To think most parents don't know that rearfacing DCs is safer?

[mumaw]

I'm in Facebook groups that specialise in advice for mainly extended rear facing car seats. It's proven that rear facing your child is much, much safer (in fact 500% safer) than front facing.

But I never see anybody RF'ing their child and don't know anybody that does either.

Is it just a case of parents not knowing that its safer?

Dd is 15 months and absolutely hates the car. She screams and screams and screams. Journeys of more than 5 minutes are torture. We have a mirror and have removed the head rest of her seat. I can't sit in the back with her because of ds's car seat (not willing to put him in the front) and I get car sick if I keep turning around (assuming someone else is driving). I want her to rear face at least as long as her brother did but it's hellish for all of us.

Singing, toys (which aren't great either in the car...we were repeatedly told at ante-natal classes not to have anything unsecured in the body of the car in case of accidents) and snacks make zero difference.

I can completely understand why people move their kids to forward facing. Ds was a totally different child. He'd sleep in the car, singing would work every time but dd hates it and is making everyone else hate it too.

I didn’t do extended rear facing because my daughter spends very little time in the car and the car seats are much more expensive. Often a week will go by during which she hasn’t been in the car at all. If I was regularly driving a commute with her in the car, I would have spent that money.

there was literally no way for me to know that was there?

No, there wasn’t. Which is precisely why you shouldn’t make personal comments when you have no flipping clue about a) me and my parenting, and b) whether I was even speaking to you in the first place. Good life lesson, no?

To think most parents don't know that rearfacing DCs is safer?

Adding nothing to this thread except a bit of levity, I read the title as 'resurfacing the DCs is safer'. I scratched my head for a good few seconds wondering what you resurface, how and what with.

@Wonkybanana 😂

My 3 year old is comfortably rear facing but she is tall and heavy and will be out of the height and weight limits soon (well before 4 when I was hoping). I wish I’d originally got a seat that went to 25kg as I now have a bit of a dilemma as to whether to spend 7-800 (we’d need 2 to manage nursery) or just go straight to high back boosters. We’ve probably gone longer rear facing than most in the UK but I would have liked to have gone to 4.

I agree that some of the Facebook groups are a bit militant and potentially are quite offputting to people. However, I can see that they are quite mission driven and probably have made a difference in raising awareness.

I have a joie 360 spin which can rear face until 4. My ds is 2, and forward faces as otherwise, if he’s rear facing, he screams, pulls his arms out of the straps (even when they’re secured as tightly as possible), kicks and gags, throws himself around. I just can’t concentrate on driving, which in itself is dangerous. So he forward faces.

I know rear facing is safer, so if anyone has any ideas or tips to helps with rear facing I would greatly appreciate it.

I don't need life lessons from strangers on the internet thanks impatience

My 3 y.o. is still rear facing. He goes FF occasionally in a relative's car, but always RF in ours and, luckily, he is happy either way. Must be a different kettle of fish if child is not happy about it or gets travel sick!

We have an ERF seat up until 25kg, but I expect we'll turn him around before he reaches that weight. However it's nice to have the option to keep him rear facing as long as possible.

What other people do with their children is none of my business, and I would never offer unsolicited advice... but the amount of ignorance about car seat safety for children in general is quite staggering!

I'd highly recommend the In-Car Safety Centre to anyone who wants advice on the best seat to get to fit your child, car, and circumstances!

I am going to FF when DS turns one as I did with my older DC. He already hates being RF at ten months, he screams and thinks we have disappeared.

DD will rear face until 4 in her current car seat.

I needed to buy a spare seat to use in other people's cars and bought another ERF at a cost of £99 (joie Stages). I don't think £99 is a lot of money for a good car seat.

My only regret with our main seat is that I didn't buy an ERF to 6 years and if I could rewind, I would.

Our two main groups of mum/baby friends all have bought ERF to 4 years (if they own a car). I have some other friends with slightly older children (just a year or two older) who didn't rear face after the infant car seat and are perplexed at me doing so with DD and barely disguise their eye rolls...

I think there's a shift going on but it is happening very slowly.

I also wonder whether there's an element of parents of babies who dislike their infant carrier assuming that the fact that infant carriers are rear-facing is the issue when in fact the child might be ok moving to a Group 1 rear facing seat as the position is different and slightly more upright with a higher position in the car so less claustrophobic.

I think it would definitely help if there was more awareness. If you are aware of all the information and make an informed choice then great. I think the issue (as with many things) is that some people are making a decision without all the facts and they might make a different decision if in possession of more information.

I was on a FB parenting group the other day and someone posted a picture of their young baby in a new car seat. Their toddler was also rear facing. Someone commented and asked why the toddler was still rear facing so it's fairly clear there are people who aren't aware yet. A few people made pleasant comments and directed the mum to places where she could find out more, the mum was grateful and it wasn't preachy at all.

