To think pay in care homes is scandalous

[Clappingforjoy]

I've worked in then and got out of it. Understaffed rushed off your feet. Rude management and simply unable to give the elderly the care they deserve.

Care Homes are closing due to lack of profits. They aren't cash cows for their owners. Fees seem high to me so I don't know why this is. Perhaps council funded residents are under funded.

@alsohuman that’s touching, sorry to hear about your dad

@R44me council residents are hugely underfunded. The fees barely cover the cost of care, and inevitably as the population age, live longer and with chronic and complex conditions, the cost of care is often underestimated.

Many ‘mom and pop’ care homes are also being effectively forced out of business by the regulator, the CQC. Whilst the CQC are there to ultimately protect the service users, and drive up quality standards, they have become hugely more militant over the past few years (driven by their own past failings). Whilst larger groups can potentially afford to employ a Head of Governance or similar to manage the CQC and be progressive with quality standards, it is often the case that smaller operators cannot.

An Inadequate CQC report can often lead to admission embargos and then it is a fast route to failure without the funds to put it right.

I have spoken to many operators who are simply closing or selling up to the corporates because they feel they have no choice.

I have worked within the care sector for nearly 9 years now. I absolutely love my job but it is a thankless role, underpaid and understaffed.
I no longer work with the elderly though, I gave that up 7 years ago as I found working in the elderly care sector not only back breaking but also underfunded, staff rushed off their feet and not enough time to spend with the residents (it was like a conveyor belt style of care).
I now work with special needs, mental health, disabilities, complex needs and challenging behaviours. It is not perfect either but has slightly more funding, more smaller residential homes and better one to one care. It still has a high turn over though but not as high as elderly residential care.
I don't think I could ever go back to elderly care again and it is also true what another poster stated, that the care home owners tended to flit in and out of the care homes (rarely seeing how it was run with their own eyes) whilst driving very nice and expensive cars.

Yes the pay is awful. I used to run a group of care homes for a charity. We never ever broke even let alone had enough to refurbish or turn a profit. We had to sell them in the end. The thought that anyone except at the extreme high end is making greedy profits is ludicrous - care homes are closing all the time and many large groups are teetering on collapse.

The real problem is that if you take local Authority funded residents they do not pay the full costs of the care provided so the private residents are subsiding them. And the reason for that is that local authority funding has been cut by millions since 2010 - and 300,000 fewer people have received council funded care since then. The answer will be for all of us to pay more taxes to fund social care. The only ones who are making any kind of money are the highest end - and frankly you get what you pay for. I know a lot of owners and they are hugely dedicated and committed. One of the best groups was founded by an ad executive who couldn't find a home he was happy to put his mother in so he invested his own money in setting up his own group - the quality is world class.

It is a rightly highly regulated service, there are huge administrative and training requirements, full time accommodation, food and medication costs, utilities, laundry, entertainment and staff. Anyone who is in the care home business is a blooming hero. That applies to all the staff including managers and owners.

Those who moan about having to subsidise those who haven't built up funds for their old age - how do you think hard working carers build savings? Do you resent funding their care?

Such a good point @countrygirl99

Wholeheartedly agree. I've worked in the same care home since I was eighteen, I'm almost twenty-five and I'm still there. As much as I'd love more money and wish the pay reflected the agonisingly hard work it is I adore my job and my residents, but I do think they'll come a point where I just can't afford to stay anymore and it's a crying shame.

Do you resent funding their care? Yes I resent funding their care when it's not spread across everyone who could afford it, but only across those unlucky enough to need care themselves. It's equivalent to saying "diabetics will get free medical care if they haven't any money of their own, and it'll be funded in part by charging an extra 40% to all those diabetics paying for their own care".

Looking on it from rental pov... Heat and bills are easily covered by the high fees... Per resident food often rubbish.. Staff paid pittance....

I work in a care home during the university holidays...i love it. The irony is that many are leaving care work due to poor pay so they are having to hire agency staff at a higher rate of pay. This is all part of privatisation i rekon.

@malificent7, nearly every care home in the country is private.

Just diving into end of this thread. I live in v expensive area and worked in eye watering expensive carehome years ago. It looked like national trust aristocrat home.

The standards where shockingly low and even small things that most homes would struggle with eg relative comes, brings resident fav cheese.. Worker puts it in fridge... But that worker isn't back in for 5 days and no one gives resident cheese...happen.

Unless I was using one as hotel there is no way I would want to be in one. Small flats with options for food etc are good.

But we need too open discussions about how long we want to live for if we are that vulnerable. Unless you've worked in a few it's hard to describe just how vulnerable residents are in so many ways. And one person may be amazing but you have indifferent or Vile people on other days.
I'd like legal mechanisms to say now for me... What stages I get too before I give permission for someone to bump me off.
. I've had 2 grandparent with dementia and dh granny..

Why we watch our elderly go through this... Why!! It's so cruel.

So I think opening up legal framework for people who know like me to say... Don't keep me going after x point would help ease the pressure. Also we need to educate people about what goes on so they can make these descion for themselves as it's often too late.

I've been with ex directors and ceo... Talked to like 2 year old by busy staff..
Ignored, lonely...

Re the eu staff I heard interesting radio 4 interview about 2 years ago? Romanian lady was saying how hard it was when deaf, elderly people couldn't understand her and other people saying how dreadfully isolating it is, when understanding and hearing is dimished and people can't understand you because their English is poor.

I know from my time in homes and even with df whose hearing went how difficult it was to communicate.
It can be hard enough for healthy young people trying to speak in diff language let alone with deaf mild /advanced dementia.

I'd very much resent paying for any care when standard of care is so random and low.

