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AIBU?

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Original poster

racism during england match tonight....

85 replies

KickItOut · 14/10/2019 22:28

So they have a 3 step rule against racism but didn’t manage to get past the 1st step despite persistent racist chants in the second half.

I cannot believe that dehumanising non-whites is still a thing today.

AIBU that there needs to be a much tougher stance against racism?

OP posts:
flapjackfairy · 15/10/2019 04:39

Yes you can argue they didn't do enough but NOT that they didn't do anything. And England had the choice to leave the pitch and abandon the game if they wanted to as stage 1 and 2 had been implemented and so stage 3 had been reached. However well done to them for maintaining their dignity throughout and as as we hopefully all agree it was disgusting behaviour and all the more unbelievable because Bulgaria had a black player on their own team . And yes we need to get our own house in order before we get too self righteous about other footballing nations.

DoctorAllcome · 15/10/2019 04:42

This is not surprising. There is a reason why none of the Syrian refugees went to Bulgaria and many are still crossing the channel to England. Because on the scale of tolerant countries, England is a glass half full compared to one smashed in your face in Bulgaria.

Original poster
KickItOut · 15/10/2019 08:56

Apparently the Bulgaria coach didn’t hear any racist chants last night! Hmm

I don’t understand how we can allow such brilliant talent on the football pitch to be subjected to such awful behaviour. The chants tell non-white people they are not human. The nazi salutes tell them that they want them dead.

Paltry £10000 fine to Football clubs is nothing. I think footballers will have to start walking off the pitch but this decision has to be collective otherwise the black player walking off will be attacked for not letting the game go on.

OP posts:
MrsMaiselsMuff · 15/10/2019 09:15

Worth reading Stan Collymore's commentary on the issue. The behaviour of the Bulgarian supporters was abysmal, but we can't deny that racism is rife here too. When our so called Prime Minister uses terms like 'Picanninies with watermelon smiles', when the Brexit vote was won based on propaganda about immigrants, we're in no position to take the moral high ground.

mobile.twitter.com/StanCollymore

SellmeyourMLMcrap · 15/10/2019 09:27

I cannot believe that dehumanising non-whites is still a thing today.

Said no non-white person ever.

What a shame this was but it's always useful when this happens in a game that people are taking notice of, unlike when it happens in U18 games etc. At least this has drawn significant attention to the issue and hopefully the authorities can act and Countries can start to educate their fans/populations.

CravingCheese · 15/10/2019 09:33

I cannot believe that dehumanising non-whites is still a thing today.

That's always been a thing.
Also for women, ethnic or religious minorities, homosexuals etc, btw.
Are you really surprised? And (yes, that's probably judgemental) in football? Where those prejudices seem to either be especially prevalent or simply put in the open much more readily than in in other situations?

Bloomburger · 15/10/2019 09:36

Nothing will be done, racism isn't taken seriously in European football at all, when you look at the fines levied on clubs and players for non offensive things written on shirts and then the paltry sums levied on clubs whose fans exhibit racist behaviour it's shocking.

Bairnsmum05 · 15/10/2019 09:56

Racism, sectarianism, anti Irish abuse is rife in football-nothing gets done about it. The SPFL and EFL need to do more about it as do each of the clubs. Someone needs to take a stance.

Moonmelodies · 15/10/2019 10:12

It's no wonder so many people want us to be detached from Europe, when they see this kind of thing going on over there.

JacquesHammer · 15/10/2019 10:15

I don't believe a broad approach of simply throwing teams out of competitions will have any effect.

I would support any international team having to play all fixtures in a neutral country for two years following any instance of racism.

I also think the FA need to do more to stamp out racism in the English game - for all the outrage from England fans on social media today, very few are willing to take a good look at the institutional racism that is rife in the domestic game.

CravingCheese · 15/10/2019 10:16

Moonmelodies

Because anti-racism and love for one's fellow human beings have clearly driven the leave campaign and motivated leave voters. Obviously. Hmm

viaLatvia · 15/10/2019 10:21

I cannot believe that dehumanising non-whites is still a thing today.

I agree but I just wanted to pull you up on something. They were making Nazi salutes. The Nazis main targets were white Ashkenazi Jews. These people just hate anyone who isn't a certain type of white Christian.

Timeywimey10 · 15/10/2019 10:28

It's no wonder so many people want us to be detached from Europe, when they see this kind of thing going on over there

These were football fans. We have people like this in our government.

SimonJT · 15/10/2019 10:28

How is anyone surprised by this? Football is an inherently racist sport, you can’t be shocked when black players have bananas thrown at them and female refs and medics are subjected to vile verbal abuse.

If you google football chants you’ll find very few that aren’t racist, sexist or homophobic. For a while if a Portugese player was on fans would even resort to M McCann chants.

FIFa won’t act as if they remove the racists, sexists and homophobes they will take a dent in their wallets. A closed game should have taken place, but that loses too much money in ticket sales.

I’m not a huge football fan, as a brown person I don’t go to games anymore as being racially abused is almost guaranteed.

