To be saddened people still do these things on holiday?

[lastqueenofscotland]

Had a summer of holidays pictures on social media m which had included a lot of people
Swimming with dolphins
Going to sea world in Orlando
Posing with drugged up tigers for pictures
Riding elephants in Thailand

So on and so forth. In an age where information about the poor treatment of these animals is so well known and freely available AIBU to feel a bit sad about it.
I also want to publicly call them out... but that won’t go well.

@DoctorAllcome

You're absolutely wrong. Have a look around www.cetabase.org and you'll see the following (you can also link through to the source data, consisting of official inventory reports held by the National Marine Fisheries Service):

-- Bob, Dinghy and Jessica, who you claim to be rescues, are nothing of the sort. They are three of the original wild captures made by the Borguss family during the early 80s prior to them setting up Dolphins Plus (the wild captures obliquely referenced in their own FAQ where they dodge the question of rescues). I don't know why you claim they are rescues as the DPMMR website says nothing of the sort.

-- There are 10 cetaceans recorded as rescues at Dolphins Plus, of which only three were dolphins (and they were rough-nosed rather than bottle-nosed, which are much more common for swimming experiences). All three were rescued in October 1987 and released in November 1987.

-- Far from rescuing dolphins and releasing them into the wild (other than the three mentioned above) Dolphins Plus have actually transferred several of their dolphins to other entertainment facilities such as SeaWorld - facilities I assume you were trying to claim DPMMR is different from given your false premise that it housed rescue dolphins. They are very much part of the same industry.

What you actually did was swim with captive, trained dolphins in a small concrete pool filled with seawater, and have spent the last 18 years claiming that you're different from all the other people who swim with captive dolphins.

The owners of the facility do provide a service where they will help with the aid of cetaceans that have been stranded locally, but these creatures aren't brought in for rescue and allowed to swim with humans. There is absolutely no record of this happening.

Your forthcoming apology is humbly accepted.

Apologies - I forgot about Castaway, who is the rescue they mention on their website. Stranded in 2006, died in 2010. Definitely not around in 2001.

Slightly on a tangent but a while back there was a thread where a poster was incensed with rage at people thinking that dolphins were kind, loving animals and labelled them as sexual predators. The videos she posted put me off ever wanting to swim with them

m.youtube.com/watch?v=C6noWoS6QXw

This is interesting, it's about why volunteering abroad is damaging to the communities

.doctorallcome if you do decide you want to swim with dolphins in the wild rather than in a swimming pool I’d recommend South Devon. That’s where I swam with them and where I swim with a seal on a nearly daily basis. We do still have an awful lot of wildlife in this country. No raccoons though sadly

cardamon have you got a link to that thread. There’s a good chance that was my mother - she tells everyone I was raped by a dolphin (I’m pretty sure it just judged me but I had a bloody big bruise). She bloody hates them and whenever there’s a pod in the bay she refuses to look and turns to face the wall instead.

@FFSDH I’m pretty sure it just judged me

I bet it wrote it an absolutely scathing post about you on DolphinsNet as well!

"it just judged me"

Judgemental cetacean bastard. It was BU.

Years ago in Tunisia they had tiger cubs, obviously drugged, for photos my son stood far enough away for the man with the tiger not to be able to hear and if anyone looked interested told them that the animals were drugged and that ir looked like they'd been declawed and if they'd like their fingers amputated just so someone could take photos. He succeeded in making well over three quarters turn away. We could only be there for a short time but I am still proud of him.

My dsis went to Thailand ( fully grown adult)

And stroked tigers but assured me they weren’t drugged. 🤔🙄.

Just popping back to say that in my case there are no tourist visitors, no short term volunteers. The orphanage has a school with qualified teachers, paid for by supporters/ donations. The children get a good education and some do go on to university. There is a work experience/ apprentice scheme in place too and opportunities to learn a variety of skills and get jobs.
The older children maintain links with the orphanage and they are the ones that come back to visit, play sports, support the teaching.
I wish all orphanages were the same, clearly they are not.
I have a friend who was brought up in a Barnardo's home in the UK. He had a good education and he says his childhood was happy. He was mixed race, like the children in "my orphanage", like my own children in fact. Nobody wanted to adopt him because of that. He is now in his 70s. He has a degree and had a professional career. I know some childrens homes were terrible, but not all. It takes time for things to change.

"Just popping back to say that in my case there are no tourist visitors, no short term volunteers"

So why comment? because that's not the kind of place we're talking about, is it?

@FFSDH I'll have a look. The thread was very long and IIRC the OP claimed that a family member had been sexually assaulted by a dolphin so it might have been your DM.

