To tell my FIL he smells and needs to shower

[Stumpedasatree]

I appreciate this sounds harsh but it is an ongoing problem. He is 80 odd. In reasonable physical health apart from some arthritis but can walk and is mobile. He has long been a water avoider and favours sink flannel washes rather than showers. (I know this as i spent over a year living with him and my OH 20 years ago when I got acquainted with his personal hygiene routine). His routine has not changed since, and he has probably got more neglectful of it with age.

He smells awful, his clothes are stained and dirty, and unfortunately he has no sense of personal space so gets very close to you when he is talking. It's almost intolerable. I have small DC and dislike him hugging them because they will smell afterwards.

He does not pick up on subtle hints at all. Yesterday I asked him outright if he was having difficulty getting in and out of his shower and he claimed no problems at all. I want to do this gently but I cannot skirt around the issue when he doesn't pick up on hints at all.

My DH is useless. Knows he smells but hates to deal with it.

If anyone is to talk to him about his personal hygiene, it should be his son, not his daughter in law.
If his shower is over the bath, then don't encourage him to use it. They're lethal for the elderly, in terms of slipping or stepping in and out.

Does he live alone ? I'd pay for a cleaner to come in once a week to change his bed and do his laundry. Or- I'd ask your dh to arrange that

I am in my 60s but due to illness I haven't been able to get in or out of a bath for years, not even just to use the shower.
We have built a walk in shower downstairs with grab rails. I couldn't manage without it.
Do look at FIL's bathroom facilities and see whether alterations need to be made.

"But most small/young children don't have grandparents in their 80s"

What now?!

Noticing my fil was wearing grubby clothes was the first step into the realisation that something had changed, which culminated in a diagnosis of dementia several months later (alzheimers).
Op, is he failing in other simple areas, like cleaning, feeding himself, managing money etc? Has he got vision or mobility problems that might hinder him? I honestly don't think you can criticise his hygiene to his face, but help could be offered.

My son had elderly GP .Much loved MIL was 80 when my son was only 4! My husband was the youngest of 3 siblings.My own DF would have been 80 when my son was 1 (sadly died when I was a child)! People are getting married later now ,(and my own DF was jilted in the war and met and married my Mum TTC for many years 45 when I was born !)so obviously not a new thing!

Its for his son to tell him, could he talk about a walk in shower as these are easier than having a shower over a bath if that's a problem?. Social services will do a free assessment and give advice.
I personally don't think its for OP to start doing his laundry, shes got enough on with her own family. I'd say it would be better for him to have a carer doing it or a laundry service, where they pick up and drop off etc.

AutumnRose1 dottiedodah

Look, I know I wrote a stupid thing.
Please keep reading the thread until you get to the bit where I acknowledged that and apologised.

Quite possible to have a GP in their eighties if they were in their forties when they had children and then those children were also in their forties when they had a family.

You need to tackle the clothes as well as his personal hygiene. So help him to go through all his clothes to see what should be kept and what should be got rid off. Also give the wardrobes and drawers a good clean out. Then help him buy some new clothes.

cushioncovers

Quite possible to have a GP in their eighties if they were in their forties when they had children

You're absolutely right.
Please see my other posts above.

Neglect of personal hygiene in the elderly is often an early sign of dementia or depression.
You need to be diplomatic in your approach to him, saying you are concerned that he is not looking after himself, rather than “Wow, you stink”. If he has never used a shower, and prefers the sink, then installing a walk in shower may be a waste of money.
His sense of smell may well be obtunded- he may not realise he smells. I’d start with his clothes, pointing out that they’re stained and need washing, then offer a plan to deal with his laundry, either yourself or professionally. Once he’s on board with that, some gentle reminders about keeping himself clean too can follow. I’d also want to review him for possible dementia/depression.

It’s DH’s job. He will just have to stop being ‘useless’ and step up.

But most small/young children don't have grandparents in their 80s.

WTF? . what a bizarre comment. My DC are teens/tweens and their grandfather is 88. Their cousins are still tiny.

He was 43 when my DH was born 43 years ago. I said 80 odd because I didn't think his exact age was relevant.

Thanks, taking on board the comments my unreasonability.

kjhkj

But most small/young children don't have grandparents in their 80s.

WTF?. what a bizarre comment. My DC are teens/tweens and their grandfather is 88. Their cousins are still tiny.

I know.

I have posted that my comment read really randomly and I apologised to the OP.

Does nobody RTFT?

Some 30 odd years ago I got my first job - in a bingo hall.

