Advice for a Dad

[percycov]

Good Evening!

Below is a letter I have just sent to the CMS.

I was conflicted while writing it as part of me feels i'm getting a raw deal but part of me feels i'm being unreasonable.

So i'm after opinions and advice from a mums (And dads) point of view, so all are welcome

^ALL NAMES HAVE BEEN CHANGED*

Dear Sir/Madam

I am writing regarding maintenance payments for my son XXXXX. I’m currently paying through a DEO £490.69 a month, which is taken out of my salary so my monthly pay is around £850 a month.

I would like clarification on how you came to that figure, as you seem to have been given the wrong address for me, as when my ex partner Ms Smith illegally requested a member of her family who works in finance to obtain my personal details including my work address, salary and home address, they gave her an old address. So I have not seen any correspondence as to how you came to that figure or how long I have to pay that for.

And as that figure is quite high, I’m assuming you’ve been given very one sided information so I would like to explain a few things for you to take into consideration and try give you a picture of my situation and the effect it’s having on me.

Since me and Ms Smith split 5 years ago, I’ve regularly paid maintenance. Every month. Not one payment missed. On some occasions, owing to the fact I was self employed for a few years and I didn’t always get paid myself on time, the payments were late. But never by more than 2-3 days.

I always aimed to pay 10% of what I earnt, and as I was on low earnings this was not always possible, but if their was ever a shortfall my parents would make up the difference. For 5 years I’ve never paid less than £120 a month, Ms Smith was happy with that as she knew I couldn’t afford any more. It increased to £140 a month when I changed job the beginning of last year. One thing I’m sure Ms Smith never mentioned to you was that while I was self employed, I earnt on average £826pm from October 2016 until March 2018. So for that whole period I was paying over what your own calculator suggested I should pay. I roughly worked it out and overpayments come to approx £1100 for that period. But I never complained, I never made an issue of it, I always made sure I paid no matter what.

When me and Ms Smith split up, she moved to XXXXXXX which at the time when I lived in XXXXXXX was 101miles, door to door. Where I live now it’s 104 miles door to door. So for me to have Ben for the weekend pick him up Friday, back home Sunday it’s 416 miles. I have a 2.0ltr car and on motorways I get roughly 25mpg and with fuel at about £1.30 a ltr it costs me between £80-£90 in fuel. And despite the fact it was Ms Smith who moved away with Ben she has never once brought him to me, or offered to meet halfway. In fact on the one occasion I did ask the reply was “If you want to see your son you know where he is”. So for 5 years, every month I have paid the fuel costs. But I know none of that will come into consideration.

During that period, owing to the fact my earnings were low not only was I not able to maintain regular contact with Ben due to that fact I couldn’t afford the fuel costs for the 400 mile round trip, which meant I could only see him for 1 day a month. This also wasn’t helped by Ms Smith stopping me from seeing him as and when she see fit example being if maintenance was paid a day or 2 late, I would be told I can’t come see him that weekend. Ms Smith also let slip once that if he came to stay with me anymore than he did then I’d have to pay less, but I’m sure that’s not her motive for stopping me having him.

I also got myself into considerable debt due to low earnings. I was using credit cards for everyday things like fuel and food shopping and trying to maintain contact with Ben. Currently my debts stand at around £14k, most of it credit card/overdraft debt detailed in the DMP I have attached with this letter.

In March 2018 I started a new job on a lot better money than what I was previously earning. It meant I was less reliant on credit cards, however due to repayments and interest payments I was paying about £600pm on credit card and overdraft payments per month. So any extra money I was earning just got swallowed straight up. But I still kept my maintenance payments up and still tried to maintain regular contact with Ben.

As I was earning more maintenance payments should have increased, which they didn’t. I explained to Ms Smith that I was trying to repay my debts, trying to get by day to day, trying to maintain a relationship with my son. I showed her statements proving I was paying the maximum I could physically afford. If she needed money which was a monthly occurrence, I would ask my parents to give it her, and 9 times out of 10 they would. If Ben needed any clothes or trainers for school etc which again was a monthly request, I would order it on online on credit and have it sent, no questions asked. I would always help where I could. One year when Ms Smith was struggling, my parents paid a whole years car insurance for her. So I don’t know what information Ms Smith has given you but despite her making it very difficult for me to maintain a relationship with my son, I have always helped where possible and Ben never went without anything he needed and she reluctantly understood my situation regarding my debts.

