To think there should be more funding for under 3yo childcare?

[Rainbowhairdontcare]

I know things are better nowadays, but still find it disheartening that two parents in FT work will only get the "tax-free" childcare help (around 20%). Our take-home pay is around £2k after commuting costs, £1k go to housing and utility bills (CT, energy, and broadband) and then 800 go to childcare even after that 20% off. Leaving us with £200 to feed ourselves, unexpected bills, road tax, insurance, etc..

Our basic UC is 750 +650 of childcare. Our deduction is £1350 so we're still better off with tax free childcare. As this is unsustainable, DH will have to go part time. A bit unfortunate given we don't want to rely on the system, but it's what works out best for our family. We'd both like to work FYT but because childcare is too expensive we can't afford to work as much as we'd like.

Personally I think universal childcare is the answer.

YABU, people should consider all the costs before having children.

Who do people think is going to pay for the NHS & pensions if people stop having children?

It just needs to be means tested. If you’re working but earning under a certain amount you should get some assistance. If you earn well or don’t work at all, you shouldn’t get help. 30 hours at 3 is just daft

Yes that was me orange but you get 15 hours simply for earning less than 16k a child with 2 ft working parents could easily be as poor as one with an under 16k family income. I didnt compare foster children or even mention domestic violence

I was giving real life examples I know of who have been so grateful and enormously benefited from those free hours. I didn’t say you said you deserved it more than them. But deprivation is beyond disposable income, hence why the hours can make such a difference and evidence shows early intervention and support can make a huge difference.

orange i think youre missing the point but i wont argue with you

Q

You are ok then with all that money.
If there were no nurseries as was the post I was replying to, parents would have to look after their own.
It's not rocket science.
If you both want to work and have children, you need childcare, either paid, voluntary from friends/family.
If you can't afford this after government subsidy then you have to look at other lifestyle choices.
I have never said cc shouldn't be subsidised btw, I just think it's enough as it is.
Nobody needs to give up their jobs either, but it saves a hell of a lot of money if both parents work pt round the kids.

holiday Genuinely not being obtuse so if you think I’m missing something fill me in!

Who do people think is going to pay for the NHS & pensions if people stop having children?

^This. I haven't RTFT but if people on lower incomes stopped having children, what do people think would happen? There would be an increasingly aging population with barely anyone to replace it (unless there was more immigration I guess, but a lot of people seem pretty hostile to that too). It would surely have economic and demographic consequences if only certain people had children.

It's a choice to have children and it's a choice to use paid childcare. My aunt and uncle worked opposite shifts for more than a decade trip avoid it. We pay for DS, I chose to have a child, I made sure I could afford to raise one before I did.

I qualified for 15 hours nursery when DS3 was 2. I was very suddenly and traumatically left a single mum. I was and still am working 16 hours a week round the special needs of my older two DC. So qualifying for 2 YO funding does not mean you don't work. And as for planning, my situation is proof that unforeseeable events happen and even the best plans are not guaranteed. Thank goodness we have a safety net, for now at least.

personally i think if you dont work, you should not get free childcare- even if your child is 2 or 3!

why on earth if you dont work should you get childcare paid for? and us morons work, dont see as much of our kids and pay for childcare

*said by someone who pays for child care,and works..!

How do you qualify for 2 year old funding.

Funding for 2 year olds is for socialising and for the benefit of the children it's not childcare

My bill next month is £1000 2 kids one in school dh FT me 4 days per week it's more than our mortgage 3 months until funding kicks in and pressure comes off it's been an expensive couple of years

From my post earlier.

To qualify for 15 funded hours at 2 you must receive the following demerits or fulfil the following criteria....

-Income Support
-income-based Jobseeker’s Allowance (JSA)
-income-related Employment and Support Allowance ---(ESA)
-Universal Credit - if you and your partner have a combined income from work of £15,400 or less a year, after tax
-tax credits and you have an income of £16,190 or less a year, before tax
-the guaranteed element of State Pension Credit
-support through part 6 of the Immigration and Asylum Act
-they’re looked after by a local council
-they have a current statement ofspecial education needs (SEN)or an education, health and care (EHC) plan
-they getDisability Living Allowance
-they’ve left care under a special guardianship order, child arrangements order or adoption order

In Ireland childcare is still expensive but we have the ECCE Scheme which provides early childhood care and education for children of pre-school age. The scheme is offered in early years settings (pre-schools, Montessori’s, creches, playgroups) for 3 hours a day, 5 days a week, 38 weeks of the year.

ALL children are entitled to 2 full academic years on the ECCE scheme.
Children are eligible to start the ECCE scheme in the September of the year that they turn 3 years old. For example, a child turning 3 years old in 2019 can be registered on the ECCE scheme in September 2019.

That's slightly better than waiting for the term after they turn 3.

You do what you've got to do. I went back to work part time recently(without the prospects and earning potential you have), DC in nursery, and took a second job evenings/weekends outside of DH's hours so no childcare needed, to make ends meet. You've got to do what you've got to do

My 2ds are in their twenties and we got no help with childcare. Don’t have children until you can afford to and only have as many as you can afford. My husband had to retire early due to ill health and does not qualify for any benefits and won’t live long enough to collect a state pension. I brought up my own children and am now having to work full time to support my husband. Get your ducks in a row before you have kids - you know what your earnings are. I’m fed up paying into a system for the benefit of everyone but me.

The problem is women dont have all the time in the world to have babies. Something has gone wrong when working families can't afford one or two children.

I’m fed up paying into a system for the benefit of everyone but me

presumably you don't go to the doctors, your husband doesn't use the hospital?

your kids didn't go to state school, or ever see a GP? Did you give birth entirely alone or did you go to hospital, or have a midwife?

I can see why you feel like that but there are some very selfish comments on this thread. As children most of us will have had a free education, and most of us will have been born in an NHS hospital or at home with an NHS midwife.

Like a PP said I would much rather my taxes go towards children, and our future than a lot of other things.

I probably wont benefit much in the future, I doubt i'll have a state pension and i'll almost certainly have to fund my own care if I get old and need it. The NHS probably wont be free any more, so if anyone should get to whinge about "not getting anything back" it will likely be my generation in about 20-30 years time.

I think there's a complete lack of empathy and that's fair enough, I think up to a few years ago might have been the same.

Like I mentioned before, my education ddyn't cost the system a penny. Before when I was well off I preferred private GPs/DRs So even then I cost the NHS very little. (I even had treatment abroad once).
My parents won't cost the system a penny either.

But now after my life being turned upside down I can see that not everything is as black and white as I thought. In my naivety I thought two working parents on MW could afford a "decent" life because that's what the welfare system was supposed to do. I was very wrong.

Something has gone wrong when working families can't afford one or two children.

This.

We're the first generation where house prices are so expensive that mortgages need two (good) wages. Childcare was a hell of a lot cheaper too, with lots of free or cheap crèches, and lots of non working parents to help out. Family (mostly grannies) were more able to help out too, as it was rare for women to still be working in their 50s/60s, if they worked at all after marriage. Having said that there was an awful lot of poverty too.

If the only people procreating were the wealthy or the very poor and unemployed we'd be fucked.

Who do people think is going to pay for the NHS & pensions if people stop having children?

By not having any children I have a very chunky private pension and can afford private medical care.

Good for you @SherbetSaucer. What about everyone else?