First Car

[Zippyx]

Hi

As a bit of context, we live in a good area for insurance. DS has done 'young driver' 3-4 times (1 hour lesson each time) and has driven about 4 hours on private roads around our farm. DH and I have both gone through basic parking manoeuvres with him, which he has grasped with relative ease. DS is therefore pretty confident as a driver; DH and I are equally confident in him, given the rate of progress he's made in a relatively small time. Obviously as we are not professional ADIs, he will have at least 10-15 hours of lessons as a minimum.

Now it's time to buy a car, we are looking to spend around £6,500. Firstly, is this reasonable?

Secondly, the car we are looking at is a BMW 1 Series 2011 with about 60k miles on the clock. Insurance would be about £1,500 so not too bad at all. WIBU to buy it for him?

Thanks!

Op this post was simply a stealth brag at what you can afford. Congrats, it served its purpose. Its pretty stupid to buy a 17 year old a BMW and I'm shocked you don't think that considering how much you seem to know about cars but ah well the Audi is a good choice. It will still meet your requirement of a "cool" car for your son to show off.

I agree about the stealth brag. Also agree that the Audi is a suitably "cool" car but luckily a more sensible choice than the BMW.

You aren't going to say that to the people who are spending £7000 on Ford Fiestas and KAs, are you @GreytExpectations? What about to the people who have leased brand new cars for their DC? Learn to look beyond the badge. I wanted a car for DS that wasn't a standard, boring first car - a car we could all enjoy. Nothing to do with 'stealth bragging' to strangers on the internet - which, of course, would provide me with an endless amount of glee.

I asked for advice. Advice was given, for which I am grateful and paid heed to. Nothing more; nothing less.

I don't care about cars at all, as long as they get from A to B its all good. But I do care about horses and just spent 8k on one when I could have spent 3k, so I'd be hypocritical to criticise you!

Not RTFT but my insurance went down by a hefty chunk when I went from a 1 series to a 5 series estate. I would guess because as a more stereotypically middle age man car it as a model poses less of a risk to insurers than a 1 series boy racer hot hatch. If you can get a decent price second hand might an estate be worth considering?? I’ve always driven rear wheel drive and had a 1 series at 18 OP, and possess 12 years no claims and a clean licence so it’s not necessarily an irresponsible choice like some people are making out. if it bothers people that much I think some of the modern 1 series are front wheel drive now.

We’re getting rid of our 2011 118D, sounds similar to the one you’re looking at? It’s a great, reliable little runner but DH wants an electric car.

Our 18 DD had her eye on it but we said no-simply because it’s too powerful and the insurance is crazy! (It did jump up after she passed her test) She has a Ford ka, perfectly adequate, cheap to run and repair if she scratches it. It’s 15 years old and so far very reliable; 4 members of our family have owned it over the years. It’s actually quite good fun to drive! 😀😀

My eldest DD’s partners car (second car-he started off with our old Ka) is a
116-he’s had it about three years now. He’s been fine in it-no accidents. His only complaint is that the service can be expensive-which is what we found as well. Generally around £500.

I presume though your eldest dds partner is not a teenager to get a quote of £500 for insurance.

As I have said Ds’s insurance is £1200 on a small car that he is learning on.

He will get a bigger and safer car when he drives on his own

Oliversmumsarmy—if you were referring to my post-apologies if not—I said the service is £500.

The insurance is substantially more. He was a teenager when he first got the car. It was £1.7k, three years on it’s now £720.

You aren't going to say that to the people who are spending £7000 on Ford Fiestas and KAs, are you @GreytExpectations? What about to the people who have leased brand new cars for their DC? Learn to look beyond the badge. I wanted a car for DS that wasn't a standard, boring first car - a car we could all enjoy. Nothing to do with 'stealth bragging' to strangers on the internet - which, of course, would provide me with an endless amount of glee. hmm

Oh the irony of this coming from you is too funny 😂 I don't give a shit about brand name cars or a car looking cool but you have made it very obvious that you do and if anything you are the one who should look beyond a badge but hey, you took advice and thank god because a BMW is a stupid choice for a 17 year old. If you actually did look beyond the badge then you would have known that. Don't try to pretend you don't care about showing off, it's soooo obvious that you do. Specially yourembarrassing cars comments and how you have some twisted logic about handing everything to your son.

Idon't give a shit about brand name cars or a car looking cool but you have made it very obvious that you do and if anything you are the one who should look beyond a badge
DH and I both have Hondas. If we were trying to show off, we'd have failed. Miserably.

