Is your mum supportive and emotionally available?

[Shangrilala]

I don’t feel I’ve ever had that special close bond/relationship with my own mother. She’s critical, judgey, defensive and very much close minded/emotionally unavailable.
I’m a mother too now and in my early forties. I’ve had issues my whole life with intimacy, self acceptance and body image. Depression featured heavily in my teenage years. Alcohol came later. Now chronic anxiety.
It’s dawning in me (albeit too late) that my unfulfilling relationship with my mother has basically screwed all this for me

Everyone seems to expect their mother to be perfect, for them to know how to do this parenting thing. Mothers can have mental health issues too, your crap does not trump their crap just because you are their offspring. Who was supporting her in how to do this parenting thing when you were small?

I accept that in my mum. However her mental health issues made my childhood hell, growing up being repeatedly told that your mum of all people wished you were a cot death statistic, being left in the supermarket/the shops, screamed at, locked in the bathroom as a hungry screaming baby (by her own admission). That's before we get into the fights, the night my dad almost bled to death in front of me and the fact that I was treated as an adult and privy to details of my parents relationship no child should ever get to hear way before I was one. Oddily enough every single mental hcp has told me how "resilient" I am. I also have zero self esteem, loathe myself, think about killing myself on a regular basis and wish I could walk out of my life because if my mother doesn't think I'm good enough for anything, why on earth would anyone else.

Parenting is hard, parenting with mental health issues harder still but she gets zero sympathy from me, because I've been there and so far have managed to avoid locking my children in the bathroom to get away from them, leaving them in a major supermarket or telling them I wished they were dead.

She wants pictures of my children looking adorable to show her friends and presents for her birthday/Christmas. That's it.

I don’t expect my mum to be perfect and I accept she has mh problems

But she is the most utterly selfish person I know but she is my mum and has no one else apart from myself and ds

When she dies I know I shall miss her but I shall also be free

No. She lives in a different part of the country so isn't available on a practical level either. She is quite emotionally distant.
I always just had to get on with things; now I sometimes get overwhelmed with day to day stuff and can't explain it to others as I don't know how. Regularly had criticisms about my appearance as I don't dress or have my hair like she thinks I should. Doesn't want to listen to the opinions of others which I am trying to raise DD to do as I think it's important (especially on this current climate) but no only her opinion is correct.

When I had my DD1, I was overwhelmed with such love and dreams of our relationship and mother and daughter bond - it hit me so hard that everything I envisaged for me DD and I, I never had with my mum. I never knew any different growing up, but I was so emotionally disconnected from my mum. She was a care-giver, but not a supporter, listener, friend. She was never proud of me, and never was happy with anything that I achieved.

I plummeted into deep PND after DD1 as I could fathom how my mum couldn’t love me, when I felt nothing but love and joy when I looked at my baby.

My mum cut me off after having DD1, and although our relationship has repaired since, I will never forget how I was made feel. When I was diagnosed with PND, she never rang, visited or contacted me.

It has now come to light, a few years on, that she did so because she was coming to terms with becoming a grandmother. As always - it was all about her.

I have realised a lot of it was perhaps due to jealousy; I had my masters, had a good job, loving relationship and had bought my first home.

Some mothers are selfless, some are selfish. I hope every day that my relationship with my DDs are different to that of ours. Although my DDs are very young, I tell them over and over how proud I am of them and how I love them dearly.

OP
Sorry you have a shit mum. Shit happens.
Don’t let it screw up your life. You don’t need a shit mum in your life. Ive cut out toxic family members, you can too.
Be the person you want to be despite your mum.
Don’t let her grind you down.

Parenting is hard, parenting with mental health issues harder still but she gets zero sympathy from me, because I've been there and so far have managed to avoid locking my children in the bathroom to get away from them, leaving them in a major supermarket or telling them I wished they were dead.

I guess we can have empathy but still reject and loath the behavior.

Have empathy that it’s not coming from
Mental health issues but reject the behavior because it’s an unacceptable breach of boundaries.

I struggle to communicate empathy with my mother. I think she deserves my empathy. But because she gave me none I’m
So scared of her rejection and so angry by her attitude towards me I’m finding it hard to tap into my feelings and validate her... which could mean validating her blame
And self righteousness.

