Too hate the “never did me any harm” brigade

[lastqueenofscotland]

You know the type
“I drank through all my 72784 pregnancies and all my children are fine.”
“I never vaccinated my kids and they are healthy”
“My Nan smoked 749298492838 a day and had the lungs of an 18 year old.”

Personal anecdotes do not outweigh often decades and decades of research. There are always outliers.
And if people want to engage in risky behaviour that could potentially harm their unborn child or increases their chances of developing diseases, crack on. But don’t try and justify it by arguing with the science

I think people are conflating 2 issues here.

Yes research has shown that some things people used to do might not have been in the baby/child's best interest. Technology has meant things like car seats are much safer when used correctly. My dad is amazed that we survived with a metal contraption held together with gaffa tape. But no one batted an eyelid in the 80s!

However life was not necessarily easier or more difficult, it was just very different. Mothers generally didn't work, but had far less help at home. Including things like dishwashers, robot vacuums etc. Instead that was pure manual labour. Don't forget many households had one car so shopping etc was done on foot, again usually by the women. A lot of women did "cope" better with a different lifestyle with different stresses.

Sleep training was more popular and babies were left to cry under medical advice. To be honest I think a lot of people nowadays do respond to every little squeal rather than giving baby a few minutes to see if it's a grumble or a proper cry.

I get everything other people have said and it's not always 'oldies' who make such remarks; I'm an oldie, have never said them neither have my friends but I have heard them occasionally & its often quite surprising.

Another thing I don't like is: "You're hyper sensitive, you need to grow another skin", usually said by a tactless bully (who is very sensitive to criticism).

Whatever's people did "before" worked within the parameters of that time, no doubt in 30 years time there will be a lot of scoffing about today's practices. Lumping everyone in as a "brigade" is rude and disrespectful of the people who raised families in a different time.

One I heard the other day
" my midwife said it was fine for me to smoke weed throughout my pregnancy as it's better than drinking , drinking is actually more dangerous for the baby than weed"
Unfuckingbelievable

YANBU. My mum is wonderful but was baffled by my recurrent miscarriages. She was hugely sympathetic but apparently no one had miscarriages in her day. Of course they did. They didn’t talk about them.

MN thrives on the anecdote. My MIL is horrible therefore all MILs are horrible. I had an abusive ex partner therefore all partners are abusive.
When it comes down to it , most advice from posters, is based on anecdotal evidence.

I agree TeacherMaths but there's a difference between things being done the old way but now new guidlines are in place and they're ignored. I don't so much mind the comments from the older generation saying something like 'in my day, we did it X way and my kids never came to any harm but I've now heard that X is the better way to do it so my DIL or DD does it that way and I can see why'. It's the comments that say 'in my day we did it X way and my kids never came to any harm and I think everyone is being over the top these days abiding by all the new guidlines', that pisses me off.

Since when has it been over the top or a bad thing to follow guidelines? Re the crying thing, I don't have much experience on that as my son didn't cry a lot as a baby so I never had to consider letting him cry it out or anything so I can't really say anything on that. It's the more serious stuff that annoys me like smoking, drinking, car seats, formula preparation etc and not so much how to handle crying, a baby that won't sleep and how to wean - purees over finger foods and stuff. I would always take advice from someone that has experience (so older generation) when it comes to crying, sleeping and weaning but not their 'my kids came to no harm' over car seats and smoking in pregnancy for example.

I think you just have to accept that things change. My DM did things differently to me, and I am sure my DD's will do it differently again.

I also think that there are some things which are indisputable, smoking in pregnancy, lying babies on their back. And other things which are more grey areas ie: weaning.

NHS guildelines are just that, they are guidelines and often change, they are often different in different parts of the world. WHO guidelines are particularly nebulous in that they make no distinction between third and first world countries. They are based on the best available evidence of the time and local health care services provide their best estimate based on that data. As a mum, you have to weigh up that guidance, and then decide whether you follow it, wholly, partially, or whether you feel able to ignore it. Many things are judgement calls.

What actually annoys me more, is the slavish adhesion to "guidelines" and the vilification of those who do not follow it to the letter of the law.

@AnneLovesGilbert

I think a lot of women had early miscarriages but thought of them more as a late period. Many women weren't so aware of their own biology as we are now. Mum said they didn't even see a midwife unless they had missed at least 2 periods. Nowadays we can know if we are pregnant almost before our period arrives. A lot of women genuinely didn't realise they were miscarrying especially in the early stages of pregnancy.

