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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Do people get treated differently if they wear make up

164 replies

Mamalicious16 · 27/10/2019 17:30

I don't often wear make up but my friends do. Out shopping and ( it seemed to me but maybe I'm just a bit sensitive today) they seemed to be served quicker in shops/ a bar we went in and the cafe. Aibu or do people get treated differently if they wear make up?

OP posts:
LolaSmiles · 28/10/2019 10:39

anothernotherone
You're not alone.
Sometimes I think it's as much about how you carry yourself as much as anything.

I wouldn't say I've noticed any difference when I've finished at the gym and nipped to the shop next door Vs casual clothes Vs workwear, light make up or none. In any of those situations in happy with what I'm doing and what I look like, even if it is a post workout messy bun and no makeup.

Sometimes I think people underestimate the power of quiet self assurance, and if you're the sort of person who frets and thinks people who wear make up/have expensive clothes etc get treated better then maybe that insecurity (maybe not the right word) filters into behaviour and mannerisms.

thecatsthecats · 28/10/2019 10:50

I noticed a massive difference with how men treated me when I went from ginger hair to blonde. I got asked out by lots of guys, they held doors open for me I'd be served first at the bar even if there was a queue of people before me. It took me a while to twig what it must have been and I found it really odd and rather unsettling.

This is going to sound weird, but I noticed very distinct racial trends in men who approached me according to hair colour.

Blond, I attract more white men.
Ginger, I attract more Asian men.
Brown, I attract more black men.
Black hair I attract more goths. Grin

I've never felt 'invisible', though I have felt 'visible'.

Visible to me means men catcalling, following, or proactively chatting me up.
Neutral is just me going about my business treating everyone the same.
Invisible would be people acting like I didn't exist or not noticing me - but since I think I'm fairly social out in public - friendly smiles when side-stepping someone, cheery hello and goodbye to shop people, asking people to move, even politely declining chuggers etc I don't really care if people aren't sexually harrassing me as long as they're polite.

CravingCheese · 28/10/2019 11:01

Imo? Yes. Absolutely.

I once read a study about women wearing makeup being judged to more intelligent and more professional as well. It is obviously just 'a study' but still, interesting imo.

CookPassBabtridge · 28/10/2019 11:05

I can definitely tell when people have makeup on, even the nude stuff. It's obvious when someone has a bare face compared to minimal makeup. I wear my makeup everyday including bright lipstick and never have an issue feeling invisible so think you're right.

Fatshedra · 28/10/2019 11:05

As an oldie I can say older men get ignored unless they are one of the smallish group who are tall,slim, have hair. As men age they get whiskers, hair grows much faster on neck, ears, eyebrows. So unless they studiously go to the barbers they will look unkempt much of the time . They put on weight easily as do older women ime. Makes it harder to get attention eg at the bar.
The apprentice gives good examples of made up / unmade up - and includes men too, although to a lesser extent. The caked on make up with tiny black lined eyes and painted eyebrows is not great imv.

Anothernotherone · 28/10/2019 11:05

I'm glad LolaSmiles I think it's a lot to do with making eye contact, smiling and being confident.

My mum is a tiny 5ft tall woman in her 70s and I'm absolutely sure she's never been ignored in her life, and isn't quickly forgotten. We don't always get on but perhaps I have her to thank for the visible gene...

I think maybe people are also talking about different things. I'm not talking about sexual attention personally, but about people generally "seeing" me - getting good service in bars/ shops/ crowded places, being addressed directly when not absolutely necessary, being called out to from a distance by vague aquaintances who I haven't seen in months or years, being known and treated with respect at work, all that stuff.

Not talking about being catcalled - that's being harassed not being seen. I don't get cat called any more and I'm glad. It only happened in my teens and early 20s. I do get treated with respect and friendliness by most people of both sexes - infinitely preferable to being harassed!

ginghamstarfish · 28/10/2019 11:06

I think it's about grooming as a whole, having made some effort with your appearance - hair, clothes, make-up, posture even, no matter your age, it says you are perhaps more confident.

managedmis · 28/10/2019 11:14

CileyMayRhinovirus

^^

Great post

Time40 · 28/10/2019 11:17

Try making your way around the City of London in a wheelchair with no make-up. It's hideous. You get ignored, barged, sworn at for occupying space and all the rest. And then one day, my cousin suggested I try wearing red lipstick. I would not now go into the City in my wheelchair without red lipstick on. Total game changer

Yep. That confirms what I've found. The dark, obvious lipstick does more than anything else to produce respect.