It is also important to consider how your actions fit into the wider picture. Say for example, @drallcome your dolphin rescue place is truly ethical and the dolphins are only there because they want to be. If someone goes there and posts a photo on social media, it makes others want to do it. Small scale I know, but it fuels the market for this type of thing which increases the amount of places that allow swimming with dolphins unethically. Because the market is there, there is money to be made and let’s face it lots of people just don’t give a shite if it’s cruel as long as they get a good photo. Maybe the person that sees your photo doesn’t have the money to donate to a rescue centre and be invited there, so instead they go somewhere cheaper where the dolphins are treated awfully. It is easier and just better all round if these animals are left alone for the most part. And if you are lucky enough to encounter them in the wild, amazing.

@ItsGoingTibiaK

Bob, Dinghy and Jessica, who you claim to be rescues, are nothing of the sort. They are three of the original wild captures made by the Borguss family during the early 80s prior to them setting up Dolphins Plus (the wild captures obliquely referenced in their own FAQ where they dodge the question of rescues). I don't know why you claim they are rescues as the DPMMR website says nothing of the sort.

Quite

Far from rescuing dolphins and releasing them into the wild (other than the three mentioned above) Dolphins Plus have actually transferred several of their dolphins to other entertainment facilities such as SeaWorld - facilities I assume you were trying to claim DPMMR is different from given your false premise that it housed rescue dolphins. They are very much part of the same industry.

And a vile industry it is.

What you actually did was swim with captive, trained dolphins in a small concrete pool filled with seawater, and have spent the last 18 years claiming that you're different from all the other people who swim with captive dolphins.

Your forthcoming apology is humbly accepted.

I think you will be waiting a long time!!! It's absolutely clear from her numerous posts and failure to engage that @DoctorAllcome is like that famous quote about a politician whose name escapes me - [she] behaved like an ostrich and put his head in the sand, thereby exposing his thinking parts.

@drallcome
I’m actually embarrassed for you at how delusional you are.
No dolphin taps someone to see if they want a ride!
Ffs

endoftheline sorry for being snippy, I do agree with others what you're talking about isn't at all the same situation as visiting an orphanage for a photo op. Obviously someone having close links with somewhere like an orphanage and offering ongoing support is a good thing and their skin colour or background is totally irrelevant. It's the transitory nature of "voluntourism" which makes it so problematic and open to abuse.

I can see that some orphanages like the one you've worked with are doing good work supporting children in unimaginably terrible situations, but this is not the norm worldwide as far as I understand it and in many places the orphanages are actually a form of human trafficking themselves.

Rescuing 1 dolphin and breeding countless others in captivity, after initially taking them from the wild does not make any organisation a conservation organisation. Their sole focus is not to rescue and rehabilitate if they are breeding them they cannot release them, ever.

I went to seaworld years ago. I felt so uncomfortable with it, & my 5 year old felt sad. My DP wanted to go to Gatorland in Orlando & we did not go as I have seen photos of them with the gators with their mouth taped shut while a visitor sat on them for a photograph, & videos where it looked liked their handlers were teasing them to get a reaction out of them for shows.

Disney also has dolphins at Epcot, obviously, they don't need them to gain visitors & make money as many people don't even know they have them.

I think that this post has shown why people still go to these places because people like @@DoctorAllcome genuinely believe that the place they visit are doing good things and that the animals enjoy it. I mean it’s lovely to think that an untrained dolphin rescued from danger would ask a child if they want a ride but a few moments of thought would tell you that this isn’t natural behaviour from a wild animal.

I wonder how many of posters here crying their outrage have dogs dressed with coats they hate, given food they don't like much, are petted when they want to be left alone, and just would pick to have different owners if given the chance!

Howamy cats would prefer to live in the wild but are held captive in flats? Where does the animal abuse start and stops?

swing
Are you deliberately trying to draw comparisons about a certain type of tourism and the fact that some people have domesticated pets?

What next: I wonder how many people who are crying in outrage about unqualified people playing pass the orphan have children and give their 2 year old vegetables they may not like, or make then wear a coat they don't like, or might like different parents?
How many toddlers would prefer not to wear any clothes and run around all the time, but are captive to their parents' wishes? Where does child abuse start and stop?

I was about to say the same to be honest. Why do humans get to choose which animals it’s ok to keep in captivity and which ones we can’t?
But it’s ok because the dogs look happy, just like the dolphins do.
I hope all of those that are completely outraged by animals in captivity don’t have any pets at home.

Personally I won't ever keep a pet that needs to be kept in a cage or otherwise confined, and nor will I have a cat that's kept indoors.

The only time I've swum with a dolphin was purely by accident, while swimming off a boat in central America. It joined us, and swam close enough for me to touch it (though I knew better than to do so). Even that one wild encounter demonstrated how incredibly cruel it is to keep a creature with such a vast range, in confinement.

I have a dog I adopted as an adult and did not buy. It costs me money to care for him. I benefit from companionship

As an owner I have obligations to meet his needs the best way I know how through his choices where appropriate. He’s a dog. He would literally eat anything and could harm himself through doing so. I also wouldn’t breed him

But I am not claiming I run a dog sanctuary, am a conservationist, I don’t charge people to come and watch him do tricks. He also isn’t penned in a cage for most of his life