To ignore Lush staff member to her face?

[OrangeMangoSmoothie]

I love Lush, unfortunately as anyone who's ever been knows, the staff can be a bit overwhelming. Grabbing your arms to rub products on, pouncing the second you're through the door, etc.

And as much as i love Lush, i'm also autistic and really bad with people and communication. I normally order online but if something is new i'd prefer to smell it first.

I went in today to browse the new halloween range and had very obvious headphones on with my back to staff. I kinda thought this would deter them but one popped up in front of my face (literally) as if to mouth something to me and gestured to the products.

Sometimes things like that happen, for example on public transport, or if im in someone's way and i can potentially take off my headphones and say sorry/no/excuse me. But i panicked because of how insanely close she was and recoiled then turned and moved. She then followed me a little bit (i had my head facing down) and she bent over to ask again, i think she said "can i help you with anything" but i still had noise cancelling headphones and music playing. I kept my head down and meandered a little then darted out the door.

I know on reflection that this was a bit rude on my part and i feel bad now for not answering but i wasn't capable. Was she BU to continue trying to get my attention? It felt like overkill and very intrusive. Im not sure if im overreacting because i need the space. Im used to people realising i "cant hear" them and leaving me be.

Im too embarrassed to wear anything like a badge saying i'm disabled and it would probably attract staff to want to "help" me more if i did. Does anyone have any advice on how to seem less rude when im not able to speak? Did this lady take it too far?

Are management bastards to staff now? I worked there about 12 years ago and absolutely loved it and all the people I worked with were genuinely awesome people.

AFAIK, there has always been a horrible culture at Lush when it comes to upper/middle management and shitty treatment of staff. Insisting that staff are pushy to the point of harassment is the tip of the iceberg. I remember Lush stores had to have their doors open even when it was freezing outside; the “naked” campaign; the “kissing” campaign.

mitheringsfrommorningside.wordpress.com/tag/lush-cruelty-free-kisses/

Not to mention workplace bullying that can’t be addressed because they don’t have an HR department.

Have Lush invested in an HR department yet? I think they consider themselves too hippy and bohemian for such a thing.

Anyway, that’s a bit off topic, sorry OP.

Surely these connections, trivial or not, are all part of life’s glorious tapestry

HAHAHAHAAAAAHA!

HAHAHHAHAAAAAHHHHAAAA!!!!

I tend to leave a shop quite quickly once bothered by staff - in my experience the ‘No thank you I’m just looking’ reply only leads to them watching you like a hawk instead.

I’m not autistic but I am quite shy

‘Some of the comments here make me despair. Do we really want to reach a point where we expect retail staff to do nothing more than nod at us as we browse? Surely these connections, trivial or not, are all part of life’s glorious tapestry. I understand those who are autistic may struggle with these encounters. However, the rest of us should revel in contact and chat with others.‘

Um, no. They’re just talking to you to pay their bills.

@adaline
We're scored out of 100 for our mystery shops. However, if you fail to do one of the following, you fail, no matter how well you did on the rest of it: greeting the customer within 30 seconds of them walking through the door offering the customer an additional item to what it is they're purchasing

We have to do those things. We're not doing it to piss you off, or to get in your face, or to wind you up. It's our JOBS.

Up to this point I was totally sympathetic with you and I was going to ask your advice on how we, as customers, can best get the message across to the management about how much we dislike this.

Unfortunately, you then said THIS:

Being rude to sales assistants by shoving your hands in their faces or blanking them, or turning around and walking out, says more about you than it does about them

I'm sorry that you have a shit, bullying employer, and that you are forced to in turn bully and harass members of the public.

However, blaming that on the customers - in a thread where many people have shared their very legitimate and personal reasons for responding like this - is appallingly tone-deaf, nasty and insensitive, and I'm afraid totally undermines your claim that you're the 'victim' in all of this.

It isn’t rude to turn around and walk out of a shop.

I tend to leave a shop quite quickly once bothered by staff - in my experience the ‘No thank you I’m just looking’ reply only leads to them watching you like a hawk instead

Yes, if you aren't friendly, you must be a shop-lifter, obvs.

I find Benefit staff very pushy too. If I want something from a Benefit counter I have to walk past while having a shifty look to see if they have what I want without them noticing, and then come back and grab it and take it to the till when they are looking the other way. It's ridiculous. Why do shops/brands train their staff to be like this? And then they wonder why people shop online - well, I wonder!

the rest of us should revel in contact and chat with others No. Leave me alone, I'll seek a member of staff out if I need help with anything.

Being rude to sales assistants by shoving your hands in their faces or blanking them, or turning around and walking out, says more about you than it does about them

Why is it not considered not rude to insist on validation from other people, but rude to dislike such insistence? For example, wanting to read a book on a train is considered rude if someone wants to speak to you. Why is their need to talk to me more important than my need to read my book?

Do any MNers work in the shop HQ ivory towers? Maybe they could provide some feedback to their colleagues that pushiness actually puts off a good proportion of the population?

Lush staff are so intense, I never spend more than a minute in there because at least 3 different people jump on you after walking 5ft in the store. Have they not got the memo people recoil at behaviour like this? i don't think you were being unreasonable to react the way you did at all.

