To think this level of over- protection is ridiculous.

[ScottishJo31]

My auntie ( single parent ) has two daughters... eldest is 31, youngest is 24, both still live at home. My auntie does everything for them, all their washing, ironing, cooking, shopping and even cleans their bedrooms.
The girls are NT with no health issues. One works part time one doesn’t work at all... she never has. The oldest has had boyfriends and has a social life whilst the youngest does everything with her mum and rarely leaves the house without her. My auntie works full time and has a number of friends, her friends have been encouraging her to go for weekends away and she has always refused.. however last weekend she went to a spa weekend but she ended up cutting the trip short as she was missing her daughter and was crying because she had left her overnight for the first time!!!

I am absolutely flabbergasted and don’t think the dynamics are very healthy at all. She expected my mum ( her sister) and me to sympathise and got upset when we said she has to cut the apron strings for all their benefits... she is now refusing to speak to us!!! Were we wrong to share our thoughts with her?

@perpetuallyperplexedbylife
That sounds sad and a wasted life, you have to wonder why parents do it? Do they see their child as their future carer?
Maybe MN should try and free these captured adult children?

I imagine that the your daughter has extremely low self esteem. It's not just that she's work shy, is it. She's life-shy - no friends, no social life, no independence from her mother at all. I'd guess her mum has abandonment issues and wants to make sure she'll never leave, esp if older daughter does.

But if your parents were bitching about you to other @Flude they made it other people's business.

I think people who think that "This is all your fault. You've failed as a mother and now need to deal with the consequences. When you actually want help we'll help move them out. But other wise stop your whining" is in any way an acceptable thing to say to another human are far far far more dysfunctional than anyone in the op’s (one sided and biased) reported scenario.

Keep taking that contraception, Contraception, hatchet faced empathy free zones like yourself becoming parents is exactly the sort of thing that creates dysfunctional family set ups like the one described in the op :) you’re welcome :)

@MadameButterface after 3 kids trust me I'm going to keep taking it.

Also why should people who create their own misery, bitch about it constantly and do jack shit about it receive sympathy?

I could easily have ended up like that. My mother was dreadfully upset when my sister didn't return home after university as she had - she had expected her to move back home until she got married. By the time I went away my mum said she no longer expected it, but did very much hope for it. It didn't happen.

Like @Madein1995 my mother did far too much for me for too long. I, too, was at least 10 when she would still choose what clothes I wore each day. She would always cook and clean, I was barely allowed to do anything. I had pets, but wasn't allowed to do anything for them except feed them occassionally. So much so that when I said I was getting my first rabbit as an adult she seriously questioned my ability to look after it, despite my having had pets all my life.

She hated me spending time in my room - she wanted me in the lounge with her, watching whatever was on tv. I was allowed to choose sometimes, but then she'd moan. She found a house for us to move to when I was about 24 - she tried to sell it to me that I'd have my own lounge as well as a bedroom - I queried if I'd ever be able to use that lounge. She admitted no.

Again, in my 20s, when staying with her one summer, I wasn't allowed to accept the job I'd been offered as it involved work on Sundays, and 'You have to go to church on Sundays' - this despite me having tried to tell her I was an atheist for many years.

It only takes a weak will on the part of the child, guilt to look after the parent and, maybe, a touch of laziness and it's easy to fall into this trap. But you're right, OP, it really isn't healthy.

Look up enmeshment. I suspect that may be coming in to play.

Yeah the younger daughter not working is a strange one.
I personally think it is so good and important to move away and have your own life. Many mother - who were not loved enough themselves - over depend on their children for love. It is never healthy.

My mother was like that - she wouldn't let me be with any other adult other than her when I was a child. She wouldnt let me see my dad or grandparents at all. She wanted me with her every hour of the day. She cried hysterically every time I went away to college. She would call me in college and say " you didnt cry when you left me and went on the bus", and I was - thinking " eh yes because I am excited to go and my life doesn't revolve around you". She cried hysterically when I went away to travel.
She would ring and check where I was , "out of worry" constantly into my late twenties. Really it is abusive and dependant behaviour. Some mothers do not see their children as human beings at all, instead they see them as something that they own.

I moved to another country and I have never been so happy in my life. The sheer joy and freedom of being able to have my own life, after many years with a domineering controlling mother. It is bliss

The other episode with my mother was when we were talking about a much-older friend of mine, who'd moved 200 miles away from his home town. My mother complained that it was unfair that he'd moved so far from his children, and that he should move back again.

His children were, at that time, all in their twenties, and one had moved 500 miles north. Another had a child of her own and was happily married. I pointed out that they didn't 'need' their father on their doorstep at their age, at which point she got tearful and asked whether I was trying to say I no longer needed her. I was in my 30s - I wanted to yes 'of course I don't need you' but obviously couldn't.

Part of it is very much a need to be important.

I bet that mother is making that daughter feel weak, useless and dependant. My own mother used to tell me that I was useless at everything and so i believed I was.
Mothers can really be incredibly abusive can't they?