CatherineOfAragonsPrayerBook · 15/10/2019 10:45

Don't watch football much, but my heart hurts when I hear this sort of thing. The mental strength of the black players on the pitch is huge. Just think, they have to be twice as strong to funnel all that noise out and concentrate on the game and perform well for their team.

Football is a dichotomy. On the one hand it's surely one of the most inclusive and diverse sports with players from almost every country and nation taking part at some point. It's also a sport that gives merit to ability. You can earn huge sums of money refardless of what colour you are, emphasis is placed on outcome.

But at the same time, how many black football coaches are there in Europe? No one remarks on the incongruity of that. Neither am I suprised that a lot of young people are involved in the racism. I was 10 years old when a teenage boy at Chessington World of Adventures called me a stupid black bitch after I walked the wrong way off the ride.

Not sure what the answer is. Perhaps players should unitedly boycott. I think women shoukd do the same in sports regarding trans men in sport.

GreytExpectations · 15/10/2019 12:01

Love how people get "shocked" at racism in 2019. Its been happening for god knows how many years and is still very prevalent today- it's never actually stopped. If you are white and are only now shocked to see this, clearly you're a bit ignorant. Which is understandable because you don't have to experience it. But Fifa don't give a shit, so it wont change. . For those who are white- just be grateful its not something you will have to deal with.

CravingCheese · 15/10/2019 12:19

These people just hate anyone who isn't a certain type of white Christian.

Absolutely. It's important to recognise that many 'white' groups and ethnicities still face (potentially really violent) racism as well. Jews, Sinti, Roma, Yenish, Sami etc...
Or 'simply' those that are recognizable as immigrants. Even if they are the right kind of religion, white etc. (I remained fairly close friends with a polish women who lives in the UK [we don't live in the UK anymore] and she really has encountered a lot of racism in the UK. And no, I'm not saying that to in any way detract from the racism POC face.)

SerendipityJane · 15/10/2019 12:22

Love how people get "shocked" at racism in 2019. Its been happening for god knows how many years and is still very prevalent today- it's never actually stopped.

It's getting worse in the UK, not better Sad.

CravingCheese · 15/10/2019 12:24

If you are white and are only now shocked to see this, clearly you're a bit ignorant.

We (my siblings and I) were beaten up and taunted as kids and teens for being the wrong kind of white (still the 'right' kind of religion btw). I also had a teacher that semi openly participated with sly digs and veiled remarks about people from... 'corrupt countries' that were just more emotional and therefore couldn't help themselves but be loud and resort to violence...Hmm

I am not saying that POC don't face worse and different kinds of racism. But assuming that white people are somehow immune from experiencing racism is a bit naive as well imo.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 15/10/2019 12:25

Unfortunately, men will be men, this is their idea of sport, you don’t get this sort of behaviour at the crochet and knitting club

To be fair, you don't get it to this extent in plenty of other games either - but in spite of all the decent fans there seems to be something about football which attracts knuckle draggers of every type

The answer is to force them to hold games behind closed doors, which would save a lot of the policing costs too, but it won't happen for the usual reason ... money

PhilSwagielka · 15/10/2019 12:31

FIFA are utterly useless. And the cynic in me wonders how many of the people chanting 'you racist bastards' at Bulgarian fans would be happy to abuse black opposition players at club matches. The Daily Mail condemned it, yet this is the same paper that regularly gives Raheem Sterling grief.

JacquesHammer · 15/10/2019 12:34

Unfortunately, men will be men, this is their idea of sport, you don’t get this sort of behaviour at the crochet and knitting club

A number of the perpetrators last night were women!

PhilSwagielka · 15/10/2019 12:35

@Moonmelodies It happens here. My own team used to have an 'Everton are white' chant because some of our stupid fans were PROUD of the fact we had no black players, and gave John Barnes no end of grief, and I've seen some dogwhistle-y stuff about Lukaku. I've not heard racist chants at Goodison Park, but my brother has. Then you get bullshit like that song about Lukaku's knob or whatever. We're not as bad as Russia or the Balkans, but racism is still alive and well here.

RolytheRhino · 15/10/2019 12:36

Still, good on them for winning by such a huge margin.

I don't understand why are the police not there arresting people? Surely it is something people should be locked up for?!

Depends what they were chanting, surely? I didn't see it, but actual threats of violence and calls-to-action, sure. A few swears and unkind comments, I wouldn't have said so, personally- it's a very slippery slope when simply insulting someone can land you in a prison cell (it already can over here, I know, but I don't agree with that either). Police possibly could've escorted them from the grounds? If the stewards had intervened they'd probably have just ended up with a riot on their hands.

IMO FIFA need to draw up a code of conduct and any large-scale flouting of that by fans or players should lead to the game stopping and the team conceding the match. Or you could simply empower the referee to decide whether the crowd is flouting the code and, if so, award a penalty to the opposing team every time it happens and every five minutes from the first penalty awarded if it's happening continually.

andyoldlabour · 15/10/2019 12:41

"The extreme far right are growing in number in these countries and the Balkans. So Called fans openly giving Nazi Salutes on the terraces."

Exactly right - Ukraine, Lithuania, Latvia, all have far right movements whose roots go back to WW2 and the German SS regiments, they make our so called far right - BNP/Britain First, look like a bunch of schoolchildren.