My DS is 3 and still rear facing. I'm weighing up a 25kg ref seat for him to move into when he outgrows this seat but I might decide to go FF at that point, it will depend on lots of factors.

I actually don't see how its safer. Surely if hit in an accident, the seat would wobble as not as well secured rear facing and could squash the child into the back seat?

It's becoming law to rear face until 2 years in lots of places.

Never mind kids, I ruddy sit rear facing if given a chance.

These threads make me laugh. Younger a shit load of people forking a grand out on a pram but when it comes to car seats they don't have a clue, don't want to spend the money and treat it like some sort of milestone turning them around. Boggles the head.

*you have

instatwat why because I don't ERF my child?

I RF until 4, and noticed that past 1, it was very, very rare to see another RF child!

I moved my DD to a FF seat when she was 16 months. I must be a boring person so I have actually done some research on safety stats for RF and FF seats and have found interesting results:

1. The catchy phrase (RF seats are 5 times safer) has never been 100% accurate to start with. It should have also included a clarification "for children younger than 2 years". I have not been able to find reliable stats for older toddlers and pre-schoolers.

injuryprevention.bmj.com/content/13/6/398

1. Interestingly, the initial 2007 research that appeared to have revealed the 500% difference in safety stats was retraced in 2017. The retraction notice stated:

"A subset of that authorship group attempted to replicate the analysis reported in the original published manuscript but were unable to do so. Specifically, they believe that survey weights were improperly handled in the initial analysis, which caused the apparent sample size to be larger than the actual sample size. This resulted in estimates of effect size that appeared to be statistically significant but were not.

It is important to stress - per the authors - there is no evidence that current recommendations are harmful. However, these field data alone are inadequate to statistically support the safety benefit of rear facing seats. Indeed, given the relatively small number of injured passengers in the age range of interest, it is unsurprising that the estimates have wide confidence intervals. Decades of experience might be required to prove a benefit in rear facing position using this data set alone."

injuryprevention.bmj.com/content/24/1/e2

In summary, while there is still some (primarily practical) evidence that RF seats are indeed safer, the difference in outcomes may not be as significant as we are made to think.

We intended to keep our youngest RFing till she was 4 or so, but she had other ideas. No matter what we tried she would scream till she was sick. As soon as we turned her around she was happy.

I think having two older siblings who sat facing forwards didn't help the situation, to be honest.

The risk we weighed was crashing because of a screaming, ill baby vs the minuscule chance we'd have the kind of accident that RFing protects from.

And yes, she was of course rear-facing in the car from the time she was a tiny baby, but children grow up and do not do what you expect them to do. You'll find this out yourself sometime soon.

As soon as my daughter was old enough I changed to forward facing. Every car journey was traumatic for everyone involved as she hated rearfacing and would scream until she was blue in the face. It was absolutely not safe for me to drive in that situation, I weighed it up and it’s much safer for us this way.

I think parents in general know this, but weigh up other factors and decide to take the risk. As we do every day when we step into a car.

mumaw I think these threads are worth having, despite the fact that so many people pop up on them to come up with the usual variations on "gets sick"/"screams and surely distractions for the driver are even more dangerous"/"is Houdini"/"I drive so carefully we're never going to be in a crash". (I would hazard a guess that when compulsory child seats were first brought in, exactly the same arguments got trotted out even for FF seats.)

They are still worth doing as threads though, because there will be lurkers on here who read this, watch the video, read Princess' incredibly sad post, and think "I'd never thought about this before, but you know what, I'm going to buy a RF seat for my toddler." And the more public awareness it garners, the more likely politicians are to take notice and change the law.

I'm old enough to remember seat belts being made compulsory for adults. People kicked off about that - "uncomfortable"/"personal choice"/"nanny state"/"I drive carefully" - lists that closely parallel the ones here. That law change still saved enormous numbers of lives.

My only regret with our main seat is that I didn't buy an ERF to 6 years and if I could rewind, I would.

Me too, but like another poster upthread, I didn't know enough when I bought mine (DD1 is 7). We had the original Britax dualfix and, while it said up to 18kg, they really were very squashed by the end. Both of them were in it until well north of 5 years old though as I have small children. Both of mine get car sick, and I was endlessly advised to turn them for that reason, but I STILL get car sick, even as a passenger in the front, so didn't. They're both now FF (they're about 22kgs and 24kgs), and they still get car sick.

With both of them it got tricky when they went in friends cars, or others came in ours, as even in YR, they (and their friends) were asking why they were RF when no-one else was. I simply said (as I do about lots of things) "That's the way it works in our family."