At the beginning of this year, on the brink of financial ruin, with debt collectors knocking my door regularly and almost losing everything I contacted stepchange debt charity. Told them my situation and they were very helpful. I was put onto a debt management plan, they essentially took control of my finances. And although my debt remains, my repayments were reduced significantly. As a result of this I was able to increase what I paid to Ms Smith.

But we had a disagreement over contact arrangements, her not letting me see or speak to him over the Christmas period at all. As a result I told her I would be seeking family mediation and possibly a court order if she continues to deny me access. It was then she told me she had contacted you regarding the fact I had not paid what I was supposed to when I changed jobs even though she knew the situation I was in.

So I’m assuming that’s when Ms Smith illegally obtained my information and the letters started going to an old address as she never asked my where I lived once. But she explained to me you were involved and how much I would have to pay back. Knowing I could not afford it and what implications it would have on my finances I pleaded with her, I kept showing her statements and wage slips trying to get her to be reasonable, and knowing I couldn’t afford it she went ahead anyway.

That's when the DEO kicked in. And as you can see from the DMP summary I have sent, every pound I earnt was accounted for. Once bills and day to day items were paid for, any surplus went on debt repayments. I live a very modest life. I don’t drink, don’t smoke, don't’ live extravagantly. I rent a room in a house because I can’t afford to live alone so Ben can’t have a room for himself. Only leisure time I have is when I take Ben to the cinema or bowling etc. I pay to keep my car on the road because without it I wouldn’t be able to travel to Ben.

So I hope you can see what sort of impact it’s having now I’m having £490 taken out of my salary every month. My debts are no longer being paid off so debt collectors are now chasing me again which is a massive stress on me.
I have missed car insurance payments, which if I miss any more will be cancelled. I have missed car repayments which has resulted in penalty fines. I am now relying on credit cards to get me by with day to day items such as food and fuel. I’m working 60hrs a week minimum to try get some overtime. Some days without lunch because I can’t afford it. I have to borrow money from people to afford to travel to see Ben, but I’m too ashamed to ask any more. If I keep missing car repayments it will be repossessed. I am an on call firefighter, if i was to lose my car then i would lose my job, which would mean i would lose approx £150-£200 extra income per month as well as having to spend about £200 on train tickets to see him, which I won’t be able to afford so I just won’t be able to see him any more as his mother wouldn’t ever drive up here. I paid £90 onto a credit card to arrange a family mediation meeting, to try sort this situation and to try get regular contact with Ben, but Ms Smith refused to show up. And a court order is out the question as I’d ever be able to afford it.

Ben is the most important thing in my life, it breaks my heart that I haven’t been able to have a proper relationship with him. We have a great relationship when I do see him, he loves coming to see me and gets upset when he has to leave which kills me. I think that adds to Ms Smith resentment towards me and why she tries to make maintaining a relationship with him as difficult as possible.

I don’t engage with her when she tries to argue, I don't swear at her, I was never violent or abusive towards her, my family were always good to her and despite the fact she is now getting a large sum of money every month off me she still sends me horrible abusive texts, she still tries to deny me access for no reason, her and her family write things about me on social media, lies about me, constantly telling me I am a bad father and I should try see Ben more yet its her that puts the obstacles in the way. I know a lot of this information is irrelevant but who else can I tell? The system is so heavily stacked in favour of mums, so I just have to accept it.

Ms Smith is a great Mum, and has raised Ben well. I know she has struggled financially too which is why I’ve always been willing to help out where I can. But she blames her situation on me, she moved to one of the most expensive counties to be closer to her parents and since then has struggled financially. But I have struggled too but she doesn’t see that, she thinks I live a life of luxury and I’m sitting on a pot of gold when I’m not and I think that’s where the resentment and unwillingness to help me maintain a relationship with Ben has come from. My parents have also received abusive messages from her too, which is very unreasonable as they’ve always helped her. So now they are unwilling to help anymore.

At the time of writing I have £109 in my bank account. I got paid 2 days ago and will not get paid again until the end of the month. My credit cards are all maxed out (again). And I still have bills to pay this month. I’m unable to buy things for Ben, clothes and toys etc. His birthday was recently, I had to borrow money from parents to be able to afford presents form him. When he comes to stay I’m unable to afford little things such as cinema, trips out any more, the best I can do for him is a kickabout in the park or a walk, not very exciting for a 10yr old. Whereas previous summers we’d go the beach for the day or theme parks. So tell me is my son really benefiting from this?