I would always take advice from someone that has experience (so older generation) when it comes to crying, sleeping and weaning but not their 'my kids came to no harm' over car seats and smoking in pregnancy for example.

That's a great way of putting it. I agree.

I dunno - some things yes but not all.

The backwards facing car seat thing - have people weighed up the likelihood of them having an accident against their poor child being uncomfortable on every single car journey 365 days a year.

Sometimes we are trying to rule out every eventuality of death meaning it diminishes our enjoyment of life.

It strikes me - a younger relative is currently pregnant - that many women are now a lot more anxious and fearful in relation to having children, than seemed to be the case when I was expecting a child nearly twenty-five years back.

I am not sure that the constant stress and anxiety - Should I have eaten this? Should I have done that? - is good for the mother or the developing baby.

I would find some of todays guidelines unworkable though. I’m told by a friend who’s pregnant that young babies must only be in a car seat for 30 minutes max, preferably only 20 mins. Hardly enough time to get them in the car and get to the shop / school / doctors, let alone do what you need to do there and then get home again. Though I don’t say “1 hour never did mine any harm”, I’m more likely to say “wow that sounds challenging, how do you manage a trip out?”

I hate this: especially when people say it about smacking. I often respond with questions about said persons generation in general; are they a generation without crime and mental health problems etc.
It’s just a flawed argument and gives people a reason to give others a hard time just because they had a hard time themselves.

I don't have a blanket hatred of it. There are lots of stuff we did as DCs that didn't do us any harm but seem to be unthinkable to younger generations from playing outside all day to not having a TV/phone/electronics in your bedroom.

I think it’s because we don’t have as many children.

We can’t afford to take risks.

DH sister didn’t come to our wedding because she wouldn’t put the baby in the car seat for longer than 2.5 hours.

I am sorry but I travelled round NZ with my 9 week old, and either stop half way on the 5 hour trip or do a fucking stopover 🙄

I'm very pregnant right now and the "advice" I've received is partially annoying. Things like max time in a car seat, rear facing past when they're tiny, cot bumpers. My standard response is well the advice has now changed and I wouldn't forgive myself for not following it. And repeat. My mum is particularly baffled by cot bumpers as the cot "looks cold" and he'll "bang his head".

I hate the meme on Facebook about all this.
Rose tinted specs the lot of it and short memories. I'm fairly old and I don't recall much of this stuff : it was just different times that's all really. There may not have been many rules about health and safety but it doesn't mean it was a good thing.
My mum judged people that smoked. Mostly because it was expensive and anti social. It's nice to go out and not come home smelling like an old ashtray.
I don't think it was any happier either! Just more things were covered up.

I never had a cot bumper 22 years ago - they looked fucking dangerous.....

My IL's, who are doctors, asked to limit making to the conservatory as we had small babies upstairs, said to both DH and have sibling 'our smoking never did you any harm' ... and they're doctors ffs

This isn't an AIBU - it's just an echo chamber of "oldies" bashing. There's no discussion just a bitch fest against the older generation.

Bollocks! My parents are ‘oldies’ and yet are all for change for the better.

My dad was always checking DD’s car seat was tight enough. My mum helped me research the best way to wean DD. Research helps us move on from methods that are dangerous/don’t work.

We know alcohol is bad during pregnancy. We know some foods are bad during pregnancy. We know violent (any form of physical punishment is violent) forms of discipline are bad for children. We know that weaning too early can be dangerous for babies. We know that there are increased risks with forward-facing car seats or having young babies in car seats for too long. We know that cot bumpers, laying them on their tummies, using pillows, etc. increases risks of SIDS.

If you want to put your child at risk, then more fool you but don’t recommend that others do the same. The research is there for a reason.

DD had a cot bumper and was forward-facing before 1yo. I didn’t know the research at the time and I’m forever grateful that she’s ok.

DD had a cot bumper and was forward-facing before 1yo. I didn’t know the research at the time and I’m forever grateful that she’s ok

Seriously? It’s this that does my head in - there will be a lot more danger in life for her to overcome other than this.

I hate those comments scout depression too. I think a lot of it comes from people who secretly struggled with it and now feel jealous and resentful thar they did not have access or opportunity for the help we now face available and the freedom to say openly how we feel

How smug. Victim-blaming people who had MH problems and then accusing them of being jealous that they didn't have access to help. Fuck me, that's vile!!