LolaSmiles · 28/10/2019 11:23

Anothernotherone
You're probably right about people meanig different things by being visible/invisible.

For me I've never felt invisible, but I never feel like the world is staring at me either (and would find the whole world is my catwalk look at me approach quite awkward as it's not my style).

I know some people who do get very dressed up, full face of make up and people do turn their heads and 'notice' them, but then I also think they dress and present themselves in a way that attracts attention. Good for them if it makes them feel good, but that's not my style. I have no desire to feel that people are looking at how good I look/my style etc when going round a shopping centre.

I've never had an issue with feeling fobbed off for how I look, I've not had better/worse service wearing light make up Vs none because I honestly don't think most people notice or give a damn unless they are used to paying attention to other people's make up. I'd say I get good service and people are generally friendly, I'm not left waiting in bars for ages etc. Fine, the world doesn't stop and stare and pay me attention just for entering a cafe, but then again I'm not courting that sort of attention.

MaidenMotherCrone · 28/10/2019 11:26

I don't wear makeup unless it's a special occasion.
Work is not a special occasion!
I'm in my 50's and have a well worn face.
It's my face. I like it. It's how I look. I'm confident. Far more confident than those who feel better wearing makeup.

My boss has suggested I look so much better with makeup (she has seen photos) I asked her would it make me any better at my job? No of course not. I offered to wear makeup if she comes to work bare faced.
She was not so keen Grin.
I'll keep going to work with MY face thank you very much.

I think there should be a campaign against this sexist shite. THIS IS MY FACE AND I LIKE IT!

mencken · 28/10/2019 11:36

haven't worn makeup since my mid twenties. Seem to be able to get served in shops, fed in restaurants, talked to on social occasions, listened to at meetings without it.

as for 'look better with makeup' - that comment does deserve a slap. How insulting. No, I don't look better with gooey red muck on my lips and thick black circles round my eyes, I just look stupid as do most.

WhisperingPines · 28/10/2019 11:49

Feeling 'visible' or 'invisible' is subjective.

I think that, first and foremost, it's related to confidence. Make up is not necessarily part of it.

When I visit Italy, for example, I always notice how attractive people look there (women and men, young and old alike). I think it's the confidence they radiate that makes them so attractive. They may be fashion conscious but they don't necessarily wear expensive clothes/shoes, or walk around in full make up.
What I did notice is that their posture and body language is different from people in the UK. Italian people make eye contact more easily, for example. Generally they seem more relaxed when socialising and talking to others.

ByStarlight · 28/10/2019 12:18

Total agreement with pps on here who say it’s more about confidence and how you carry yourself and how self-assured you are when presenting yourself, rather than makeup. I hardly ever wear make up, and when I do, it is the slightest hint of eyeliner and a touch of mascara and that is it. My hair is of the fine wavy type that takes only a little humidity in the air or a small breeze to turn it into a wild unkempt bush of frizz. I generally wear clothes that I’ve owned a long time and don’t follow fashion - so probably look well-worn rather than smart and ‘new’. And I’m in my mid-forties with a well-worn face to match the clothes.

However, for my job I am used to presenting in front of large groups of professionals, interacting with senior directors in a daily basis, and can very easily appear calm, self-assured and ‘in charge’ regardless of whatever crap I’m wearing or whatever the weather has done to my hair.

This was very apparent recently during a visit from my 27 year old stepdaughter, when we went out shopping and to a restaurant. Despite me looking like I’d been dragged through a hedge backwards, and her looking immaculate in heels, designer fashionable clothes and lots of makeup and perfectly styled hair, it was always me that was approached first by shop assistants and waiters. There was clearly something in the way I made eye contact, carried myself and spoke to people that showed that I was the primary person out of the two of us to approach.

It could have been that we were together and the age difference suggested a mother-daughter dynamic. But as pps have said, I’ve also never felt ‘invisible’ when waiting for service. Yet my stepdaughter frequently complains that shop assistants ‘ignore’ her.