I haven’t lived in the same place for more than 6 months because I’m trying to stay one step ahead of the debt collectors. The stress of waiting for that knock on the door is one I wouldn’t wish on anyone. And when I was put onto my DMP I cannot put into words the relief I felt that I was given some breathing space and that feeling I was going to sink had left me. But now it’s back, and I feel like I’m about to sink again.

So that’s my situation right now. It’s pretty desperate. I’m on the brink of ruin not only financially but personally too. And Ms Smith knows this, and she doesn’t care. “It is what it is” was a response I got from her.

Everything I have put in this letter is provable with texts or bank statements, I’m not making anything up for sympathy, it’s just the situation as it is.

So many dads don’t care about their children, I am one of the ones that do everything I can for my son. I would lay down my life for my boy and he is literally the only thing keeping me going at the minute.

So I hope I get a response from you, and not just an automated robotic response hiding behind regulations etc. An actual response, from a person. And if you think the amount you are taking off me is fair then I want you to tell me why you think it’s fair. And if you think it’s ok to push someone to the brink of ruin, I want you to tell why you think it’s ok. Yes Ms Smith is getting back payments but it’s Ben that is losing out because whereas before I was able to buy him things and take him places, he doesn’t get any of that any more because I can’t afford to. And once I lose my car, which is inevitable then I can’t see how I will be able to maintain contact. So I want you to tell me why you think that’s ok.

Hope to hear from you soon

I agree with pp, they won't read all of that. You just need to ask them to recalculate. It may be quicker to call them so it's sorted sooner? £120 a month is a shockingly low amount though, you do realise that won't go anywhere near covering 50% of how much it
costs a month to raise a child?

Didn't read it all
The bit I did read sounded like you expect a pat on the back for sometimes paying 10% of your wages in maintenance
..late

She was certainly paying more than 10% of her income to look after your kid
And it didn't matter if that came late
She still needed to find money to buy food to feed that kid
Waiting 2-3 days wouldn't have been an option.

Now you want to pay her less money.

You threatened her with court - even knowing that you owed her one for letting the payments slide - even though again, your kid still needed to eat so someone has to find money even if you weren't.

You now don't have a good relationship with your child, you blame her, you don't seem to be doing much to fix it - at least nothing you mention, despite having time to write an incredibly long letter that references not being violent to your ex, as a plus point to you.

My apologies if the skim read has led me to misunderstand anything major.

I'm sure you'll get what you want anyway because that's how the system works.

Wow very few of you are supportive. I think the letter is fine. I hope you get a proper response. Good luck

I have skim read after the 10% thing because I don't understand why you think you should only pay £134 a month for your child. If you were still with your ex you'd pay a lot more. She's paying a lot more.

The CMS don't care whether you've missed car insurance payments.

However, they may be backdating payments if you've paid less than required previously. Just call them.

It is very long - can you bullet point some of it chronologically?
As a pp said though, it will probably make you feel better to send it so no real reason not to.
I would change the last paragraph though, it'll get their backs up.

Don't know where to start with how pathetic this is. Just pay for your fucking kid.

The CMS are not interested in your life story. Send what remarked has written.

That’s so sad

That's way too long, I didn't read it all.

I only read the first bit. £490 is too much on your wage. My ex pays me £500 and he earns £50k a year.

Yeahsurewhatever your summary is a bit unfair. This man's ex moved miles away with his child. If she chose to do that she should have done half of the travelling to help keep up the relationship with his son. I'm divorced and I would never move my son away from his father.

If you can't afford it write a factual letter, but drop the sob story

^

Too personal too much irrelevant stuff. Its not a dear diary.

Have you thought of moving closer to him?

CMS would have run their own checks on you, its not MRs Smiths fault

You can get child visitation order......

Genuinely, I'm not sure why you think they'll care. All they're interested in is your income and how much contact you have (and not the politics involved in why you have that amount of contact). Ask for a reassessment, the rest is irrelevant.

Your situation does sound difficult. But then again, if your son lived with you you wouldn't just be able to just decide not to spend any money on him in a month if your other outgoings were too high.

