To think there will be riots?

[Anoni]

Announced on the news that boris johnson may suspend parliament to reduce the chance of mps being able to block a no deal brexit allowing him to democratically force the uk to leave the EU.

Am i wrong in thinking if this goes ahead there may be serious protests and maybe even riots in london and all across the country to force the governments hand?

Change the record Marie aren't you bored of banging this line out for over three years.

Because it signals a constitutional crisis and is the most disastrous, divisive thing to have happened to Britain, probably since the General Strikes.

I'm just wondering, do all the 'constitutional crisis' people accept that Bercow is a remainer who has allowed his politics to thwart his mandate of political neutrality?

Or, would you agree with Margaret Beckett in her estimation that Bercow's exceptional aid to the political ends of remainers is OK:

“if it comes to the constitutional future of this country, the most difficult decision we have made, not since the war but possibly, certainly in all our lifetimes, hundreds of years ... it trumps bad behaviour”

The third sentence of my post should not begin with 'or', that is confusing.

So you rekon if there is a shortage of medicine there won't be anger which may lead to civil unrest.
I rekon the conservatives are counting on the general poulation to be so fearful, divided, ground down and/ or apathetic that they can bulldoze their right wing policies through.
And yet people vote for them...says a lot about human nature.

Change the record Marie aren't you bored of banging this line out for over three years.

Why, are you bored of not being able to produce a logical answer?

David Cameron was a fucking twat calling that referendum.

It was in the Tory party manifesto on which he ran. Why would he not have called a referendum?

@judgejudyismyinspiration

I take really exception at the idea that 'democracy is alive and well in the UK'.
Politics has never been so dirty. Johnson and his bunch are elite egomaniacs who have lied and lied throughout the process. The sheer amount of corruption involved in the referendum was astounding. Cambridge Analytica? Russia? Trump? Aaron Banks? Steven Bannon?The process has opened my eyes to means of manipulation I never even knew existed.

Party politics has been centre stage instead of the well-being of the public, and once no deal happens Johnson is preparing to sell off the NHS in order to make a deal with the US. Basically selling our collective souls to the devil. The gap between rich and poor is set become a chasm.

If there's one thing I've learnt its that the UK is no longer the light of democracy it once was and from the first glimpses of the new Tory governments policies, our freedoms are set to be reduced further and further. Democracy this ain't I'm afraid... it's something very sinister that feels dystopian. For me it shows that democracy perhaps isn't possible in the age of social and online media, monied politics and populism.

Johnson is preparing to sell off the NHS in order to make a deal with the US.

Where do you get this stuff? He's told his trade minsters that the NHS is off the table.

David Cameron was a fucking twat calling that referendum.

Anti EU sentiment had been building in the UK for 20 years or more. Blair/Brown didn't even try to deal with it and in fact poured petrol onto the fire with their "rub the noses of the right" mentality re immigration. If Cameron hadn't done it, anti EU parties would have continued to gain support, popularity, MPs etc. It was never going to just go away and the issue needed to be tackled.

Where do you get this stuff? He's told his trade minsters that the NHS is off the table.

Why believe a single thing this man says?

Here is what he said about poroguing parliament not that long ago:

“I would also like to make absolutely clear that I am not attracted to arcane procedures such as the prorogation of parliament.

“As someone who aspires to be prime minister of a democratic nation, I believe in finding consensus in the House of Commons.”

And yet he calls a hugely long porogation directly before we are due to leave the EU far exceeding the time need to prepare a Queen's speech with absolutely no visible attempt to seek any consensus in the House. He is a lying scumbag who just says what is best for Boris Johnson at that moment.

Kazzyhoward
What's the worse that would have happened if we hadn't had the EU referendum?

Most people were unconcerned by the EU. I read ages ago on YouGov that before the referendum the EU was an important issue for 4% of the electorate. I'm 50, before 2016 I had never in my life had a single conversation with anybody about the EU unless you include ignoring my mums racist rants. Even then she never mentioned the EU just immigrants. I've asked lots of people that question as well (ever had a conversation about the EU) almost all say 'no'.

He didn't rule it out, did he?

The HoC has had three years to find consensus, they've failed, I'm exceedingly pleased that it's going to be over soon and expect outside of MN you'll find that a lot of people feel the same.

I just saw a panel on the BBC and weirdly, there was relatively little outrage amongst them.

@AsTheWorldTurns

Is that someone who believes what BJ says? How much evidence do you need that the man lies?

@AsTheWorldTurns
Trump and Woody Johnson have stated on several occasions that the NHS would be its top priority in any negotiations on a deal taking place. Boris Johnson himself has publicly denied this is an option to keep the peace but is a keen supporter of privatisation and has stated on a number of occasions that the NHS is too expensive to continue to function as it is. Tories generally have been outsourcing huge sections of the NHS over the past years. Also, don't forget Aaron Banks, key financier of the Leave campaign who himself makes a living in US health insurance firms. Coincidence huh?
If you think we will get a deal without the NHS being part of it you are seriously deluded.

He didn't rule it out, did he?

No he used typical weasle words to make it seem like he was not in favour of it. Plainly deceptive and dishonest behaviour.

The HoC has had three years to find consensus, they've failed, I'm exceedingly pleased that it's going to be over soon and expect outside of MN you'll find that a lot of people feel the same.

