To think most parents don't know that rearfacing DCs is safer?

[mumaw]

I'm in Facebook groups that specialise in advice for mainly extended rear facing car seats. It's proven that rear facing your child is much, much safer (in fact 500% safer) than front facing.

But I never see anybody RF'ing their child and don't know anybody that does either.

Is it just a case of parents not knowing that its safer?

@mumaw

It's a shame you haven't come back to offer solutions as you said you could sort out any "excuse" that someone put forward as to why they didn't use an RF seat.

So, because people are bad drivers the safety of car seats is irrelevant?

no, the point is that people ALSO need to improve their terrible driving because that would have an impact on how likely they are to have a crash, and how safe their child is in the car. Probably more impact than being RF.

what im trying to say is that RF might be 500% more safe in the event of a crash (using quotes from others here I don't know what the actual % is)

but if you're an awful driver then your chances of being in a crash might be 1 in 100 rather than 1 in 1000 for safer drivers (again made up stats but you see what im saying)

so whilst the seat is safer, youre still putting your child at more risk iyswim.

Rear facing is safer. That's a fact. If you've considered that in your own personal circumstances it's better for you to FF that's fine but it doesn't make FF safer.

It's like safe sleeping. Baby should sleep on their back, with their feet at the base of an empty cot with no loose blankets. I use a sleepyhead for DS because he won't settle without it. I've decided the increased risk (and I 100% accept I am increasing risk) is worth it for us. It's the same with car seats. For some the increased risk is worth it but it is still an increased risk.

Awareness has to be a good thing. As this thread shows, the "where do their legs go" issue is still really prevalent. That is a non issue for 99% of children under 4. If the only reason a parent didn't rear face was concern about their child's legs then it may help them to risk assess effectively if they're aware that their child's legs will be fine.

sunshine if that was aimed at me I haven't said that FF is safer?

Im saying that RF your child doesn't negate the risk that your bad driving (as seen this morning!) will cause.

I don't disagree that improving people's driving would be beneficial across the board. That is a separate issue to car seat safety.

In any event, you can be the safest driver in the world but it doesn't stop someone loosing it and smashing into you whilst you're stationary at traffic lights or any other number of things. A car seat is like car insurance, you only need it when the worst happens but it's essential if you're the unlucky one.

sunshine yeah I don't think you're getting my point so i'll leave it there.

Of course I get your point, I just don't think it's a very good one.

no, you don't because you keep throwing irrelevant what ifs at me!

I know that yes, someone could crash into you whilst stationary.

what I am saying is those drivers who are holier than thou preaching about their RF 4yo, are SOMETIMES The ones that drive like absolute wankers, and those people need to realise that their fancy car seat DOES NOT negate their awful driving.

I haven't said FF is safer, I haven't said we shouldn't RF, I haven't dismissed the fact that anyone could be in an accident, I was making a specific point which you entirely took the wrong way!

So you have specifically experienced someone preach to you that their 4yo is rear facing and that this makes them a superior parent and then watched them get in their car and drive dangerously?

I am willing to accept that people who rear face are as likely to be bad drivers as those who forward face but where does the preaching come in?

If what you're saying is it's annoying that people preach to you about RF then I'd agree with you regardless of their driving. Information and awareness is not the same as preaching in my view and I am in favour of the former not the latter.

oh ffs sunshine its pretty clear from this thread that people are preachy about RF.

I have noticed some parents at nursery who have RF kids (and im not nosy but its easy to see someone trying to put a kicking and screaming 3-4yo in a RF seat!) and then arse it out the car park and speed off.

What im saying is that RF doesn't negate awful driving. You keep ignoring that bit for some reason?

I'm not ignoring it, of course it doesn't. If you are a bad driver and drive recklessly a rear facing (or "fancy") seat will not negate that.

What we're talking about though is increasing awareness that generally rear facing is safer as I still believe lots of people are unaware and are given bad advice by high street retailers. I think it would be great if we could improve driving standards as well. Increased seat safety combined with fewer crashes in the first place would obviously be brilliant.

It's pretty clear that you think people who rear face think they are superior. Some probably do but lots don't.

Is RF supposed to negate bad driving?

It's pretty clear that you think people who rear face think they are superior. Some probably do but lots don't

no, I think some people who RF think they're superior, i'd say this thread illustrates that...

Yes, there probably does need to be more awareness, however it needs to be carefully thought out because people don't react well to being educated against their will, or made to feel stupid or negligent which is the approach some people take when talking about RF.

I also think that we don't need to call measured decisions re childs safety (ie sick / screaming kids) "excuses" or claim to have the answer, because that just gets peoples backs up and if anything will make them do the opposite.

My eldest rear faced until almost 3 but my youngest forward faces now aged 16 months and bang on 9kg. I'd only ever been able to travel 10 minutes in the car since she was born as she screams and screams and screams and screams etc. Then at 14 months she figured out how to get her arms through the straps, which I watched unfold in horror through the mirror. So now she forward faces and I feel absolutely no guilt for it because I can drive 30 minutes now before she gets inconsolable again.

I was always surprised by how many "forward-thinking" parents weren't aware of the statistics around rear facing safety though.

The two main objections family and friends made when they saw my son still rear facing at five were:

1. Aren't his legs uncomfortable? Won't they break in a crash?

No, he's really happy this way and I'd rather broken legs than a broken neck.

1. You're infantilising him.

No, I'm choosing something that works for us that I believe is safer. AFAIK every passenger would be safer facing backwards, even adults.

I have absolutely no problem with someone choosing FF having weighed up the options and risks because that's what works for them. I definitely do have a problem with someone choosing FF for their child because of misguided concerns about leg comfort (NB I'm not including children who have unusually long legs) or because they believe FF at the earliest legal opportunity is a milestone.

We stopped rearfacing at 9 months for both. Reason: extreme travel sickness, leading to vomiting and inhaling vomit, so overnight hospitalisation etc. there are some very good reasons to not rearface !

Yes some people are bad drivers. Surely better if their DC are in safer seats then?

katharina well yes, but it would make a bigger impact on safety over all if they were better drivers, its not just their own children they're putting at risk, its every other road user and pedestrian in their vicinity!

😂I think some people are missing the point. Risk is not just about the seat but some people are dumb enough to think they are doing a better job on safety because they are in line with the best practice on just the seat.

I really don't get this viewpoint. Just because there are other things someone could also be doing to improve road safety doesn't mean they shouldn't do the best they can for their situation regarding car seats.

ferris yeah because that's not what we're saying....

My 5.5 year old has just gone into a HBB after RF in an 18kg seat until she recently outgrew it by height (not weight). My only regret is that I didn’t have a 25kg seat for her as it would have meant she could read face a bit longer but I didn’t know as much when I bought it. Her younger sister is on a higher centile line and will go into an ERF to 25kg seat when she outgrows her infant carrier.

Yes the most important thing is that a car seat is used but I prefer not to take the risk when it’s easy not to. I don’t lecture about it but I did get a lot of questions about why she wasn’t forward facing.

@stucknoue
MY POINT EXACTLY! I'll need a car seat that could possibly fit any car because we use taxi's and coaches, have to pick a seat that's universal or I'm stuck without a car seat for my son!

@grisen but there are loads of car seats that do both RF and FF so that you can rear face wherever possible and FF when that isn't possible.

Joie Tilt and Joie Stages are 2 good examples.