 years. The gig economy and zero hours contracts. Astronomical rents and high up front deposits (up to £200 a week for a room in shared temporary accommodation or a hostel) so that if you have any unexpected bill you quickly fall into arrears, Universal Credit doesn't work, so instead of being able to take any job that comes along and have your earnings topped up you end up being overpaid, underpaid or signed off and taking weeks to sign back on, meanwhile you get evicted.