First Car

[Zippyx]

Hi

As a bit of context, we live in a good area for insurance. DS has done 'young driver' 3-4 times (1 hour lesson each time) and has driven about 4 hours on private roads around our farm. DH and I have both gone through basic parking manoeuvres with him, which he has grasped with relative ease. DS is therefore pretty confident as a driver; DH and I are equally confident in him, given the rate of progress he's made in a relatively small time. Obviously as we are not professional ADIs, he will have at least 10-15 hours of lessons as a minimum.

Now it's time to buy a car, we are looking to spend around £6,500. Firstly, is this reasonable?

Secondly, the car we are looking at is a BMW 1 Series 2011 with about 60k miles on the clock. Insurance would be about £1,500 so not too bad at all. WIBU to buy it for him?

Thanks!

@swingofthings It sounds like he does already suffer from a sense of entitlement if he would think that getting a Honda would be boring.
RTF Post. Nowhere did I say he would find it boring - I said I would find it boring if I were 17, although DS would never say this to me for fear of appearing ungrateful and entitled.

who eats at the best places, goes out drinking at any opportunity, has the flashiest phone and laptop.
He does/has none of things now. He eats at substandard place because he doesn't want to spend money, but wants to save it. He doesn't want to drink because alcohol is a waste of money - his words, not mine. His phone is 3 years old and his laptop was a birthday present 2 years ago.

Not all of course, some actually don't really care about the things they get from their parents, but your statement about him thinking s Honda is boring, clearly already expecting a car when he hadn't even got his license yet is really raising alarm bells.
Again, RTFT. With regards to expecting a car - where did you get that idea from? Until a month ago, he was worried about how he was going to juggle A Levels and a job to pay for a car so he could get to college easily. I promptly gave him and implied he was crazy for even considering it. Keep your alarm bells to yourself, thanks.

@MelvinsMum Thank you for a considerably nicer post to read - a nice rest!
Some nice insurance quotes there - well done on those

We could easily afford them, so why not? For many reasons they needed transport at 17, like your son, and it made our lives much much easier.
Exactly what I'm getting at - making DC struggle when DP can afford such costs is slightly cold in my eyes. Getting to college does not need to be as hard as some DP make it by not purchasing cars if they can afford it.

Name change fail OP?

I agree with swingofthings your attitude is going to set your ds up for turning into an entitled adult.

I don't have any feelings about how much you should or can spend, that's up to you. However, I would caution against a BMW or any other car that he will feel 'cool' in. The temptation to show off at his age is massive and I just wouldn't be prepared to risk my child's safely in that way.

@GreytExpectations Not really. I just preferred an extra 'p' in it!

Before we enter the entitled adult stage, I can guarantee I will have intervened to prevent that happening. Given his personality, I don't think it will be a problem but who knows? Will keep an eye on it over the next few years.

@HappyDinosaur I disagree with generalisation like that, personally. Hugely unfair to suggest that all people of that age are tempted to show off. Showing off is nothing to do with age - it's to do with personality and upbringing. Nice teenagers do exist in the world, believe it or not!

Showing off is nothing to do with age - it's to do with personality and upbringing.

Interesting you suggest it's about upbringing considering you don't seem concerned about your show off attitude having a negative impact on him.

I haven't said anything about not being nice! Of course all ages can show off, but I firmly believe the temptation in the teenage years is greater than at any other age, simply because teens seem more vulnerable to peer pressure etc.

And those are the kids to grow up with a sense of entitlement at every opportunity, who become so easily blaze with the small joys of life and always aspire to have more to get a sense of satisfaction and will think nothing of getting into debts for it. They usually grow up to be quite unhappy adults because their happiness is dependent on possessions and they always need a fix of more and better possessions

Dd growing up has been given loads of opportunities by us. We have picked her up from various tube and rail stations when needed.
She got a brand new car when she passed her test. At 19 she drives a very nice car.

She is the least entitled teen I know.

She works incredibly hard. She saves even harder, bought a grotty flat that she is mostly doing up herself having put herself the relevant trade courses.
And she is the happiest young woman I know.

Those that brought their children up with a sense of making their own way in the world and the sense of responsibility have turned into the most selfish and thoughtless individuals who have reduced their life to how much everything costs and no thought of the consequences of their behaviour.

