To wonder why nobody likes me?

[thornfortea]

I know people will read this thinking "Well she must just be a twat" but I honestly throughout my life tried so hard to be nice and kind to people and also funny, friendly etc but it never seemed to go anywhere.

I was very shy in primary school, didn't speak at all for the first 2 years (selective mutism, I wish I could remember why I chose to be like that) though I did still have friends who included me. Eventually I came out of it and while I was quiet throughout primary school, I eventually became like all of the other kids.

Moved to another town for secondary and there was only one girl who I clicked with who left in Year 9, I never had friends after that. There would be times were I'd get talking to someone and it would look promising but then after a while during conversations it would die after I said something, they stopped saying hi to me etc. This happened a few times. I don't understand it, I wasn't one of the oddballs. I loved the typical stuff all of the popular girls like, went in every day in make-up with my hair done etc. Loved fashion and music and boys. Yet nobody ever engaged with me about it. Only time I got bothered with at school was with lads who had a sexual interest.

Went to college optimistic having been told by everyone I'd make loads of friends, the same thing happened. A group was formed in the first few weeks (none of them knew each other beforehand) and originally they seemed interested in me but eventually the group really solidified and they forgot about me. I remember thinking I hadn't been outgoing enough and added them all on Facebook and only one or two added me back. The course we were on had 2 groups and I remember one day overhearing they were all moving to the other group. Later on in the group chat I said something along the lines of "Has the teacher rearranged the groups? Who's going?" and they all read it and none replied. I phrased it in a way that sounded like I'd heard it from someone else and was curious about who was going rather than me trying to work out if it was to do with me. The groupchat went dead after that, they must have made a new one without me in it. In my second year at college a new girl joined, I went to sit next to her one day. I said "Hi," thinking we could chat and she just said bluntly "Do you ever smile?". It really hurt me. It eventually turned out that a lot of people on my course thought I didn't like them. It really hurt, and I cried a lot about it. There was nobody I actively disliked on the course, they were all nice. Whenever I saw someone struggling with work I would try and help, I always said hello when seeing them in the corridoors and yet nobody made the effort with me. I eventually realized people were frightened of me. I have never had any conflict with anyone in my life.

Work was the same. Never invited to works dos etc because apparently I look as though I don't want to be invited. I'm engaged now with a baby on the way now and I think the only reason my partner stuck with me is because we met online and so he got to know me before seeing my miserable mug in person. Dreading baby getting here and then having to go through it all again at baby group and the school playground etc.

I think I'm just intimidating. Yet there's that once in a blue moon person who says I'm funny and kind and great company once they get to know me. I feel so upset that I seem to carry around this bad atmosphere.

I am one of the "oddballs". Doesn't bother me as I'm an introvert and I neither need nor want people but do you honestly think I'm more deserving of being ostracised than you? And do you think someone who is as "oddball" as I am but wants company deserves it?

Exactly! I feel a bit more sympathetic towards OP now she's returned & explsined that bit, but still. It does read like "I'm not obe of those weirdos with unusual interests who deserves to be lonely".

Are you in the UK OP? If so google the Lorna Wing centre - an online test probably won't pick it up in females and don't think that because you've had therapy input that they would have spotted it. I see females with ASD misdiagnosed all the time.

I may be on the spectrum myself, pinksparkleunicorns but I'd never get a diagnosis now. Complicated tale.

Odd, I might br but I wouldn't imply anyone should be shunned unless they're actively unpleasant. As said, I don't seek much company myself but my brother is on the spectrum, not rude, utterly harmless and used to feel it keenly.

That said, I apologise for my outburst. Having a bad week.

@TheFesteredStiff I'm one of the oddballs too, that stung a little for me too lol. You can get a diagnosis at any age and you can get it alongside any other diagnosis (I have a mixture of several.)

If you haven't had much luck getting a diagnosis with the NHS, I think it's much easier to get one with a private assessment if you really feel the need. It is affordable, at least with a bit of saving up, as you wouldn't have to go for many appointments. I only have PIP etc. to live on but I paid for a private consultant for some stuff, and then for therapy.

At the end of the day though, it oesn't necessarily matter if one gets an official diagnosis as an adult, except for writing on forms etc maybe, as they don't tend to refer you to any treatment I don't think. I would love to have Social Skills Training like they offer to some kids. Am trying to find something like it. But then again, it'd be hard to undo the habits of a lifetime. :)

IDK if anyone else has said, but 'Resting bitch face' is a misogynistic construct. Men hardly ever get told they have the 'wrong' facial expression.

