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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that sacking the Chancellor's media adviser is illegal (just one more reason to despise this Government)

127 replies

Livingtothefull · 31/08/2019 09:30

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/sajid-javid-dominic-cummings-fires-special-adviser-johnson-brexit-sonia-khan-a9085056.html

I am a line manager and mere mortals like us have to handle a dismissal in an appropriate way:
Invite the individual to a meeting in line with company policy;
Let them know beforehand that dismissal is a possible outcome (though never a foregone conclusion);
Allow them a companion to the meeting;
Let the individual have his/her say and consider this before reaching decision;
If we dismiss, explain the grounds for the dismissal (conduct, capability or whatever);
Allow them the right to appeal the dismissal.

It looks as though none of this was done here; apparently the Government is arrogant and high handed enough to think the law and good practice don't apply to them only the rest of us.

If she has more than 2 years service she has a lot of rights, and may choose to take this to an employment tribunal; in which case she will probably win. And guess whose money will have to be used to compensate her?

OP posts:
PerkingFaintly · 31/08/2019 18:38

wigornian, I agree wholeheartedly that it's ridiculous to talk about Tories in general that way. (I clearly missed it being a trope. Lucky me.)

With the current government, though... Well I think a lot of people who have enthusiastically supported it, from all sorts of backgrounds, may realise too late that the enthusiasm is not mutual.

Alsohuman · 31/08/2019 18:39

In that case, don’t call people names you don’t understand the meaning of unless you’re prepared to put your money where your mouth is.

ajandjjmum · 31/08/2019 18:40

She lied, proving herself untrustworthy and probably disloyal.

Alsohuman · 31/08/2019 18:43

What did she lie about?

AnneElliott · 31/08/2019 18:43

It's normal to be escorted out if your security clearance is revoked - I've seen it a few times in my Department.

At our place it would be security rather than the police as we don't routinely have police on site.

And Spads have a different contract to 'normal' civil servants. They can be dismissed for any number of reasons; falling out with their Minister or another Spad who's higher up. Or their Minister getting sacked/resigning.

Normal civil servants can't be dismissed like that, although if you work in private office (for a Minister) then you may well be moved if s new one comes in. But you will still have a job - just in snort section.

AnneElliott · 31/08/2019 18:44

Different section! Not snort!

TheBigBallOfOil · 31/08/2019 18:46

She won’t leak government secrets, but I imagine there’s plenty of other stuff she can leak relating to the conduct of mr Cummings ... I bet she’ll be in receipt of a pretty big cheque quite soon.
Boris needs to ask himself whether an advisor who makes himself the story like this is as valuable as he believes himself to be.

Hirsutefirs · 31/08/2019 18:47

Yes Alsohuman. Carry on telling people on the internet to do things. It will be a big success.

“Proving” to you that you are showing partisanship in this sacking matter might not be all that useful.

Alsohuman · 31/08/2019 18:49

Completely agree @TheBigBallOfOil. It didn’t take long for Cummings to become a liability.

TheBigBallOfOil · 31/08/2019 18:51

Maybe I should go and work there. The payoff would come in handy right now.
Gizza job, badly weirdy twat features

TheBigBallOfOil · 31/08/2019 18:52

Badly? Baldy, obvs.
He really is a wile looking little specimen

Hirsutefirs · 31/08/2019 18:56

Wonder what she’ll do for a job now.

Alsohuman · 31/08/2019 18:58

He looks like Gollum to me.

Xenia · 31/08/2019 20:43

The Tories are doing pretty welll and this thread does not reflect the view of them in the wider country.

Alsohuman · 31/08/2019 20:46

Why should this thread reflect that @Xenia? Third time of asking, why do you think Khan is guilty of gross misconduct?

chomalungma · 31/08/2019 20:50

The Tories are doing pretty welll and this thread does not reflect the view of them in the wider country

Country is pretty split.

They're doing ok. As are other parties.

longwayoff · 31/08/2019 20:53

SPADs aren't technically employees of whoever they're working for. Hope she sues the bastard for destroying her character though. Cummings is due a large dose of karma. Hubris today, nemesis soon to follow. Despicable toad.

ajandjjmum · 31/08/2019 20:58

Alsohuman
She lied because she said she hadn't been in touch with a particular person for over a week, when infact she'd been in contact with them on the day she was sacked. And she'd deleted a Whatsapp thread with them on her private phone.

Alsohuman · 31/08/2019 21:11

If lying was a reason to dismiss someone for gross misconduct, the House of Commons would be empty.

Xenia · 31/08/2019 21:15

Newspapers are sayign " Miss Khan was presented with a list of names and denied she had spoken with any of them recently. Mr Cummings demanded she hand over her work and personal phones and went through them. He is said to have discovered she had spoken that day with a close aide to Mr Hammond and had deleted a string of WhatsApp messages to the same person.

She was fired, ordered to surrender her Whitehall security pass and ‘frogmarched’ from No10 by a police officer.

....
A Cummings ally defended the decision, saying: ‘In the end, she lied to one of the most senior advisers in Number 10 – that would be a sacking offence in any government.

‘Dom has two rules. He doesn’t care who you are or what your background is. He just cares that you are good at your job and he can trust you.’

Alsohuman · 31/08/2019 21:20

A Cummings ally. OK, must be true then.

PerkingFaintly · 31/08/2019 21:41

None of which answers the employment question. Even if correct procedures would have resulted in Khan being sacked, that doesn't necessarily mean Dominic Cummings was in a position to do the sacking.

If he failed to follow procedures – no matter how much he hates them – then she might have a case.

I mean, Sajid Javid is an actual government minister. Does he get to call Cummings into his office and, if Cummings breaches some rule (which he might well do), sack Cummings on the spot and march him out? Even though Cummings doesn't work in his department?

Alsohuman · 31/08/2019 22:00

We can only hope @PekingFaintly. Apparently Javid was incandescent with rage, bollocked Johnson and Cummings and Johnson apologised.

Hirsutefirs · 31/08/2019 22:23

“If lying was a reason to dismiss someone for gross misconduct, the House of Commons would be empty.”

You can’t dismiss MPs, silly! They’ve been voted in.

PerkingFaintly · 31/08/2019 22:26

So the Prime Minister apologised to Javid, but his unelected staff member who'd taken it upon himself to fire Khan, did not?

Yeah.

We're gonna see a lot of that.