MarshaBradyo · 28/10/2019 12:23

I know people say it changes as you get older, it probably does in many cases, but I can say my parents are treated very well, good service pretty much wherever they go. In part to do with where they go - paying for good service - but also they’re not invisible at all. The opposite I reckon. I would say the same about my dgm too when she was here.

On make up I know when I like to wear it or not wear it but I wonder if it is as transformative as people say. A face is someone’s face (with make up on in some cases).

BirthdayCakes · 28/10/2019 12:29

To counter a lot of these 'invisible' stories..

I've noticed that now I'm in my 40s and often CBA wearing makeup men feel more comfortable around me.. Okay it might not be what you mean by 'visible' in that they don't automatically fancy me but I can have a pretty easy going chat with bus drivers, the paint counter man in B&Q, the second hand tool guy, the record shop guy, school run dads, regulars at the pub, etc.. even younger men see me as 'safe' to ask directions, exchange a comment or two etc..

This definitely didn't happen when I was a fully made up teen or even into my 30s when I paid more attention to 'creating an impression'

I genuinely feel that make up serves as a mask - which is sometimes helpful - and removing it lets you join the rest of humanity who aren't fretting over what they look like and what others think of their appearance ..

thecatsthecats · 28/10/2019 13:33

For me I've never felt invisible, but I never feel like the world is staring at me either (and would find the whole world is my catwalk look at me approach quite awkward as it's not my style).

Yes, thinking about it there are even more:

1 - Visible - sexy, attractive, flirting
2 - Visible - best dressed/confident
3 - Neutral - friendly and positive
4 - Negative - attracting negative, sexist comment
5 - Invisible - being ignored, not regarded

I have experienced 1-4:

1 - dolled up looking for attention
2 - dressing well for a wedding for example, but not sexy, getting praise for my outfit (covered neck to shin, with sleeves, and loose)
3 - how I go about my daily life
4 - more especially when overweight, but my husband gets that sort of attention from 'laddy' men who find it hilarious that, when I'm dressed up nicely, that I'm out in public with a man with beard and glasses.

LimitIsUp · 28/10/2019 14:51

I don't think it's make up that makes the difference - I think it's general presentation (hair, clothes etc)

JaneJeffer · 28/10/2019 15:04

Another I agree with you. I don't get the invisible thing at all.

Anothernotherone · 28/10/2019 17:07

I think it's probably more about how people see themselves than about how others see them... Projection and self fulfilling prophecies...

Anothernotherone · 28/10/2019 17:17

The only post which makes me think otherwise is GrumpyInsomniac 's which I think tells us something about the internal process of othering people with certain disabilities unfortunately. The lipstick is working as a symbol that she's "one of" the workforce she's commuting among. Conformity to social norms obviously does make individuals accepted more easily, and when one thing is different (using a wheelchair) conformity to other norms can make other randoms overlook that, where breaking norms and expectations will be judged more harshly.

Which says the volumes about what's wrong with society obviously...

lovelyjubilly · 28/10/2019 17:19

I think I probably feel more confident and assertive when wearing makeup so would be more likely to elicit 'attention'.

peaceanddove · 28/10/2019 17:26

Wearing make up doesn't completely change the look of your face as a poster said up thread. People still recognise me with or without make up. I use make up just to enhance my features in order to create a more flattering version of me. And yes when I'm wearing make up and a study outfit people respond more positively to me. We judge by appearances and it's disingenuous to pretend we don't.

Anothernotherone · 28/10/2019 17:35

peaceanddove people judge by appearance on only the most cursory level. People don't actually spend long at all looking intently at one another's appearance except in very specific circumstances. The most general overall impression is created in under a second - it's not about whether you are wearing makeup, but something far more general.

PlanDeRaccordement · 28/10/2019 17:37

Yes,
I believe women are treated differently whether or not they wear makeup. In many cases too much makeup is worse than no makeup.

I also think that the expected amount and type of makeup varies by profession. For example, a waitress in a club will have to wear a full face of dramatic evening makeup. A personal trainer will be wearing minimal, natural look makeup. A senior military officer will probably be wearing no makeup. It is unfortunate that even today women are still constrained by social rules about makeup that force us to conform to succeed.