OP, I wonder if you are too shy to assert yourself? Are you too keen to fit in? IME trying too hard to fit in has often the opposite effect on people.

Agreed, @Interested. Just as no woman goes along a street telling men who aren’t beaming to ‘Cheer up, love, it might never happen!’ or ‘Give us a smile, darling.’

The answer is in your OP: 'Do you ever smile?'. Practise smiling, into the mirror, when driving, whenever you have any encounter with anyone (bus driver, shop assistant, health care professional etc etc). Make pleasant comments to people you encounter, thanking them, complimenting them etc. And when the opportunity arises ask people about themselves and their lives and show interest in their answers. Acting happier will make you feel happier and will make other people like you better.

I also have a resting bitch face or as one of my friends describes it my get tae fuck face. I don't look particularly approachable even though I think I am. A few people have said to me you're actually really nice when I got to know you. The thing is I can't be arsed to plaster a smile on constantly and I'm not particularly sociable. Sorry, just realised none of that is of any help to you

I used to be a military officer and was told I came across as intimidating. Yet if I had come across as friendly and smiley I would have been told I was too familiar with my juniors!

I never made any lifelong friends at university. I only have a handful of friends now. I didn’t bother having a hen night as I don’t have a dozen (or even half a dozen) friends to invite! I had one bridesmaid at my small wedding. God knows where people find 6 adult bridesmaids!

Maybe people just don’t like me. Apparently the other ranks were scared of me but I got on okay with my peers and more senior officers. Although one of my roles was training new recruits and I bumped into one a year or so later who said “we all thought you were dead mean ma’am but when we got to know you we said you were sound.”

I really don’t think I’m scary. I work as a TA now with a view to doing teacher training and most of the children seem to like me but one or two of the teachers are a bit funny with me.

At the same time, most people don’t seem to remember me. If I bump into an old colleague they genuinely have no idea who I am.

Oh well! Good job I like my own company.

I can identify Op
Some tips I found to help are

1. Be interested in the other person ask them about themself - people love talking about themselves. What do they do? Are they local? Etc
2. Compliment them. Oo I love your scarf / shoes/ jacket Even if you don’t.
3. Wear something striking yourself Sparkly broach. Funky shoes. When people comment it opens up conversation

( eg. I have a pair of shoes that always get commented on. So I smile and say yeah Thankyou. I love them. these are my babies they live in a box and no one is allowed to touch them big smile little laugh )

1. Smile. Even if you feel daft. Try to remember their name and use it
2. Practice. You won’t win them all. But it’s them not you

That’s helped me over the years

I have resting bitch face! When I go somewhere new I find I have to really make an effort with speaking to people etc so overcome my face!

Have you ever seen yourself on film?

Maybe set up your phone and record yourself saying hello and making small talk as if the phone were another person.

Play it back and it may help you with where you’re struggling.

I too have resting bitch face but have learnt to mask it and it massively helps make other people relax if I used my game face (as I call it).

How old are you OP? I’m like you and I’m 50. I still get told to smile more (only last week, by a man younger than me, at work). After my short lecture to him on where he could stick his sexist nonsense, backed up by three other women my age who came over to join in, I am confident he won’t say it again!

Basket of kittens has got it right...aim to be a sound, decent person with a small group of close friends. One or two decent friends are worth their weight in gold, over general popularity.

But also yeah, you don’t have to do gurning smiley face, but aim for a, open and interested in others, type expression. Then if someone makes eye contact (at baby group or wherever, in supermarket etc), do small smile in return.

For conversation, the weather is always appropriate...everyone knows it’s a polite bit of small talk. Or compliment their baby, or dog or something else like their scarf: “Chilly day isn’t it? Your dog is so gorgeous”, is enough to get you known as a friendly person.

Hi op.

I don’t have a resting bitch face lol, but I’ve struggled with making friends my whole life. People who I’m at ease with, can’t understand how I don’t make friends as they describe me as having a funny, dry sense of humour and being very open to listening to others. I also apparently give great advice and make people feel appreciated.
However, when I’m with someone outside of my little family bubble and DH, I can barely speak. I stutter, come across as awkward and probably a little weird. I could kick myself as I know I’m doing it, and have no control. I can almost see their faces and the confusion...I know they’re thinking ‘back away slowly’. I’ve even gotten that nervous speaking to someone new that I’ve dribbled. Yes, I just said that. I dribbled.

I guess that’s why I come on Mumsnet, because I just don’t have these sorts of chats in real life.