You say that a BMW is a bad choice for a 17 year old but haven't said why - if I hadn't been offered the Audi, I'd have probably still bought the BMW because I trust that DS would have been able to drive it without issue. I don't understand the nonsensical notion that buying a BMW for £6,500 is a stealth brag but buying a Ford KA for £7000 isn't? Explain please. This is clearly an example of you not looking beyond 'BMW.'

Going by your 'logic' (if worthy of being called that!), why buy your kids iPhones when you could get them Nokia Lumias? They both do the same thing! Frankly, you're a hypocrite if you have anything more than a Nokia Lumia.

You ought to be more open; logic that differs from yours is not always "twisted." I've had the conversation with DS, and as far as he is concerned, his aim is to continue being able to afford what we can now. All you need to know is that my "twisted" logic is working: DS works unbelievably hard so he can get a job that allows him to do just that.

@lampygirl Good point regarding atypical cars for 17s perhaps being cheaper. Will look into that - thank you. And with regards to having a clean record having started with a BMW - it is possible, but unfortunately the 17 y/o stereotype forces the minority to be tarnished. RWD isn't nearly as bad as people make out: it's mostly scaremongering (in fact I'm almost convinced that MN posters work on the production lines of FWD cars!). Again, thanks for the tip!

BMW have a very high fatality rate and that is a real concern in a rural area. I would insist on a second hand Volvo . If he has an awful crash he will live. So many young people's lives are lost driving on country lanes.

@Ontheblackhill Where's the high fatality no. coming from? The fact that the majority of BMW drivers drive like twats causes that, I'm guessing!

Farm is quite a way off from where we are so he won't be driving around there. 1 Series has a 5-star NCAP rating and a massive cushiony bonnet so it's quite safe. Wouldn't hesitate purchasing it next year in that regard.

My first car was a P reg ford Escort and it was absolutely amazing (to me). It cost me £750 and I loved it. I had it for 4 years I think before the cam belt went bang.

Most young people will love the freedom regardless of the car, but a slightly safer car like a more modern Fiesta can be had for around £2K probably

BMW's are usually a poor choice for a first time driver because

A) They usually have rather powerful engines (a 116i is still over 100bhp)
B) They are rear wheel drive which if pushed hard can be much harder to control / easier to crash
C) They generally are more punchy/encourage faster driving especially with younger drivers

Op, you said you wanted the BMW because its not "boring" that shows you just are about the brand. Ford KAs are good cars and hardly get bought for the same motives behind BMWs, they are a much more reliable and realistic choice for a toung/new driver. Why are you suggesting hondas aren't good brands? I thought you didn't care about the brand?

The phone metaphor is ridiculous to be honest and I cant be bothered to answer that. However the reasons a BMW are a bad first car for a 17 year old have already been outlined already by other posters and I agree with those--why do you insist I just reiterate what has already been said? It's too powerful of a car and I wouldn't trust your ds on the road with the minimal amount of lessons you claim he has had.
if I hadn't been offered the Audi, I'd have probably still bought the BMW

OK then why did you bother posting the question on here if you were always going to go for the BMW? Couldn't possibly be to brag, perhaps?

We used to have a bmw and it was rwd. Absolutely lethal on icy roads. Hardly anyone has them here (rural).

It's massively uncool to have a flash first car here, according to dd. Having a BMW or audi as a first car automatically makes you a bit 'joey essex' apparently. Awful snobs really.

Although my approach is unique, the tough love ideology doesn't sit right with me. I want to ease my child into adulthood, rather than making it the fiasco my parents made it for me
And those are the kids to grow up with a sense of entitlement at every opportunity, who become so easily blaze with the small joys of life and always aspire to have more to get a sense of satisfaction and will think nothing of getting into debts for it. They usually grow up to be quite unhappy adults because their happiness is dependent on possessions and they always need a fix of more and better possessions.

Of course not all and you're right you raise your kid as you see fit and if you think spoiling him is the right thing to do, then who is to tell you not to.

And those are the kids to grow up with a sense of entitlement at every opportunity, who become so easily blaze with the small joys of life and always aspire to have more to get a sense of satisfaction and will think nothing of getting into debts for it. They usually grow up to be quite unhappy adults because their happiness is dependent on possessions and they always need a fix of more and better possessions.