I don’t think I understand her.

Difficult mother and mother in law relationships here. In very different ways. They've both had different traumas which has utterly defined them and their view of the world. Both are brittle.

My relationship with ex mil opened my eyes. Years on, she's still incredibly warm with me. She is affectionate, interested in my news and has an endless supply of wise advice, if I ask for it. She's not judgemental. I feel so much more comfortable.

I now realise it's not me. I can observe the behaviour from a detached viewpoint and think they're both just odd people. It's a very great shame but how it is. It's affected my ability to be intimate in relationships, emotionally.

I am so different with my dcs. I try to support, not judge and give them unconditional warmth and the room to be themselves.

I was also thinking that my friends tend to be very warm, straightforward people. I run a mile from drama llamas or cold people as I just don't want to be around them.

Have empathy that it’s not* coming from
Mental health issues but reject the behavior because it’s an unacceptable breach of boundaries.

I could have written your post. My mum is currently not taking to me (again) because if some perceived slight. She is emotionally distant and hyper sensitive but like others have said always there for practical matters. She is also critical and judgmental. Was hideously inconsistent when I was a child and I never knew where I was.

It does stay with you. I am currently working on my attachment issues. I think I am a disorganised attacher. I struggle to attach to anyone properly including my DS. I hope to god I haven't passed on my issues to him. Because I can't attach I am very lonely. I have also suffered from depression and anxiety since my teens.

My mum is the way she is though because of her upbringing. She was physically, emotionally dnd psychologically abused my her parents as a child. My mum may have had trouble being a secure and attached parent but I did not have the hideous upbringing she had. She tried her best I just don't think she is capable of being anything other than how she is.

Have empathy that it’s —not— coming from
Mental health issues but reject the behavior because it’s an unacceptable breach of boundaries.

Right there with you OP! Eventually the anxiety got so bad that I was referred to Clinical Psychology. Had Cognitive Analytical Therapy (CAT) for a significant period of time and now have a much greater understanding of the impact of her behaviour on me and am learning how to manage both myself and our relationship in a more functional way. May not be the answer for everyone, but personally I would highly recommend it!

No. Another poster mentioned “manipulation, self pity and lies” and that pretty much sums my mother up. She is prone to extreme sentimentality, but not really deep emotion, and I’ve eventually come to the conclusion that she’s incapable of empathy. She likes to be either victim or rescuer, but she can’t cope with relationships on an equal footing. And I know she loves me, but she doesn’t like me. She says I’m cold. It’s very true that I keep her at arm’s length because anything I tell her is immediately transmitted to everyone she knows, because she can’t resist being the holder of information. Our relationship is very difficult and mainly based on obligation and guilt on my part and incomprehension and accusations on hers. I wish it wasn’t like that, but the older I get the more I realise that her issues are very, very deep-rooted and my poor relationship with her is a symptom of that, not the cause.

Mine died in 2017.

My mum is just distant emotionally... always has been. Since moving out 20+ years ago she's never rang me directly for a chat- in fact I don't know if she has my number even now. She would be happy to chat superficially if I rang her though, in face she'd act as if we'd just spoken. As an experiment I stopped ringing and so haven't spoken to her properly in about 2 years only when the phone is passed to her to say hello. Weirdly this doesn't feel like a falling out I think she'd be surprised if I said this was weird way for a mother to act. Now I have my children I realise it is very strange and it's caused me to realise the relationship has always been off. I don't know if we ever actually had a proper conversation growing up. I think about the chats I have with my children, and again it seems weird. I'm not sure if it was abusive but I definitely think it's not on the spectrum of healthy relationship! Makes me feel sad when I see other mum's involved with their grown up daughters and grand children that she hasn't spoken or seen to my youngest in about 3 years -our other grandparents get itchy if they haven't seen them in a couple of weeks, which seems like a more normal and nicer reaction.

@Girlmeetsbooks she'd be surprised if I said this was weird way for a mother to act

Do you really think the surprise is real though? Obviously I don’t know your mum and I know a lot of how mothers like mine and yours behave is totally normalised for them. But I also think (at least in my case) there is a whole world around them they can’t ignore. There are examples of “normal” motherhood among their friends and family. You can’t escape it.