Is there a time limit on making such a complicated decision fraught with difficulties? Surely getting it right is better than getting it 'right now'?

As for outside MN, the country is massively divided, to pretend that there is some public consensus for a no deal Brexit is just a complete lie.

I just saw a panel on the BBC and weirdly, there was relatively little outrage amongst them.

Who cares what a BBC panel thinks? Vox pops, political commentators, etc are pretty unreliable bellwethers of public opinion.

I think you must be referring to Trump's comment:

"When you're dealing in trade everything is on the table. So NHS or anything else, a lot more than that, but everything will be on the table, absolutely."

He had obviously not been briefed on the politically sensitive nature of the NHS, quelle surprise, and some clever reporter found a way to stir some shit. If you've actually seen the video footage, it's obvious he had no idea what he was saying other than 'you start with everything'.

He backtracked swiftly and Johnson has directed his trade ministers to take it off the table.

Is there a time limit on making such a complicated decision fraught with difficulties? Surely getting it right is better than getting it 'right now'?

So why did the HoC pass a law that that the default arrangement was to leave on October 31 with no deal? Why?

This is all the HoC's doing, Johnson has just outmanoeuvred them.

Would anyone like to share their view on Bercow?

Has he violated the terms of his stewardship of the HoC, but it's OK because he's acting in the best interest of the country.... or do you maintain that he's politically neutral as required by law?

So why did the HoC pass a law that that the default arrangement was to leave on October 31 with no deal? Why?

Because that was the extension agreed at the time with the EU and an agreement of all member States is required. A further extension could have been sought. This is obvious, so no need for the question.

This is all the HoC's doing, Johnson has just outmanoeuvred them.

Yep and when a vote of no confidence happens, what then? Leave the EU without a deal and no functioning government? Well done Boris, what a masterstroke.

Because that was the extension agreed at the time with the EU and an agreement of all member States is required. A further extension could have been sought. This is obvious, so no need for the question.

You are correct, the answer is obvious. They took a gamble that May would kick the can into 2020, and they lost.

Would anyone like to share their view on Bercow?

Has he violated the terms of his stewardship of the HoC, but it's OK because he's acting in the best interest of the country.... or do you maintain that he's politically neutral as required by law?

When the people complaining about him all happen to be arch-brexiteers I suspect more than a little bias on their part.

His job is to enforce the rules and conventions of parliament, of course he is going to be pissed off and seek action when the government abuses convention to shut parliament down for an unprecidented amount of time directly before a major brexit deadline when no deal has been agreed vastly reducing parliamentary time to discuss this and triggering a major constitutional crisis. The only people defending this are those that want a no deal or want to keep their cabinet positions.

His job is to enforce the rules and conventions of parliament, of course he is going to be pissed off and seek action when the government abuses convention to shut parliament down for an unprecidented amount of time directly before a major brexit deadline when no deal has been agreed vastly reducing parliamentary time to discuss this and triggering a major constitutional crisis. The only people defending this are those that want a no deal or want to keep their cabinet positions.

I'm referring to his pre-Johnson shenanigans, obviously.

their "rub the noses of the right" mentality

What does this mean?

AdrenalinBrush I have around 20 family/friends living and working in other eu countries, most have been doing so for over 15 years, all at least speak the language of the country they're currently living and working in, many speak (and read and write in) more than one additional language as it's quite common to live in one country and work in another over there and 5 speak at least 3 other languages. 1 even speaks and reads/writes in an additional non European language as she needs to for her job.

Thetwinkles the majority did not necessarily vote for no deal! I know very few leavers either in real life or on here who EVER wanted no deal.

As for "just fly in the drugs or other essentials" people are clearly clueless as to how import/export works or even basic comprehension that we can't simply overnight switch all transportation of imports/exports to flown freight! Not least because we have limited airport space! And you know crucial elements like pilots!

" I think many people have a rose-tinted view of the past." Yes a point I've made on several brexit threads especially prepper ones. Mners either don't know or if they do happen to be old enough to remember WWII - 1960's have forgotten is that there WAS serious hardship, poverty, malnutrition and starvation. If people then could have been trusted to act "all in it together" and not be greedy and deprive others, if there had been enough to go around then rationing wouldn't even have been needed! There certainly wouldn't have been a black market, looting of not only shops that had been bombed out but even people's homes and BODIES!

And yes, as you say valanice the treatment of people like myself (mentally ill) and cousins boy (autism) left much to be desired! If things were now as they were then he'd be institutionalised, I'd be either institutionalised or dead from not being able to afford anti-depressants.

Not a society I'M in any hurry to return to!!

"even if we wanted to return to rickets, TB, childhood mortality, limited human rights and gender equality, ingrained homophobia, almost zero mental health care and all the other myriad joys that would bring." Much of this already happening! Rickets and other diseases of malnutrition on the rise, people's rights being eroded, rise in homophobia and racism, mental health care already suffering badly from cuts. There's also already shortages of certain medications.

Howwudufeel - you have COMPLETELY misread and missed the point of auldalliances post! They were actually CRITICISING another posters snobbery. Seriously go back and read their post AND the post they were addressing PROPERLY you're making an utter fool of yourself.