These people are so vulnerable. So very vulnerable and they often can't say what's happening to them, they are afraid and stuck. They often don't get proper food, Care, so yes I'd begrudge that

I worked in a care home when I was in uni, and it was horrific. The only time I have ever been 'spoken to' in my career; I got pulled up by the manager for 'taking too long to get the residents ready'. What she meant was she was used to people having a splash of water thrown over them as a 'bed bath', and people not being given any choice in what they wear etc. I would happily help people have a real bath or shower - which does take longer, ensure they are fully dry, shave the men who asked, and help them choose the top they wanted to wear. It did take longer - but where did she think they were rushing off to on a time crunch?!

I treat my patients as I would want myself or my parents to be treated. It was awful.

Employers rely on the benefit system to top up low pay. The whole system is broken.

We need to pay a proper price for all of the minimum wage services we access.

Hi there, I stumbled across this feed and it so hit a nerve with me.

If I can bore you with a story, please read on. I'm not a mum, I'm a dad, ex-military dad and when my time in the Army was up, I had lived out of the UK more than in it.

A friend suggested to me me that I start a new life working with Autistic personnel, I'll freely admit, I had never even heard the term before, however, long story really short I've spent the last 6 years gaining a little insight into how these individuals see and sort the world around them. It's not been easy, but hell it's been rewarding.

I decided a few months into working in the private sector that me and my [selected] co-workers could have a much greater impact on the lives and well-being of those people we assist in getting through the day and having a laugh on the way.

Anyhoo, as a support worker [Not my choice of classification] earning £8.16p an hour I decided to setup my own facility for those who needed residential care / facilities.

The process took nearly 2 years to complete, the relevant local authorities and Welsh assembly were rightly demanding in attention to detail and qualifications, so with planning permission completed, building regulations signed-off and registration with all entities completed I was [am] the proud owner of a facility in the heart of a district of town just 10 minutes walk away from all local facilities.

I forgot to mention that at the planning stage I was hit upon by the local community council who had raised a petition to stop me from building this much-needed facility; one of their objections was "a concern at the level of autism in the area" another was "the proximity to the local school".

Now I have seen a few threads where the costs are considered excessive, and at the outset, I too believed this, however, consider this, to staff this facility for 24 hours / 7 days a week adds up to 168 hours, just to pay min wage wage that comes to £1461.60, factor in other costs, insurances, heating taxes and so on there's not much left out of £2000 per week. Expensive, hell yeah ! But at what cost to us as tax-payers if we continue to use the NHS as a residential service, I estimate our cost is approximately 3 times more, unless occupational therapists, nurses and doctors are paid at £8.16 an hour.

But on a more positive note, I totally appreciate the insight(s) from parents, especially the underlining theme that is "our kids are individuals", no time and circumstance can be duplicated, I've been on far too many training sessions where the nonsense spewed out by the "professionals" has galled me to say the least.

I just wanted to make a change, give a leg-up to those at times needed it [ that would be all of of us on occasion ] create a facility where parents could drop-in, not drive-by, where qualified local lads and lasses could get on with doing what they do best, not fearing intrusion from the office / corporate monkeys wholly interested in getting the latest Jaguar with personalised plates.

I've now lost this facility to the bankers and wankers of the world, never even had a person come through the door, fully certified and good to go. This message was only meant as a positive, for those families and individuals who need our help, I tried, process, politics and procedures beat me and my guy's, but I won't give up, there are personnel out there who actually care about doing the right thing, but it's a struggle for the one's who do.

Thanks for reading, I hope you got something out of it.

Jim

Why are people complaining about adult social and residential care being so terrible?

We all vote for govts that promise tax cuts and a smaller state - you simply cannot have good public services and low taxes, it's simple economics.

The turn over of EU staff makes the present scandalous situation even worse and we voted for that too.

Stop moaning, YABU

Just had a look at care home jobs near me. I get paid more working in a supermarket!! Easy job, great benefits, bonus, discount etc.... No chance would I give it up to work for under 9 quid an hour.
Childcare is the same unfortunately

@jasjas1973, care homes are all privately owned. Local authorities sold theirs off decades ago.

yup, and to make it worse the management will cut corners by chronically understaffing units.

@Alsohuman, I had read the thread upto about ten posts before mine (got distracted with family stuff whilst writing my post). I know people had touched on this and I wanted to add my opinion anyway, but it wasn't actually the question the op had asked, hence me saying that.

That was meant for @CallmeAngelina, sorry alsohuman.

As i switched my laptop back on i did wonder what an advanced search might bring up .......................i started to wonder whether the the same ones who moan about subsidising council funded care would also prove to be the same ones who moan about "subsidised" rents in social housing. And then lo and behold i saw @QueenoftheNowhereverse posts. Saving me the job quite frankly.

Yet another person who has bought into the residulisation of social housing topped off with a garnish of "oh of course i didnt mean you"

FFS!

YY @jasjas1973 They vote for it and then blame people who are poorer than them.

More money does not mean better care, increase staff by 30% where staff can actually do the residents daily cares, but also have time to interact with the residents so they feel like their lives mean something instead of treating them like dogs at the pound.

If Americans lived within their means and didn't feel entitled to every luxury in life, you can live off minimun wage. I did for years until I got a higher education and moved up the chain of life. You only need one car or ride the bus as I did for 6 years, you don't need cable TV or cell phones for every family member. But all this entitlement attitude from this generation is why they feel they can't survive. All you need is food and basic needs, utilities and rent money. I see so many aides (and nurses) on their cell phones and not working or caring for their residents.

Higher wages doesn't make an angry or incompetent employee happier irca better employee. Less responsibility (lower staff/resident ratios) is the answer otherwise they will continue to falsify charts that cares were done when they were not. I know, Iwitnessed this for years.