I grew up with an emotionally distant, critical, negative etc etc mother so that was normal for me. But I know it’s not normal. Mine either gets very angry and defensive, accuses me of being overly sensitive or plays dumb if I suggest how she behaves is weird. The other day I asked her if she realised how cut off her body language was to me. She flared up and spat that it was all in my head. “Stop making up problems.”

It’s absolutely not in my head. She can barely tolerate sitting next to me and tells me to “stop sitting all over me” if I sit on the opposite end of a four-seater sofa to her. It’s awful. It’s like I make her skin crawl. This woman gave birth to me.

Point is, I’m certain she’s aware it’s weird and has probably been aware to some degree for a long time. She could have taken steps to deal with it. But she hasn’t.

**I grew up with an emotionally distant, critical, negative etc etc mother so that was normal for me. But I know it’s not normal. Mine either gets very angry and defensive, accuses me of being overly sensitive or plays dumb if I suggest how she behaves is weird. The other day I asked her if she realised how cut off her body language was to me. She flared up and spat that it was all in my head. “Stop making up problems.”

It’s absolutely not in my head.**

Same, mine plays victim if I point out her odd/toxic behavior and tells people I’m “so mean” to her. Tells me I’m childish and stupid. Claims she “never said/did that.” Yes, you did.

Victim or one upper, they cannot stand to not be in the spotlight.

Exactly @doskant, we know it’s not normal at a certain point. They do too, otherwise, there wouldn’t be the act in a mask for the benefit of relatives, friends, strangers. You wouldn’t have people not believe you because “she’s sooooo great!” NPD isn’t like BPD, for example, as it is not a chemical imbalance, a misfiring of neurons. They can get better, but it’s the desire to want to change and from there they can get better. They know, absolutely, what they are doing and that it’s wrong.

It doesn’t need to be a cycle either. Like others on this post, my children are loved equally and unconditionally, their desires and personalities allowed to exist as separate from mine.

My relationship with my mother is also dysfunctional. I have never been close to her, but moved back to my home town recently because I felt guilty and worried about her. She is widowed, 82 and has no other family close by, except for my brother who visits her once a year when he wants something. My OH warned me again and again what would happen but I didn't listen. I have been trying my best to help her, which has involved hours of work trying to sort out her finances, going round to help her fix things etc. However, a recent innocuous conversation quickly turned nasty. Lots of old grievances and anger pouring out of her, calling me a liar etc.
I have had enough. I just don't want to see her again and I want to move away. I still feel some guilt and worry, but I can honestly say I have done my best. My sister is the Golden Child and can do no wrong. My daughter is treated with rudeness and borderline nastiness. She actually says my mother is evil. Of course my sister's children can do no wrong.
I have been having counselling which has helped me see how my childhood impacted on me, but it hasn't really helped me understand why my mother is the way she is. I recently read this book which has been very interesting. Not sure if my mother is a full narc, but she certainly has a lot of the characteristics, and many light bulbs went on:
You're Not Crazy It's Your Mother Danu Morrigan.

Another poster mentioned “manipulation, self pity and lies” and that pretty much sums my mother up. She is prone to extreme sentimentality, but not really deep emotion, and I’ve eventually come to the conclusion that she’s incapable of empathy. She likes to be either victim or rescuer, but she can’t cope with relationships on an equal footing. And I know she loves me, but she doesn’t like me. She says I’m cold. It’s very true that I keep her at arm’s length because anything I tell her is immediately transmitted to everyone she knows, because she can’t resist being the holder of information. Our relationship is very difficult and mainly based on obligation and guilt on my part and incomprehension and accusations on hers. I wish it wasn’t like that, but the older I get the more I realise that her issues are very, very deep-rooted and my poor relationship with her is a symptom of that, not the cause.

I could have written this. Exactly the same situation with me. Also everyone else's posts resonate so much. I wish we could all meet up! I sometimes feel like i am going mad. Her version of truth and mine are so far apart. It\s really destabilising. Also the thing of the the act my mother puts on for other people. Even my father , who is now dead. She would play 'nice Granny' when he was in the room with my children, then as soon as he left the bitch from hell would emerge.