I feel like my life only started at 35 when I was able to move to another country and was finally free of her.

I also remember another woman telling me that it took her until she was thirty until she was able to stand up to her mother.

And I am thinking of friends at home. Let me tell you a story about theworst mother ever. My friend was told she would never be good enough to be a primary teacher by her mother, she went to study to be a teacher to prove her mother wrong. Her mother did not want her to move out of the house. She went to get her own appartment and her mother fought her about it for ages. She works now as a primary teacher and is really busy and her mother insists that she drive forty minutes after school to see her EVERY day. She said if she tries to stand up to her , her mother will make her life a living hell. This same mother has said she never wants my friend to get married so she can give all her attention to her mother for all her life. My friend has a sister, the sister has a boyfriend for 15 years, my friend's mother refuses to speak to this boyfriend, and has never spoken to him, because she is so angry that her daughter went and got a boyfriend. True story.

@TimeIhadaNameChange Alot of mother's abuse their position. It is about power and control.

No you were not wrong - it sounds as if it was long overdue.
I have 3 DDs aged 30, 27 & 24 - none of them lives with us, in fact 2 of them live overseas. I can't imagine allowing this situation to develop

@angell84
Your friend should stop going every day and put her phone on silent and let her mother have her tantrum. She’s an adult she should tell her mother what day she’ll be over. The mother sounds mentally unwell.

@bookworm4 yeah she really is the worst mother I have evert heard about.
It is hard. I tell my friend to stand up to her, but she has suffered so much pyschological abuse from her mother that she is really worn down from her to think that she is worth very little. You know - it is like an abusive relationship. She cant escape because she has no self esteem.
My friend was adopted by this woman , and if she tries to stand up to her, her mother will say " I adopter you when you were three years old, I saved you, all that I did for you, and you can't do this one thing for your poor old mother?" Psychological abuse definitely exists. She adopted another boy, and he doesn't talk to her at all anymore, now he is grown up

I know that adult children should stand up to their mothers, but when you have a life time of abuse - it is not easy!
My friend was adopted by this woman. So, her biological family not wanting her has made her start life with low self esteem.
Her adoptive mother constantly tells her that she should be grateful that she took her in, and that she "owes" her. All i can say is, I am very thankful that I am not in that family

That sounds truly awful, I had a very abusive mother, I’m now 14 years no contact, she’s never met my DD14 and never will. I have no regrets I had to walk away for the sake of my own well-being and my children’s. I hope your friend can find the strength to cut the ties.

@bookworm4. I send you love. I also had an abusive mother ( not as bad as my friend's). I moved far away and I am very happy now. I am glad you are happy too. Well done on being strong. Like any abusive relationship, it takes strength to stand up for yourself. Well done! Go you

The youngest doesn’t work partly as another poster has said because she is “life-shy” she doesn’t get up until 2oclock in the afternoon and plays computer games until 4am.... that’s her routine! She does claim job seekers but turns up to interviews having no intention of getting a job! My other cousin is very aloof.. we aren’t close, I have tried to talk to her in the past but she ignores my messages etc. My auntie tries her best to keep the house tidy but due to my cousins hoarding it is impossible...one think I haven’t mentioned up until now is that my cousins has peed in bowls etc rather than use the toilet next door! It really is toxic!

@angell84
I’m glad you found your peace, stay strong and free ⭐️

It's very very odd. Peeing in bowls because you are too lazy to go to the loo? It's not healthy what a waste of their lives. But if they are happy living like that in their own filth then it's not your fault and you can't help them.

Am baffled by the comments which are saying "If they're happy, mind your own business." If these daughters have always lived with this, it is not a genuine choice but a situation created and kept going by the mother. It's very much a mental health issue, hers but also by extension, her daughters'. Do more-or-less emotionally healthy people pee into a bowl rather than using the toilet? No. Also, the OP mentions hoarding.

Moving back home for a couple of years during a very difficult time is not the same thing at all.

She's really upset and your response was "cut the apron strings"... 🙄 of course she's upset with you now!?

Whether you agree or not that's how she's living her life.. it's not your life? If you didn't want to sympathise with her you could have been a little more gentle to her feelings.
She was upset.
Jesus.

But what can the OP do about the situation? Would the police see a crime? They aren't handicapped or have disabilities so social services wouldn't care. It's really odd but I don't see what could be done to change the situation. I'm baffled.

After your update I'd say it is now beyond toxic and into mental health help required.
Absolutely nothing you've described is normal or healthy.
Unfortunately helping people like this is notoriously difficult. Sorry!

It sounds as if the mum has created this situation to make her feel wanted. Some women do this when they are divorced; they make their DDs their 'best friends' and tie them to them, because they are too scared to get out and get a new life.

And since the husband was an alcoholic, the mother may well be used to co-dependent relationships of the kind addicts tend to have. OP can anyone gently encourage your aunt to have some form of therapy or counselling? It could really help her and any comments on the situation would be better coming from an outsider.

i would write to them all individually,
take them all aside individually.

but be tactful and gentle and dont expect to be rewarded for your concern