To think that surely this is child abuse?

[FiveFarthings]

An episode of Stacey Dooley Sleeps Over is airing tonight which features a family with three children aged 8, 4 and a baby and the parents let the kids do whatever they want and it’s so extreme I think it’s verging on abuse.

The kids are ‘home schooled’ but the 8 year old cannot write his own name. The parents say it isn’t a priority and that he will pick it up eventually. The kids all sleep in the same bed as their parents, they have no set time for bed and they can eat whatever they want whenever they want. To be fair the kids do seem to eat a lot of veg so I can’t knock that. The four year old is still in nappies.

They don’t enforce teeth brushing- tooth brushes are available to the kids but if they don’t want to brush their teeth, they won’t make them. They also don’t believe in main stream medicine (including antibiotics and vaccinations).

Surely this is child abuse?! Also aren’t there any checks made if children are home schooled to ensure they are actually been taught properly?

Here is a link to an article about it- www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-7473545/Father-lives-social-housing-insisted-no-intention-finding-time-work.html

I can’t stand Stacey Dooley but I’m going to have to watch this tonight because I really can’t believe this!

These people only exist because of other people's hard work and choices.

They live off the taxes paid by others. Their children are relatively safe from diseases as others people immunise and build up herd immunity.

And what auto immune disease does he have? That grouping covers everything from mild skin disease right up to totally debilitating conditions. Given that he teaches yoga, wants to grow their own food, and was Crowdfunding for a move to Coast Rica, I'm guesing it's not too bad!

Saying that, don't most skulls from our ancestors 100s of years ago have a full set of nashers? None of them had toothbrushes like we do today - didn't even have Colgate?!

Didn't even have Colgate? 🤣. Nor did they have the fuck ton of sugared infused food and drink available today!

nononver

No. Also, most died before the age of 5, and almost all by 40. Hopefully these children will do better than that, if measles or typhoid doesnt get them first.

Hopefully these children will do better than that, if measles or typhoid doesnt get them first.

Yes, hopefully. I have absolutely no time for people who choose not to vaccinate their children.

I wanted to watch this but could not find it last night on the TV.

Is it on iPlayer? I cannot find it on iPlayer!!!

Where can I watch it!?

Christ, why have all these Daily Mail frothers appeared on Mumsnet lately? I used to come on here for a bit a sanity...

It is not neglectful to sleep with your children; in many cultures it is the norm. It is not necessary to have a formal education at such a young age; there is evidence that starting too young hinders long term achievement. It's not necessarily a bad thing to allow kids to eat when they are hungry, especially if there eating healthy stuff. The teeth thing is not great but if they have tooth brushes and they are encouraged to brush, it's not that bad either. You have no idea why the dad doesn't work; if he has an auto- immune disease then this might explain it. People on tv aren't always honest about their reasons for doing things.

I hate these kind of programmes ( prob on channel 5) created to wind up the type of people who cite the Daily Mail as a "news" source.

I have no issue with them all sleeping in one bed or even allowing the kids to eat what they want when they want - I quite like this approach, not demonising food as good and bad.

But all the other things - awful! Especially the non teeth brushing.

I haven't seen it. I think homeschooling/ unschooling can probably be a great alternative to institutionlising children from toddlerhood - however I think it needs to be done in a Montessori-style way where children are given a wide range of opportunities for unstructured learning every day- both academically, creatively, socially and personal care. Leaving them to be 'raised by wolves' isn't going to provide the necessary level of 'humanness' (memes if you want to go Dawkins on it) they need to absorb whilst their brains are at peak 'plasticity'.

They sound like typical Brighton people to me, it's down the road but I avoid it like the plague.

I live a few miles from Brighton, and ikwym, @madcatladyforever. But I also recognise that this is a lazy stereotype (DP describes Lewes as "the town Brighton people move to when they've grown up and started washing").

I don't think this family sounds abusive, per se, but it's also far from ideal.

What I find most worrying about it is the health side of it. Most of the rest is sortable later on if the children want to (for example, get an education), but if they get ill, it might not be. Plus the non-vaccination, because that puts others at risk.

MyDcAreMarvel I was homeschooled for a time and we had someone come out to see what I was being taught.

Can someone please tell me where I can watch the damn programme!!!???

Having clicked on the Daily Mail link I am not surprised to see their angle is focused on the fact that the dad doesn’t work.
“Oooh look at the long-haired layabout, doesn’t want a job!”

I bet the comments column is full of badly spelt, ungrammatical rants about how the children will grow up illiterate, too.

To those saying the whole family sleeping together is "natural": Yes it is in the sense that for a lot of human history, and in many countries still, a whole household generally lived/s in one room. There are no bedrooms to have separate space. So everyone sleeps together. Not just the nuclear family that is common in co-sleeping circles, but everyone in that household. Extended family and friends who live there too.
It was only in medieval times that a rich couple would have their own bedroom, but all other members of the household slept in one room together. All members of the family and servants.
If you want to argue co-sleeping is "natural" then you should be inviting any guest in your house to sleep with you all together.

I know SS have visited this family. Kids are only taken into care when things are extreme. There are lots of kids living in neglectful households who who do not meet the criteria for ongoing SS involvement.

At best this can be described as "neglect" and sadly due to "lack of resources" Local Authorities may only take action if there is a pretty immediate threat to life ...

Also aren’t there any checks made if children are home schooled to ensure they are actually been taught properly

No, home education isn’t a safe guarding concern, neither is co-sleeping. They’re a bit ‘out there’ but they’re actually a lovely family.

Ds couldn't write his own name till he was 7 and he went to school.

He was in nappies still at 4.

He is in college, working on his NVQ and does part time work.

They all get there eventually.

Also aren’t there any checks made if children are home schooled to ensure they are actually been taught properly

There are checks to see if the child is receiving an education.

It doesn't state what an education is.

Your child might not be able to read or write but if they are being taught how to become a concert pianist then they are receiving an education

There are checks to see if the child is receiving an education.

There isn’t. No need to provide evidence, see anyone, follow a curriculum etc a general educational philosophy when you deregister the child is all.
I’ve been home educating a few years now and know families who have been doing it a lot longer.

SuitedandBooted he has rheumatoid arthritis which can be incredibly painful and debilitating. I Can't write more than a couple of sentences because of mine and using my thumb to grip anything is very painful and mine is incredibly mild.

A few local authorities do checks on HE, although they are voluntary for parents to participate in. The vast majority do nothing. The HE community fight tooth and nail to stop any Government attempts to put in mandatory checks.

Wikipedia itself isn't exactly a reliable source. So true, to the point that one of my Year 11s changed the word daffodil to Daniel every time it appeared in a fairly scientific article on there. Very unreliable.

YANBU, OP. Even the trailer made me clutch my pearls. Mum saying that he's learning about himself whilst swinging from a tyre swing. Learning nothing and not being made into any kind of useful citizen. Neglectful at best, abusive at best. The dad seems utterly uncaring. What will these children do for employment in a few years? When and how will they learn to become literate? Are SS seriously letting them get on and not educate their children in any way? Are there not checks if you home school?

I am unreasonable, I wanted to give the parents a slap.

Sick of these people being given air time, it only encourages them. I've seen them in various magazines, tv interviews and now this and I am fed up of them thinking their kids behaving like feral children due to poor upbringing is okay

Opheliasgoldenwine

I agree. They seem to be desperate for airtime and attention. I wonder how much they get paid for all these appearances.

It sounds like a similar program but on channel 4, called feral families. They did the same with their children. No set bedtimes, mealtimes etc.

Look forward to watching it x