OP I understand where you are coming from, but you must not think it is too late to feel happy and content (with or without her support)

Perhaps the hardest journey throughout my life was coming to terms with what you describe, having been raised to idolise my mother I have always thought it was me that was the problem, until I had children of my own and the scales fell from my eyes well and truly.

Then the pain of the realisation that she was highly manipulative, only interested in herself and choosing not to help me during a life threatening illness, which I won't go into, it was just awful at the time. The more the fog lifted so it exposed such a toxic underbelly to my family, and her place within it, I found it unbearable for a while.

The grieving process is really really hard, I won't lie. It was horrendous letting go of my hopes and dreams of what I thought she was versus the cold hard reality, but finally I did make my peace with it, and you will too.

It is a process that you need to work through. You will eventually feel much better than you do now.

I now accept her for what she is, we have a low contact civil relationship that is limited and capped so they can't hurt me anymore. I don't ask them for anything ever, I never expect anything from them. Even in the worst emergency I will never call my mother - because I know she won't help and will drain me by prioritising her feelings.

I no longer for the ache of the loss. I no longer cry because I need a motherly figure. I have established a tight network instead that I turn to if I need to, I have become fiercely independent, and I deal with my own issues. I don't look to them for anything, and so it is left in a good enough place, with very little investment on either side. I am comfortable with this. I am happy with my own children, and raising them and spending time with my own little family has been a life saver for me. Be grateful for everything you have

Everyone seems to expect their mother to be perfect, for them to know how to do this parenting thing. Mothers can have mental health issues too, your crap does not trump their crap just because you are their offspring. Who was supporting her in how to do this parenting thing when you were small?

That is exactly the cycle that creates these issues. Inadequate, abusive parenting creates the next generation of abusers. And so it goes on. I think you can feel sorry for your parent for their childhood that has caused them to have issues but you don't have to forgive them their abuse of you because you are the victim in this situation not them. I don't hate my mother. I pity her but I don't forgive the nasty way she treated me as a child although I have given her plenty of chances to make amends. She chooses not to. There is also a big difference between mental health issues such as psychosis, schizophrenia etc and narcissistic, negligent parents.

There is help for your issues to prevent passing it on to your own children so why don't these mothers access it? As someone mentioned earlier they know what they are doing because they hide it from people. My whole childhood was about keeping family secrets, not letting other people know how promiscuous, negligent and self-absorbed my mother really was as she blithely caused the devastation she did in my family. Denial and secrets and family dysfunction allowed her to continue her behaviour. She enjoys the drama, attention and power.

I am the only one who has called her out on it, hence scapegoat, black sheep and outcast. I have never been happier, freer and the person I was meant to be!

My (late) mum was supportive but though I got on OK with her, she wasn't my ''go-to'' for emotional advice, No particular reason.

I was diagnosed and treated for depression before she died but she was being treated for cancer (eventually died from it) and although that was the ''reason'' for me not telling her (cos I know she'd worry and she had enough on her plate, tbh i don't know I'd have told her if she was fit and healthy. There honestly was no reason why not. I just struggle to tell people when i need help. I hate asking for help. I know it's not good. I'm a nurse, I spend my time helping others but don't like asking for it myself.

And I totally identify with the process you have been through Thegrasscouldbegreener. Letting go of expectations and seeing things as they really are sets you free.

Why do I keep having hope that my relationship with my mother might one day be salvageable :(. Even though I’ve spent my life making attempts that just never worked and we’re never appreciated

@MrsNotNice I think because we are creatures of hope. We see functional relationships and that makes us wish even more we had it.

Eventually, we get to the point we realize it won’t happen. I passed that point a while back, but can’t honestly say that it doesn’t make me sad still. What I focus on then is the healthy and loving relationship I have with my sons. They too see how she is and know it’s nothing they’ve done.

I hope this doesn’t come across as trite, but we cannot control the actions of others, only our own.

I agree with a pp, all the other posts resonate with me. I’m sorry for all of us that have this experience.

Mine seems to keep me hanging on by sending out little golden rays of hope but then let’s me down. I suppose she has to keep me hanging on as it serves some need it her to reject me.