*JoxerGoesToStuttgart

I’m currently paying through a DEO £490.69 a month, which is taken out of my salary so my monthly pay is around £850 a month.

Just a clarification here. Your monthly pay is not £850. Your monthly pay is £1340 a month. (Presumably that’s after tax) You’releft with£850 a month after paying child support*

Thank you@

Ok so you had a debt management plan did you default? Is that why they are after you again?

Also she didn't illegally obtain your address they got it from your place of work you they do it for her

12% is the bare minimum if you wanted her to accept less you should have stayed current in your payments

Your car has crap fuel economy my little pug drives over 200 miles on thirty quid

How close were you living to her family? I know you said she now lives 106 miles away but how close were you before as it sounds like you have both moved

CSA wont really care about your personal history they are supposed to get 12% for your child

Call them and ask for a reconsideration

I think you sound like a great dad trying to do his best for his child without going under. No advice but hoping you get a positive response to your letter x

Considering you move every 6 m9nths cant you move near your son

I would have thought cms have calculated a shortfall on the salary rise. Is your current wage 850 after the 490etc is taken?

On another note xould a coach or train be a cheaper method of transport to pick up your son?

I wonder if the irregular contact is why ex didn't allow Christmas contact? Ben might have wanted to stay home if his relationship with you is currently not as it should
If your business is full time and only bringing this much income it's probably time to look for a different job.

Jesus, stop feeling sorry for yourself, ask them for a reduction and be done with it.

You are not exactly squeaky clean yourself before you started on the mother

If you were only paying 10% and sometimes late is it quite possible that ex moved to be somewhere she could cope financially / had family support? We're you regularly seeing your son more than eow before the move? I know it's normal mn law that the one who moved should travel but there are often v good reasons for doing so and if she's only getting a tiny amount of ££ in maintenance I doubt she can afford to. It's not 'very sad' and most of your letter is irrelevant. Write giving correct address, earnings info and your debt recovery plan.

£120 a month?! Poor little kid ☹️

This is a letter to a professional organisation. It isn’t going to a therapist.

Cut out all the emotional stuff and just put the facts and allegations you want them look at in it, preferably as bullet points.

A complete waste of time it was writing this letter, sorry.

I showed her statements proving I was paying the maximum I could physically afford

This says it all. Maintenance is not a payment that comes after everything else is paid. It is the FIRST bill you should be paying, before rent, and certainly before credit cards payment. This is very much what you will be told if you send this letter.

I do sympathise and feel sorry for you, in relation to her moving away. I have little respect with resident parents who move so far away that ultimately, it means that contact can't continue regularly.

But it doesn't take away that your approach to maintenance payment is selfish and wrong, sadly a reflection of how to many non resident parent think. Think of it, you could have a father earning £60k a month who decides to buy a £30K car, rent a £1500 a month flat, accrue credit card debts due to buying expensive toys, spending £300 going out every week-ends, going on fancy holidays etc... and then cry that after paying all the above, he can only pay £20 a week.

Of course that would be wrong. The principle applies to everyone. It's really sad that you didn't look earlier in fully understanding what you should have paid. Now you are finding yourself with massive arrears and trying to unpick if they are correct, which they probably are not, but with the lack of involvement earlier, it is going to be an absolute nightmore to unravel.

You best bet is to cooperate with them to get as close as you can to an understanding of why you are paying that amount and coming up with an agreement that means you can still travel to see your son. It's mental draining, exhausting, but your son is worth it. Before you know it, he will be older and able to make decision of his own. You relationship with him as an adult will be as rewarding if not more than when he is a child and he will be an adult for a long time!

Definitely keep the letter short and factual - but it might be easier just to phone them and get it sorted over the phone.

The distance must be really difficult but it sounds like your ex has moved back to her home town for family support rather than she just fancied living in a different area. I think one of the biggest things you can do to help with the cost of travelling is get a car with better fuel economy, you really don’t need one with 2.0 litre engine. I have a 1.2litre and can get about 400 miles out of £50.

And BOOM the op is gone

swingofthings maintenance should be paid before rent? Completely disagree with that. Do you expect NRPs to live on the streets? I receive maintenance from my ex and I wouldn't expect him to go into rent arrears to pay maintenance instead. Of course NRPs should live within their means but I doubt the OP here is buying expensive cars and holidays on his salary.