Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Why are some parents/families anti vax?

321 replies

Sistersis · 20/08/2019 09:19

Just read an article about the UK no longer being measles free. Just trying to understand what are the reasons that some people are against vaccination.

Not being cheeky here, geniuenly interested. Sorry if this has been done already.

OP posts:
HarryElephante · 21/08/2019 15:16

Actually, it turns into a fact/evidence flinging exercise. Trouble is, it only seems to go one way

Well, the abuse certainly only goes one way, going by this thread.

Chivers53 · 21/08/2019 15:20

My nieces and nephews have had normal childhood illnesses like mumps, whooping cough and measles and have got through them just fine with a stronger immunity and gut at the end.

But in this country it isn't normal for children to catch them. I'm guessing they actually didn't, and if they did that would be a very strong case for vaccines!

Babayaggatheboneylegged · 21/08/2019 15:21

The family I know who are anti-vax have definitely been influenced by the Wakefield scare, and have had their fears reinforced by the Vaxxed documentary, which was directed by Wakefield.

They have a nearly four-year-old who appears to have ASD, but they seem to be in denial about it, despite the fact he’s largely non-verbal. I think that particular child is the only one of their three kids to have had some vaccines though, which has only reinforced their beliefs/fears.

It’s weird because the mum especially is otherwise so loving and protective of her kids, so I don’t feel that not vaccinating is a neglect issue, but it’s really hard to counter people’s beliefs or ‘feelings’ with facts.

Facts just don’t cut it for some people.

Lweji · 21/08/2019 15:23

Actually, it turns into a fact/evidence flinging exercise. Trouble is, it only seems to go one way.

Isn't it?
And then we're all frothing at the mouth when we ask for actual data or information. Funny that.

It's also funny that the clearly antivaxx troll was the one to claim they aren't an "antivaxx nut", thereby calling antivaxxers nuts.

HarryElephante · 21/08/2019 15:25

Facts just don’t cut it for some people

So, definitely just insult these people.

That'll make you feel better.

Benes · 21/08/2019 15:25

There is choosing to parent differently and then there is willfully ignoring robust scientific evidence and purposefully putting your own children and vulnerable members of society at risk.

I couldn't care less what your parenting choices are if they only had an impact on you. But they don't. That is why people get angry.

Venger · 21/08/2019 15:26

Considering the overwhelming evidence in favour of vaccines and the fact that being anti-vaxx is essentially the same as being pro-disease, and how could the "debate" go any other way?

There is no debate.

Vaccines save lives. That is a fact.

The WHO lists anti-vaxx rhetoric as one of the top ten threats to global health. That is also a fact.

Engage or not, your choice, but you are wrong to think that being anti-vaxx is at all right.

HarryElephante · 21/08/2019 15:27

It's also funny that the clearly antivaxx troll was the one to claim they aren't an "antivaxx nut", thereby calling antivaxxers nuts

This is just schoolground stuff. Cringe.

I'm out of this thread.

Lweji · 21/08/2019 15:28

I couldn't care less what your parenting choices are if they only had an impact on you. But they don't. That is why people get angry.

I'm also going to bet their children will get angry.

They already are getting angry: www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47449517

It will be fun when they start asking why they had to go through illnesses that their parents could have prevented them from having.

HarryElephante · 21/08/2019 15:28

I couldn't care less what your parenting choices are if they only had an impact on you. But they don't. That is why people get angry

Just one more post to say I totally understand this view.

RebornFlame · 21/08/2019 15:31

Lweji, really, an anti vax troll?
I NEVER post about my anti vax status because of this reception. You and I often agree on many other things in various mn forums and like you I’ve been around for years on mn (6) and I’ve always found you warm, wry and amusing.

Benes · 21/08/2019 15:31

I wouldn't mind if there was a genuine debate to be had. But there isn't. That's what I find so difficult to get my head around.

The fact is vaccines save lives.

thecatinthetwat · 21/08/2019 15:32

It will be fun when they start asking why they had to go through illnesses that their parents could have prevented them from having.

Hmm
Lweji · 21/08/2019 15:32

Apologies if you're not, but quite frankly, after that Wakefield comment... I don't often check people's posting histories.

RebornFlame · 21/08/2019 15:33

And to whoever doubted my claim that various nieces and nephews had had these illnesses, it wasn’t as if one got them all. A couple of nephews (who are now strapping Keyes teens has measles and mumps, and my much younger nieces had whooping cough last month.

Lweji · 21/08/2019 15:34

@RebornFlame
Have you answered my question about why did you believe your relatives gut issues were caused by vaccines?
Sorry if I missed it.

RebornFlame · 21/08/2019 15:36

One of the lads in his late teens is already asking why he wasn’t vaccinated and why he had measles and his parents have given them their reasons. He’s off to study chemistry soon so I’m sure they’ll have some differing of opinions to come.

thecatinthetwat · 21/08/2019 15:39

Apologies if you're not, but quite frankly, after that Wakefield comment... I don't often check people's posting histories.

What ? Sorry, I’m not following.

thecatinthetwat · 21/08/2019 15:42

Do unvaccinated children definitely get theses diseases then? I should think a fair number don’t.

Does anyone know the actual risk of catching measles?

Lweji · 21/08/2019 15:45

Do unvaccinated children definitely get theses diseases then? I should think a fair number don’t.

Because at present most of the population is vaccinated.

Benes · 21/08/2019 15:47

Lots won't get them because of herd immunity...so they are benefiting from others being vaccinated. A certain percentage of society needs to be vaccinated for herd immunity to be effective. The more they don't vaccinate the less effective that is which puts unvaccinated people at risk - including those that can't be vaccinated due to medical reasons.

To not vaccinate when there are no known medical reasons is the height of selfishness.

thecatinthetwat · 21/08/2019 15:48

Because at present most of the population is vaccinated.

Yes, obviously.

But what is the current risk of catching it? It must be quite low I would think?

KatharinaRosalie · 21/08/2019 15:50

Does anyone know the actual risk of catching measles?

Yes, it's estimated that 90% of unvaccinated people in contact with the virus will get sick. We don't have epidemics only because most people are (for now) still getting vaccinated.

RebornFlame · 21/08/2019 15:50

Too much to post here but the MMR (namely the measles vaccine) has found to reside in the gut of infants for longer in those that are already suseptable to crohns and UC. This has been shown in a number of trials to cause a rise in the autoimmune infammatory markers that someone with a gut based auto immune disease would show. Due to both diseases typically not presenting till early teens it’s been hard to pinpoint how something so early on would have an adverse impact and there are studies that have found sound conclusive evidence (such as the lancet) and some that found no link (BMJ). I made a decisions based on looking in a number of studies in my hospital library as well as talking with anti vax forums and family members. I’m not completely anti vaccine but I’m trying to work out what is best when health wise the odds are already stacked against my children when it comes to gut related illnesss.

MockersthefeMANist · 21/08/2019 15:50

Measles is on the increase, particularly in some rather posh places. Make of that what you will.