Anyone with insomnia/sleep issues/take sleeping tablets for advice

[sundowners]

Hi
I have had sleep maintenance insomnia- ie. I wake 2-5 am and never get back to sleep for a year. Think it was triggered by a high intensity period of stress/worry which has then altered my body clock permanently into thinking waking so early is ok. Im about to start counselling. Tried everything else- Sleepeaze, Nytol, candles, sprays, melatonin so please don't suggest that!

Been treated by a sleep clinic- nothing has worked apart from sleeping tablets.

I started taking a month ago off and on- Zopiclone. Now taking say 5 nights out of 7- tried without it last night and I was up tossing/ turning all night. Literally did not drop off once.

I have 2 young DC/work part time and am so chronically shattered I just cant imagine doing without them right now. I thought given the amount of pre Christmas events/build up/kids days out and Christmas day itself I'll take until Christmas day, then from Christmas over 5 days gradually try to reduce my dose to wean myself off them? As DH will be off work so thought even if I don't sleep (much) during that period at least he'd be around to help with kids during day so I could try and get some rest then. I don't really get affected in day in a negative way after taking them, other then the metallic taste in mouth.

I clearly remember waking after another awful night of barely any sleep Christmas day last year, plastering my face with thick make up to try and hide my eye bags (doesn't work!) drinking to get me through it and feeling utterly shattered and depressed at how rubbish my sleep is. I just don't want to feel depressed on Christmas day- or special pre Christmas family/friends events again.

Would be so grateful for your thoughts and info about how you manage tour sleep/taking tablets etc?

You can only get melatonin on prescription in the uk for some reason, it's called Circadin. Not sure why though as in many countries you can easily buy it otc and in high strength 10mg tablets. The Circadin ones prescribed in the uk are only 2mg I think.

Try a weighted blanket. Worked wonders for my DH who struggled with insomnia.

I get what people are saying about trying to reduce your anxiety about not sleeping but I find this difficult.

I have a 1.5 hr commute in the car each morning and have previously fallen asleep at the wheel (thankfully when in slow traffic so no harm done) but that means not sleeping is potentially life threatening

@1300cakes

Thats true but an equally distressing part for me is just getting through the night. I know this sounds ridiculous but it's just so bloody boring. Lying in the dark still for 4-8 hours is horrible.

When at The Priory for my bipolar a psychologist told me that if I really felt like I wouldn't sleep I should get up and do something like read (nothing too energetic and nothing involving screen time). As otherwise you start to associate being in the bedroom with not sleeping.

Try getting up and having a hot milky drink (I just drink hot milk with a bit of sugar in) and read by a dim light until I feel like I might be able to sleep.

OP what dosage of mirtazapine were you given? It's far more sedating at lower doses, at higher ones it can become quite activating. You might be able to get away with as low at 3.75mg for sleep.

I’ve been on sleeping tabs for 4 years 10mg a night. Saved my life. I have a very friendly doctor though so that helps! I can’t even think about coming off them. I have tried some nights without them and I don’t sleep at all so they are clearly very addictive.

@Miketv3 what tablets are you on? Zopiclone 10mg is huge!

Zolpidem which are similar. I’ve always been on the 10mg.

After 4 years they still take an hour to work. When I first started them I was asleep in 10 mins.

I have no side effects though and can still wake up after a few hours if needs be.

I was in a very bad place sleep wise a few years ago and it had a major impact on my MH so for me they have saved my life and if they knock a few off the other end then that’s a risk worth taking for me.

People who sleep do not understand properly what it is like to not sleep. I could go 72 hours without any sleep. Clearly that’s not good for you!

Op amiltripryline is better than mirtazapine. The weight gain is not worth it. I put on 25 pounds in 6 weeks at a time when I had been doing really well with weightloss.

I take amiltriptyline for both not going to sleep and also waking up at 3 or 4am. I suffer from both other the course of a week. It has helped alot.

But I'm interested in the zolpidem. It sounds like it would work better, the only side effect for me is weight gain but not as much as mirtazapine.

Magnesium has been the magic bullet for me and I had the same type of insomnia as you, OP. I tried it sceptically in desperation, having had zopiclone in the past, and always kept a stash of Nytol in the bedside drawer - and oh my God, the difference it has made. If I wake up at night, I'm back to sleep within twenty minutes - half an hour. I wouldn't be without it now.