Unsurprisingly, a lot of our customers were elderly. Some very clearly had dementia, either developing or full blown.

We had a number of customers that absolutely fucking stank. To the point where no other customers would sit within 12 feet of them, and some members of staff refused to serve them. In every case it was the clothing that was an issue - far more than inadequate body washing. (In one case, we literally counted the stains on her outfit, which increased every week. That feels awful to say now, but back in the 80s there was no such thing as safeguarding.)

Having your FIL's laundry taken care of could make a massive change here.

He has always worn grubby clothes (his appearance is never on his radar), has always smelled, and has always neglected to shower. None of this is a new thing. However it is worsening with age, or I am becoming more bothered by it.

I also had my dc in my forties, so my youngest dd was only 4 when my Mum turned 80.

Your poor FIL. I think at 80 odd you do have more to worry about than the fact that you smell. Impending loneliness, illness and death!

So I think unless the smell conversation is part of a bigger, package of care from your DH, going in say to bring him dinner once a week, chat to him, spend time, care for him. If he does that then yes, smell can be tackled. Otherwise I wouldn’t. Bless him!

But most small/young children don't have grandparents in their 80s.

Just to pick up on this, there is a 12 year age difference between my FIL and his youngest brother. My Dh is 44, our children are 16 and 13. My Dh's cousins by the youngest uncle are the same age as our children.

So "Grandad" to the cousins was actually "Great Grandad" for our children. He would be 98 now, he was 88 when he died making the Grandchildren/Great Grandchildren 6 and 3. So yes, completely possible. Not everyone has children in their 20s.

OP, you need to tell him straight but offer assistance with his clothing washing if you are close enough geographically.

I’d start with his clothes, pointing out that they’re stained and need washing, then offer a plan to deal with his laundry, either yourself or professionally. Once he’s on board with that, some gentle reminders about keeping himself clean too can follow. I’d also want to review him for possible dementia/depression

Sorry but this is enormously patronising and could seriously backfire.

My NDN is 82. She is neat as a pin but does have body odour. I think she probably sweats more than she realises and gets tired doing laundry (she has told me). But she is fully compos mentis and it's her choice to re-wear tops for an easy life. Hell, when my twins were tiny I re-wore tops that sometimes had milk staining or sweat on two days in a row as I couldn't bear any more laundry.

My mum is in her 70s and also doesn't do showers. It's not how she was brought up.

Your FIL is totally entitled to wash and launder how he wants. All this 'I would arrange to get a cleaner in' - seriously? You cannot just do that to another adult. And all the PA 'I would hint that I think he is struggling and needs care' would go down very badly with most elderly folk I know, who are (rightly IMO) afraid of what happens if they lose independence.

Rather than telling him what's what, get his son to just talk to him, honestly, and like an actual grown-up. If he comes away thinking there are signs of dementia, that's another thing.

At 86, a plan needs to be in place to help him maintain personal care. Very few 86 year olds could do this- not least because eyesight and smell goes a bit, so people can't always see or smell the dirt.

Rather than trying to guilt him into showering more, this needs to be the start of a conversation about him managing at home- it isn't realistic that he's going to cook for himself/personal care til 100! This is often a gradual process or can be a sudden drop in what he can do, for example, people often are a tiny bit incontinent without realising as their bladder muscles go when older. That wouldn't help.

Basically he needs help, he's not doing it on purpose, but what he used to do to keep clean doesn't work any more. Very few 86 year olds can fully maintain everything (even buying products might be a challenge)- many live independently, but there's usually a decline at some point, by 90 it really would be unusual to not need any help whatsoever with lifts, laundry, shopping and personal care and all of these are inter-twined to help someone not smell!

SirVixofVixHall

I also had my dc in my forties, so my youngest dd was only 4 when my Mum turned 80.

I take your point.
I've reported my stupid post.
I said here that I realised I was wrong.

For goodness sake, RTFT and help the OP with her problem rather than banging on about a a silly post for which I've apologised.

I agree that the clothes will be as much, if not more of a problem than the washing. Can you do a wash for him when you are there ? His bedding too ? Older men sometimes wear suit trousers that need dry cleaning, but never get them cleaned. If this is the case then get him some washable ones instead.
Can he manage to wash his own hair ?
I do think this will be better coming from his son, he is less likely to be embarrassed. Your DH should just tell him he needs a bath and some clean clothes.

Often people need a bit of help with washing clothes and bedding as they get a bit more frail, and personal hygiene can get worse, so if his has never been great then that doesn’t help.