I’ve learnt to live with myself and I’m no longer worried about having friends. I literally don’t have a single one. It’s just DH and I and I’m happy. I’ve accepted that’s just who I am.

Perhaps if I was looking to make friends though, I’d join clubs, join my community Facebook page. Make an effort to chat with the neighbours etc.

Don’t beat yourself up though op....we can’t all be social butterflies.

I don't want to hijack the thread but @Interestedwoman, thank you for your kind post.

The reason I don't think I could get a diagnosis is that I'm not sure if I'm odd because I'm on the spectrum or because my family are odd and I had to pick up social skills as an adult (father and brother on the spectrum and mother definitely has something going on). I've done this to the point my oddness doesn't cause me any personal or professional issue. Due to the introversion, I'm honestly not even sure myself whether I'm masking when I'm having to interact. People do seem to like me and I do like most of the people I meet but I just prefer to be alone or with the few people I hold dear.

Sorry for the diversion.
Sorry for the diversion.

There's quite a lot to unpack here.

First of all, you say 'nobody likes you' but you mention you have a DP so clearly you managed to meet him and get along fine with him. How did that happen?

Secondly, there are more ways of being 'an oddball' than you think. Having the same interests as other people isn't the only thing that people will judge you on. Plenty of 'oddballs' as you call it don't have any problem making friends at all. I think the fact that you see it like this is quite telling, actually - you're thinking only in terms of the person you are, and not the way you express it or communicate with others.

Thirdly, having 'resting bitch face' is very different from smiling so infrequently that people actually mention it. I have resting bitch face, very much so. But the key word is 'resting'. I still smile when I talk to people or meet someone new or if someone says something that's clearly meant to be nice or funny.

Fourthly, not everyone who is socially awkward is autistic. On Mumsnet, a dozen people will suggest autism the moment anyone mentions behaviour that is even slightly outside the norm, but in reality it really doesn't work like that. It's perfectly possible for people to have problems communicating or reading other people's tone and body language and to struggle socially without being autistic.

I do think it's interesting that you were selectively mute when you were a child, and I strongly suspect this is absolutely connected to the difficulties you have communicating - because I think that's what this is, a difficulty communicating. You seem to be a nice person, but clearly you are being read as something different and/or you are reading other people wrongly, somehow or other. The common factor in all these interactions is you, and I think I would inclined to seek some help professionally, either via your GP in the first instance or from a private therapist.

I have often been told that I come across as "dour". However, this is v much not the case, as people discover. It just takes a while and at least one decent conversation for them to realise that.

I do get treated like I am invisible quite a bit though so I sympathise.

I have been through the same thing, no real lasting friendships, have always felt very alone & came to the conclusion that I must be an awful person for no one to want to be friends with me, it has affected my mental health very badly. Three weeks ago I was diagnosed with Autism( Aspergers) now I know that I'm not an awful person, just different.

@thornforteai used to get this all the time!
Even when I was like 15 .
And some Arsehole friend of my sister told her she didn’t like me as I always look so pissed off .
That’s just my fucking face you dickhead !
I embrace my resting bitch face now, keeps the twats away

It is much harder for girls & women to get diagnosed with Autism because they can mask their difficulties with social interaction by mirroring behaviour of the person there are interacting with.

Do you have blue or grey eyes by any chance? My DC tell me that their friends think I'm terrifying until they get to know me and its just that I have quite intense looking blue eyes. (Think Paul Hollywood - he'd look a lot less scary with warm brown eyes.)

Yes, I always notice on these 'I have no friends' threads that the OP quite often has a longterm DP or husband, and conclude that these OPs must be doing something different in their communications in their romantic/sexual relationships to their social acquaintances/friendships.

Would anyone who is in this position friendless, or has always struggled with friendships, but is married, or has a boyfriend/girlfriend on the thread like to explain how they see the difference?

Would anyone who is in this position friendless, or has always struggled with friendships, but is married, or has a boyfriend/girlfriend on the thread like to explain how they see the difference?

🤔 interesting question.

In my pp I explained how awkward I am when trying to make friends, yet I’ve been with my DH since I was in high school.

I’ve actually always made male friends very easily, but feel intimidated by women I guess? I get all awkward and in trying to fit in, I end up looking stupid. I can’t relate to what is talked about...children; soap operas; what’s happening at school etc (sorry I’m probably stereotyping here).

I find men easier to talk to. Enjoy banter and teasing. Feel comfortable around them.

I’ve never given this a second thought before. Is anyone else more comfortable with the opposite sex than their own?