And they are so miserable.

I think you are deluding yourself with your intentions. You talk about not wanting to get a boring car and how DD will be thrilled to get an Audi. I think you are into that all flashy brand thing and it is almost more about you then your DS.

There are many people who say value their status by the brands they buy, and indeed, I've seen many parents who displaced this status needs on to their kids rather than themselves.

It comes across as if you'll feel better about yourself as a parent getting your son a branded car that will clearly make him happier than if you got him a boring car.

There might not be an issue with entitlement but clearly one with a need for status.

Zippy, your son sounds very like mine, prefers saving to spending, even though he has some significant savings (an inheritance). He does drink but not heavily, and is not into expensive restaurants although happy to eat out with friends.

He managed to save thousands from his placement job last year, whilst living in a shared house and running his car. It is earmarked for travelling when he finishes uni next summer, but he talked in the Spring about upgrading his iPhone - his was a refurbished warranty replacement for previous phone, he was having problems with it but no longer in warranty.

He um’ed and Ahh’d for weeks about whether to upgrade the phone, despite having saved so much from his job. In the end he did get a new one but had thought about it long and hard.

@Oliversmumsarmy, I did say that not every spoilt child grow up to be an unhappy entitled adult, but your DD is in the minority.

I still really don't get why any parent would want to buy their kids a very nice car when they are likely to have an accident, if only scratches in their first years of driving. What is the point?

I remember when I bought my own first new car. I was in my very late 30s. It felt so amazing. How blaze would I have been if I'd already got that at 17.

*Those that brought their children up with a sense of making their own way in the world and the sense of responsibility have turned into the most selfish and thoughtless individuals who have reduced their life to how much everything costs and no thought of the consequences of their behaviour.

And they are so miserable.*

Uhhh what? so being raised with a sense of responsibility equals selfish and miserable? That's ridiculous.

OP - I know you’ve decided against the BMW now, but the biggest issue I’d have here is that BMW Series 1 are absolute shit to repair - complex and expensive; that’s what would make it such a shite first car in my opinion at any price.

When you consider any car, look at what it’s going to be like to repair. Something is going to break on a car that has 60k miles (I think you said). You may find, especially with a BMW, that a car you spent £6500 needs a £5000 to be able to run within just a few months.

There are more reliable luxury brands that are much cheaper to repair, if you still want to get him “something special,” or I would consider getting him something newer with lower mileage but without a luxury badge.

Those that brought their children up with a sense of making their own way in the world and the sense of responsibility have turned into the most selfish and thoughtless individuals who have reduced their life to how much everything costs and no thought of the consequences of their behaviour

And they are so miserable.

@Oliversmumsarmy Do you always spout shit?

I was brought up exactly as you describe. I am one of the happiest and successful women I know. I put a lot of that down to my upbringing. I pride myself on being an independent, strong woman who can stand on my own two feet (despite having an incredibly loving DH) I can't think of anything worse than bringing kids up the opposite of the nonsense you have written.

*Those that brought their children up with a sense of making their own way in the world and the sense of responsibility have turned into the most selfish and thoughtless individuals who have reduced their life to how much everything costs and no thought of the consequences of their behaviour.

And they are so miserable.*
I agree. People who bring up children with that attitude turn them into 'I'm out to save myself'-type people. Obviously, if someone is chucking their child in at the deep end, they will be unhappy, won't they? I definitely was and therefore have memories of struggling to buy a car and a flat, whilst my parents sat and watched. I'm not going to give that memory to my child. I don't understand how children whose parents made things like car, flat, wedding, etc. easy for them could end up as unhappy as people are saying when they've not got it as hard?

Like your DD, @Oliversmumsarmy, my DS is happy with his life, gratefully accepts the help we give him and works hard to be able to do similar for his DC. As a parent, I feel a responsibility to make sure my DC don't deserve to be unhappy simply because they're becoming adults, contrary to what most people would suggest: adulthood = unhappiness, adapt or die.

@swingofthings If I was into the flashy brand thing, I'd have a Mercedes parked outside, not my 2010 Honda - which is serving its purpose very satisfactorily. Clearly, status isn't really an issue either. You're running out of things to grill me on and it's getting tedious.