This hits the nail on the head. I was fortunate enough to grow up with parents who were comfortable financially, not loaded, but we had a nice house in a good area, decent clothes and great holidays every year. When my sister got her licence she was handed down my dad's old car, nothing flash but she was so happy to have been given it. However, my dad worked insane hours. The thing I appreciate my parents doing was not giving us everything on a silver plate. We had part time summer jobs and we're encouraged to save or use our money for things we wanted, not needed. Although we grew up in a wealthy area where all kids wore expensive brand name clothing my parents didn't buy us those because they didn't want us to grow up entitled. I 100% agree with that choice. We had good quality, fashionable clothes that you didn't just pay for the brand and it really taught us the value of money from a young age. I like to think my parents got it right by having the middle ground but I understand we were very fortunate still. Just another perspective really. I don't agree that spoiling kids with flashy stuff is a good way to raise them but to each their own.

@GreytExpectations Why are you suggesting hondas aren't good brands? I thought you didn't care about the brand?
Who said Honda wasn't a good brand? My Honda is the best car I've ever owned - not sure about how DH feels about his Honda. However, from DS' perspective (although he wouldn't verbalise it to me so as not to be ungrateful), Hondas/Fords/VWs all make for pretty boring, unexciting cars. At my time of life, boring and unexciting suits me just fine - but there's plenty of time for that later for DS.

OK then why did you bother posting the question on here if you were always going to go for the BMW? Couldn't possibly be to brag, perhaps? Posting on here pushed me to go for the Audi for FWD - although I don't think this is really a big issue, given the fact that we're not rural - but I could be wrong so followed advice I was given.

I cannot understand why you think that bragging to random strangers on the internet would be helpful to me. If I wanted to brag, I could have done so to the people I have actually met - where it might actually provide an ego boost.

@Trewser Getting a more enjoyable car is more for DS' and our benefit than anyone else's. The Joey Essex analogy is funny though - haven't heard anything like that around here!

@swingofthings I think you're right in saying that DS is spoilt - but I'm very careful in making sure that he doesn't become entitled and wasteful with money. Currently we're at a stage with DS where he will spend money where necessary and we'll treat him to things as and when we deem appropriate, for which he is always very grateful. However, with regards to this leading to entitlement and him becoming materialistic, that would be where I would need to intervene strongly.

The insurance will be shocking. I learnt to drive at 33- whilst I had my provisional my insurance was £750 for the year on a Renault clio- when I passed it went up to £1700! 4 years on and my insurance is now at £350 but if I was an 18year old Male you can bet your bottom dollar I'd still be paying that much!

*ShitOnIt78 Just like DN, DS' provisional insurance is an entirely separate policy - will not be keeping the policy after he has passed so the costs are unrelated. DN's went up, but not as extreme as people on here have experienced. Hoping this will be the case for DS also.

As a side note, £1700 is disgusting for a 33 year old. I wish there was stricter regulation over insurers.

I think you're right in saying that DS is spoilt - but I'm very careful in making sure that he doesn't become entitled and wasteful with money
It sounds like he does already suffer from a sense of entitlement if he would think that getting a Honda would be boring.

It sounds like he suffers already of the affliction of needing to make other people envious to get a sense of self worth and sadly you are not just enabling it but encouraging it.

It will only get worse I can assure you. He'll want to be the one who can afford to go out to all the gigs at Uni, who eats at the best places, goes out drinking at any opportunity, has the flashiest phone and laptop. He'll be happy because he'll see fellow pupils wanting to be his friends until he realises it's not him they care for but his possessions and he'll be caught in the vicious circle of wanting to make new friends so get even flashier things.
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People like my kids don't really care to build true friendships with spoilt people, they find them superficial. Not all of course, some actually don't really care about the things they get from their parents, but your statement about him thinking s Honda is boring, clearly already expecting a car when he hadn't even got his license yet is really raising alarm bells.

By wanting to make him happy in the short term you are facilatating him becoming unhappy long term.

Toyota aigo or any of its clones

Great around the city or small roads, fine on a long drive, cheap to run and cheap on insurance

People buying their younguns beemers are, quite frankly, mental, regardless of circumstance

I'd be utterly amazed if the insurance was £1,500

as soon as he's got his own policy on his own car it will be far, far more.

Insurance costs depend not only on the car, but also on where you live!

My DD paid 1500 with no box, 3 yo 1.2 Fiesta, when she passed just before her 18th. It would’ve been less with black box but she was working and preferred no box. It went down to