To think veganism is not for children?

[ohhhhlivia]

Yes, I am aware that it is perfectly possible to have a healthy vegan diet at any age. I know that.

However, it is more difficult and easier to get wrong if you want to be vegan. It still is restrictive (even with all of the new stuff coming out) as in you need to tell hosts, check menus in advance etc.

It's a barrier that has to be overcome. I don't understand why you would do that to someone who has no choice in the matter.

Lots of kids go through a fussy phase too, add veganism in and surely you're at a high risk of health problems?

I think what I'm getting at, is that childhood nutrition can be hard enough as it is, so it just feels wrong to make it harder for reasons that do not directly benefit the child.

formerbabe
It's also amusing how vegans have been very personal and unpleasant on this thread...proving that a love of animals does not make a compassionate person.

I may be unpleasant, but if someone had given me a polite, reasonable response to a question about dead animals in the forest, I would not have totally ignored it and just asked it again a few hours later...

Just sayin'.

I haven’t RTFT, so sorry if I’m one of “those” people, what about about medications? Most are tested on animals.

Those who are raising their children as vegan what would you do if they said they wanted to eat foods that aren’t vegan?

A uni lecturer once told me of a conversation with her son.

"Mum I had some chicken at Tom's house"
"What did you think?"
"It tastes like Quorn"

In my limited experience with vegan parents they do try to give their children a balanced diet.

On the other hand I judge the parents of the toddler drinking coke from the can or the child having crisps for breakfast on the way to school.

You can be healthy on both diets and unhealthy as well.

It is more difficult to get the required macro- and micronutrients on a vegan diet, unless you are diligent about it and know which animal proteins necessary for development are not plant based and must be supplemented. Personally I think dairy alternatives are for adults and people with allergies especially at a young age. I also believe that it is best to get our nutrients from our food (having done my postgraduate thesis on absorption rates of micronutrients in supplements most people are not aware some vitamins need to be accompanied by oil to aid absorption or which order to take vitamins so they dont cancel each other out and that in summary taking supplements wrong just results in very expensive urine). But if you have educated yourself and decide to take that option for your family- great- I trust you know what you are doing. It's not a choice I would make and that's fine too

According to the dictionary Veganism means not eating animal products. The reason is unimportant to the name.
I don't understand how breastmulk ofa vegan woman is more vegan than a cow's milk?

@Tvstar 😴

@Tvstar
Despite multiple posts answering that question you still don’t understand it?
I’ll make it easy for the hard of thinking:
Omnivore - person who consumes products from non-human animals
Vegan - person who does not consume products from non-human animals

It certainly seems that being a non-vegan doesn't Improve cognitive capacity

Veganism is absolutely not for children, has been banned in Italy (please here soon);

and vegan parents were prosecuted in Australia for damaging their child through malnourishment.

www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/aug/22/vegan-parents-of-malnourished-toddler-sentenced-to-300-hours-community-service

It is a neurotic and inappropriate diet even for adults. Yes, I said it!

The breast milk debate is ridiculous....vegan or not, it is not expoiting any animals without consent and is therefore ethical.

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/vegan-baby-starve-parents-sweden-gothenburg-a8927991.html

@ScreamingLadySutch

You might want to try reading the thread
You look foolish for attempting to equate neglectful dietary restriction with a normal vegan diet.
Also that point has already been made and answered.

I would also argue that most vegans are pro breast milk and that nut, soya and oat milk are indeed milks.
Humans are not really supposed to consume mammalian milk into adulthood...it's for babies and toddlers. i love dairy but i am well aware that it's not the best for me and the planet. Dairy is an addiction and some have theorised that it is the ultimate comfort food as breast milk is a great comfort to babies, cows milk is an emotional comfort blanket to adults.....hence our addiction to it.

The breast milk debate is bizarre - bm is specifically made in the human body for the baby born to that mother, so denying the baby something that's needed is insane (saying that I'm not a formula basher... )

The whole vegan idea in children doesn't compute for me though, I'm totally against it, absorbing nutrients is tough in the vegan diet, childrens' bodies are growing at a rapid speed, slow absorption, lack of certain nutrients from an omnivorous diet all scream at my inner scientist that it's not compatible and can be dangerous to that poor child - any restrictive diet which is unnecessary is far from ideal

@formerbabe
Really? With a number of posts making uneducated statements about vegans abusing their children?
@AwkwardFucker
Most definitions as, 'as far as reasonably practical'.
If there's no alternative then vegans use vaccinations etc that have animal products in them. There is some research in moving away from these where possible.

@ScreamingLadySutch
Oh dear, please do keep up. Veganism is absolutely ok for children. All the major national health bodies/guidelines state veganism is fine,and even beneficial, for all children and adults.
As for your 'data' on veganism, why don't you read the EU/world health reports on malnourishment and compare it to the number of vegans .

@blubelle7
Hopefully you give that advice to everyone but you sound as if you are just sounding off at vegans.

And 'getting it from food' - so you have issues with eating meat from animals that have been given b12 shots from a vet or from fortified animal feed? That's interesting.
Vitamin deficiencies are not experienced by vegans alone, the supplement industry wasn't created because of vegans.
There are other academics in this thread and many of us are capable of following national health guidelines and scientific literature.

These threads tend to expose a deep ignorance about non-western vegan cultures. There's this assumption that everyone everywhere has always consumed animal products and not doing so is a radical departure for human beings. Many ancient cultures view things the other way around - animal products are the recent experiment and veganism is "how it's always been". Many non-european decendents don't even have the ability to digest lactose as adults ffs! What more evidence do you need?

@RuffleCrow

There are no traditional, vegan cultures. Non. Even in India, ghee, yogurt and paneer have been part of the diet for centuries.

Anyway, this thread has exposed some terrifying ideas. I'm out.

Non?! A faux french dismissal of all the millions of Buddhists, Jains and Hindus who've been comparatively healthy as vegans for millenia?! Only on MN.

@ohhhhlivia
Oh dear, it seems the responses weren't what OP was looking for. Since there are quite a few people just posting /reading at end of thread -
Those 'terrifying ideas' were on feeding babies which be to feed them breast milk, dairy formula if not available then non dairy formula if required.
Clutch those pearls.

Rainingallday is hilarious

@ohhhhlivia

I agree..I'm out too. Apparently in a debate about whether veganism is appropriate for children, asking whether a human can survive and thrive from birth on solely plants is goady . I'd say it is the very essence of the debate but oh well!

I honestly can't believe some of the responses / people in this thread. The issue if they are left uncorrected or challenged. Some must be dairy farmers

Yes, there may be a very small number of traditional vegan cultures, but the fact is that humans are classed as 'omnivores'. Humans evolved to eat and thrive on both animal products and plants.

I have nothing against vegans, but this idea that consuming animals (or flesh, or corpses or whatever other 'shocking' way you want to put it) is objectively 'wrong' for all humans is bizarre tbh.

@formerbabe
It's not the 'essence' of the debate at all. In fact it's irrelevant.
Babies should have their mothers milk for several reasons. Humans or cows.
The fact you can't recognise or acknowledge this after being told multiple times makes me think you are deliberately trolling.

@RuffleCrow

But they're not vegan. They all consume animal products in some form.

It's a modern form of orientalism to treat eastern countries as spiritual and cultinary uptopias.

You might want to google some of that

Babies should have their mothers milk for several reasons. Humans or cows

So an animal product then?
I accept that ethically bm is vegan. But obviously it's an animal food.