It comes across as if you'll feel better about yourself as a parent getting your son a branded car that will clearly make him happier than if you got him a boring car.
Frankly, it's not my problem if it comes across like that to you. As far as DS is concerned, he would be grateful regardless of whether it was a Honda Jazz or an Audi A1. He might not necessarily enjoy the Honda Jazz, but he would still thank DH and I to the moon and back for it. In terms of myself, I could get myself a nicer car if I wanted to. I haven't because I don't have a need to spend any extra cash. My intentions in terms of getting DS a nice car are to create memories of him and his whole family truly enjoying his first car - nothing beyond that to it.

You're really not getting it! Get him a Honda and he'll be grateful but disappointed and therefore won't enjoy the car. You want to get him a flashy car so that you can see a massive huge smile on his face, excitement wanting to tell everyone rather than just a nice thank you because deep inside it's not really what he wanted. But this is nothing to do with entitlement!

If you're son needs a flashy car at 17 to enjoy driving a car, what will he need at 20 to get that same feeling? And then at 30?

The point is that the average 17yo would be over the moon just to have their parents paying for their driving lessons and getting them any safe cat. Your son already needs a flashy car to enjoy the same experience.

I'm not getting it because there's nothing coherent enough to get.

He suggested the Honda Jazz in the first place - why would he be disappointed!? He'd have the massive smile on his face regardless of what car it was. With regards to 'telling everyone' - that's not his style; it never has been. I don't need your generalisations - thank you.

No one said he needs a flashy car. I just wanted him to have a car that provides a better experience, rather than a bog standard Ford Fiesta/VW Polo/Honda Jazz, etc.

No one said he wouldn't be over the moon with any safe car, nor that he needs a flashy car for that experience. He was over the moon when I said he wouldn't have to try juggling a job and A Levels to save up for
driving lessons and a car. The whole suggestion of a more premium car came from me - so why apply your generalisations to him?

This conversation isn't really worth having anymore to be honest with you - it's not achieving anything. You want all 17 year olds to have a car that is quite plain and not very interesting. I want my 17 year old to have a car that we can all enjoy as a family. Fortunately, you do not control what I spend my money on (thank God for that ).

Thank you to those that did provide helpful advice x

I still really don't get why any parent would want to buy their kids a very nice car when they are likely to have an accident

I leased a very safe and very boring car because of the likelihood of an accident.

I want her to walk away from an accident.

One of her friends drives an old tiny car that has the worse safety rating because her parents wouldn’t stand guarantor for a better car.
They weren’t even paying for the car.

That I can’t understand.

Why would you put a signature before your dds safety

Op is getting defensive now. Clearly nobody is impressed with her need for "flash" attitude.

I also think in a lot of cases it is false economy buying a car.

Shopping around and leasing a safer new car, by the time you take into consideration depreciation, getting an older car through its MOT, repairs and possibly petrol consumption it works out very little difference in cost.

DH is a driving instructor. He recommends getting a Ford PileOfShit as a first car because they usually get hammered. Especially if junior hasn't bought it themselves

He suggested the Honda Jazz in the first place
Then why would you be looking at something different? The fact you'd think an old BMW or Audi would mean a better experience really says it all, as that you'd go for that choice of car thinking it would make more special memories then giving him a Honda.

You'd admitted yourself that your son was probably spoilt. If you think that's a good trait to have, then you are tight that we would never agree on what constitute giving the best to our children.

It’s a mystery to me why any parent, when told their child wants a Honda Jazz, insists on buying them something different. Especially an Audi, which is essentially an old person’s car. I can hear the ribbing from his mates now.

we are looking to spend around £6,500
Good lord - do not waste your money.
1st car will very probably be written off.
If not then lots of knocks and scrapes.
Get a cheap run-around.
Let him drive that for a year - then go bigger and better.

Especially an Audi, which is essentially an old person’s car.

Don't know where you live but that is definitely not the case where I live. Audi's are seen as young men's cars

I'd be getting something very basic with a 1 or 1.1 litre engine at most. For both safety reasons (less powerful hopefully equals less speed) and teaching him that you start with something basic and must work to upgrade it yourself if you so choose (and that cars don't equal status).

I loved my first car which was an old metro. I was really grateful for it. Some of my friends had flash cars given them for the 18ths and even then I raised an eyebrow.