We have to do those things. We're not doing it to piss you off, or to get in your face, or to wind you up. It's our JOBS

So I repeat, why are staff not providing feedback that it puts people off and doesn't work. All I can think is that people (women) are so conditioned to be people pleasers that they are too concerned about seeming rude if they say no, so say yes to the half price fragrance in Superdrug or whatever.

All you have to do is say I'd like to browse on my own please and smile. Job done. They don't need to know anything about you.

So I repeat, why are staff not providing feedback that it puts people off and doesn't work

We do - but we're ignored. Upper management don't care what shop staff think. In the nicest way - sales assistants on minimum wage are easily replaced. If you kick up a fuss or refuse to do your job, they'll find someone else to do it for you.

Why is it not considered not rude to insist on validation from other people, but rude to dislike such insistence?

We're not insisting on validation from anyone - we are just doing our jobs! Why is that so hard to understand?!

Staff don’t say anything because it is Lush’s business model to provide a service to the proportion of the population who want to pay to go and stand in a shop and be sold lumps of bicarbonate of soda worth 2p by a bunch of fawning minions.

Because there genuinely are many people whose sense of self importance and popularity is bolstered by being surrounded by fawning minions.

Being rude to sales assistants by shoving your hands in their faces or blanking them, or turning around and walking out, says more about you than it does about them

This is a commercial exchange. It is not a birthday party or a stranger approaching you for directions or someone striking up a conversation on the bus.

No one should be rude, but blanking someone who can't leave you alone is perfectly fine.

@funghi Autism doesn’t prevent someone from having a stock response for such a situation.

Yes it can do. When you're surprised by an unexpected event, you can't "think on your feet" and end up either saying something stupid or just ignoring and running off. However much you plan and practice, when it happens you don't function.

Because there genuinely are many people whose sense of self importance and popularity is bolstered by being surrounded by fawning minions

Is this an accepted marketing concept? Because I don't know anyone who actually likes being targeted by salespeople, but I guess it would make sense that if the customers really hated it, it would affect their bottom line and so, it would stop.

We have to do those things. We're not doing it to piss you off, or to get in your face, or to wind you up. It's our JOBS

But in this case, the assistant persisted and that's the problem.

I don't mind a simple "can I help you", but won't tolerate them persisting when I've said no.

Luckily the vast majority of shop assistants are capable of reading their customers and will step back.

Lack of eye contact, headphones, etc are all clear signs of not wanting to be fawned over.

A quick google for their customer strategy brought up this nonsense...

‘Lush employees are also known for going the extra mile, and striving to create friendly, memorable, and personal interactions with shoppers that aren’t based on retail transactions. It’s been reported that staff use ‘facts of the day’ in order to connect with certain emotions. So, if the weather outside is dark and miserable, Lush might aim to counteract this mood by recommending particularly bright and cheerful products.

When you compare the type of customer service offered in Lush to other retail stores, many pale in comparison. Of course, there is the danger that not all customers will want a conversation as they shop, yet it remains an integral way in which Lush differentiates itself to create a memorable store experience.‘

Surely these connections, trivial or not, are all part of life’s glorious tapestry. I understand those who are autistic may struggle with these encounters. However, the rest of us should revel in contact and chat with others.

Not if it's blatantly obvious they're just doing it for money. I'd far rather have genuine human interactions. Funny how these shop assistants suddenly lose all interest in "life's glorious tapestry" when it becomes clear you're not going to buy anything.

@adaline
Being rude to sales assistants by shoving your hands in their faces or blanking them, or turning around and walking out, says more about you than it does about them

What exactly do you think it 'says about' them?

This is a commercial exchange.

That doesn't give one party carte blanche to be rude to the other! It is rude to put your hand in someone's face, or to turn around and blank them, or to snidely mutter about them to your friend. I've seen all those things happen to my staff and it's just unnecessary. A polite "hello" or "we're just browsing, thank you" is fine and hardly onerous.

But in this case, the assistant persisted and that's the problem.

I totally agree and the assistant shouldn't have pushed further once she'd been told no. However, some people on here have said they put their hands in people's faces, turn around and walk out and blank a simple "hello", seemingly forgetting that the assistant they're being rude to is just doing their job.

What exactly do you think it 'says about' them?

It says they're bloody rude. There is no excuse for shoving your hand in someone's face when all they've done is say "good morning" or "can I help you?".

Or do you think that's an acceptable way to treat a fellow human being who is JUST DOING THEIR JOB?

I really like the stuff but the hard sales is frankly putting me off going in Lush. I spent £18 on some shampoo and conditioner bars last time which I would never have bought and much regretted. We had a full five min demo. My DP is a polite man but he kept busting into laughter and had to walk away. When I asked him why he said she was basically demonstrating how to use a bar of soap for five minutes. Dip it in the water, rub it in you hands, see the lather... repeat till I just caved. OK I WILL TAKE THE SOAP...

Don't get me started on Clarks!

SummerHouse and that’s exactly why they do it. Nothing at all to do with providing an ‘experience for customers’ - it’s so people feel pressured into buying stuff.