Order Melatonin from Biovea.I have tried the 10mg ones,work a treat but left me feeling groggy the next day so halved it,still felt a bit groggy.So,have just ordered the low dose one 3mg I,think.

I only take it when I am desperate,about once every 3months.

Biovea is an excellent company.

I'm a lifelong insomniac but in the past 2 years I've had breakthroughs. I have to be really strict on the lifestyle stuff below or it comes back:

No alcohol
Consistent weekday wake up of 5.30am, 6.30am on weekends
No caffeine after 9am
30 mins+ exercise a day, ideally outside, even if just a walk
Exposure to morning light
No food after 7pm
Electronics go away at 7pm
A weighted blanket

@TheOnlyLivingBoyInNewCross - what dosage of magnesium do you take! I’ve just started taking it (last night was the first night) and wasn’t sure. I did sleep but woke up multiple times but did get back to sleep again quite quickly. Thanks!

@sundowners. Did your Dr say it was ok to take mirtrazapine with Zopiclone? Just wondered how you got on with it? In v similar situation an Dr prescribed both but said not to take at same time.. Mirtrazapine was working well for me for a week but last 2 nights have been v bad again. How is it working for you?

I think the current one is 250mg

I bought melatonin from the states and take that and sominax from boots
I bought 4 bottles of 250 melatonin from CVS in Miami cost me £30
Every year the I go to the states I buy enough to last me for a year
I normally take it every other night if I need to and I get a really proper deep sleep

globetrotter14 my GP told me to take both together. I tried the only every other night with Zopiclone but was back to utter horrendous, mid night waking/lying wide awake for rest of night. After 1 night of literally 1 hour of sleep and feeling so so so bad in every sense next day, have been taking 3.75 Zopi with the Miratrapine each night and - could almost cry writing this- for first time in years - am waking to my alarm each morning. I look so much better- even friends have said. Feel so so much better. Feel I am being a better mum to the kids.

I just know at my next appointment its very unlikely my GP will prescribe me more Zopiclone? So am becoming pretty anxious, even looking for ways to get on the dark Web to buy it. I have tried EVERYTHING Magnesium, US melatonin, sleep clinic etc, I existed or barely any sleep for nearly a year until I couldn't take another day of it and finally asked for sleeping tablets. It is the only thing that works for me. I wish he would realise that sleep deprivation to the extent I (we) have it is so dangerous and deliberating for us and our families, and taking a sleeping pill at the lower dose level in a controlled way, not over using or having any intention to over use is the lesser of 2 evils.

Try the Calm App.

It will probably change your life.

QFx

I have found mirtazapine 15mg helped a lot with sleep. Also banning any caffeinated drinks, tea, coke after 2pm at the latest.

Place marking!!!!😬

I'm going to try the magnesium. Have been in 10 mg zolpidem for years but would like to get off it.

I'm in peri and was starting to suffer with waking up and not getting back to sleep. I talk magnesium and have done for a long time, it does not impact my sleep.

However, I started taking 5HTP, which creates serotonin and melatonin, I just got it from amazon, takes a couple of weeks before you see an impact but I do about seven hours now on average.

The other advantage of 5HTP is that it is used to treat obesity and is kills the appetite, for those with weight issues.

Most GPs are now very reluctant to prescribe sleeping tablets and quite rightly so. They are likely to exacerbate problem rather than cure it except in very occasional, short term use for a specific reason. Most CCGs won’t fund them. The good GPs won’t be refilling prescription after prescription.

The NHS app is well researched and effective if engaged with properly. You can buy a machine called a Dodow that helps and changes pattern.
Sleep hygiene so you’re ready for sleep when bedtime comes and get up if sleep doesn’t rather than lying fretting.

When my DS was small and I was suffering from insomnia/sleep deprivation to the extent of being a danger to myself and others (loss of coordination, micro sleeps while in charge of the kids), my GP prescribed a very low dose of amitryptiline. Although the side effects were bad for a couple of days (weird spaced out feeling), once I got used to it, I felt completely normal in the day and it totally cured my insomnia. I stopped taking it after about 3 months and had no further sleep problems.

* I have a 1.5 hr commute in the car each morning and have previously fallen asleep at the wheel (thankfully when in slow traffic so no harm done) but that means not sleeping is potentially life threatening *

You should not be driving.
This is reckless. Risk your own life, sure but to risk others is terrible