To be hopping mad at husband?

[Skiphopnicknok]

Been married almost 2 months but together 5 years with 1 year old DC. We’ve always split everything 50/50 but retained our own properties we had pre being together (we also own a house jointly). We’re looking to buy a bigger property and have another DC. When we bought our current home, I put in more than my (then DP) DH as I had more available cash.

He recently sold his property and paid me back (even though I now consider it “our” money). He’s been dabbling in stock market for last 5 years (he works in finance anyway) and is up for the most part but had a bit of a disaster earlier this year having taken a big position on one stock. He made it back but yesterday had another big loss.

He told me originally he’d lost 12k of “his” money. He’s also invested some of my money I had given him (to invest for me) in it and our DC’s. DC and I have lost our paper gains we had but capital is safe (well, I’m 700 down on capital) but last night it transpires he’d actually lost 18k of “his” money and so when added to mine and DC’s losses, we’ve lost about 22k as a family.

We are looking to buy a bigger house and I am SO mad at him. He is mortified and has immediately sold all his shares (other than those in funds which are managed by other people as to be fair, we do need to try to grow a bit of it). He’s not slept all night (neither have I).

He recognises that he’s done wrong and is going to seek help. I told him in no uncertain terms if it happens again I will divorce him. He is genuinely remorseful.

He’s a great husband and dad but I’m a little worried and of course hopping mad.

We are sitting down this weekend and pulling together all finances. I’ve also said we will now have “spending” money each month and rest goes into a joint savings account so that way he’s not even tempted to do anything on markets (other than with his spending money).

Now also feel I need to take control ofDC’s investment account.

I don’t want to lose him but I am very very cross.

More advice rather than AIBU I guess.

You only lose if you sell the shares. Bluntly he's a fuckwit if he's sold out at bottom prices, you hold on until they recover or there is a take over bid. If he cant understand that basic principle he shouldnt be allowed out alone, much less given a bank card. What were the dividends like, were they stil coming? Shares shoudl be an investment not a quick kill.

He’s been dabbling in stock market for last 5 years (he works in finance anyway)

One sincerely hopes hes just a cashier in Barclays and not actually dealing with client money in any significant way. I assume he isnt FSA regulated?

I work in ‘finance’. I have literally ZERO idea about the stock market except what I’ve seen in Trading Places (prob not accurate).

It sounds like he’s irresponsible and you were ill advised to invest without understanding exactly in what.

I can understand your reaction to his poor financial judgement but the issues here are unlikely to be solved by you taking control of the money. The resentment will probably grow and seethe between the two of you - he will become another DC and you will resent being put in that place.

You need to know that your life partner can make sensible financial decisions for himself you and your child and give him space to make things right - if he doesn't and continues to make bad decisions, be secretive and not step up then you have enough information. I've not been in the position but you can see that people with secretive partners doing weird things with money tend to have some of the most heart breaking marriages for all involved.

He sounds incredibly naive - why did he sell the shares? The whole point about shares is that the go up and down so if you buy high then sell as soon as the crash, you're kinda missing the point. Which bit are you most angry about? Do you think he has a gambling problem? Investing in shares can be risky (depending on your investment portfolio) but if you're going to do it, you have to accept that might lose. Or is it that he didn't tell you how much he'd invested?

? How has he done wrong? You both agreed to put money into stocks on the gamble you’d make some quick cash. Why is it his fault when it was a joint decision?
YABU to blame him.

As above, stocks & shares are a long term investment and its normally for them to go up and down over time. If you sell when they are down then that you lose money. They may well have recovered in the longer term.

Since you asked him to invest for you I'm not sure you have the right to be 'hopping mad'

Too, portfolios go up and down. One of my pension pots lost over 30k just in last quarter of 2018 because the market had a downtown. It was irritating, but to be expected. It’s been made back and then some since then. I don’t understand why you are angry with him when it was a joint decision to make investments and then to sell out after a downturn. What does he have to be remorseful for? For the market not going up? Seems unreasonable to have this belief that investments only go up unless you do something “wrong”

“We are sitting down this weekend and pulling together all finances. I’ve also said we will now have “spending” money each month and rest goes into a joint savings account so that way he’s not even tempted to do anything on markets (other than with his spending money).“

Tbh this sounds controlling to me. Like he has to give you his pay cheque and then you “let” him have some pocket money.

You agreed to him dabbling on the stock market so you should have realised he was as likely to make a loss as he was a profit. So I think you also bear some of the responsibility.

What you should have done is agreed in advance the level of risk you were comfortable with.

My DH dabbles sometimes, but we agreed how much he could invest, then he has built this up through small profits. If he were to lose it all it would be upsetting, but I wouldn't blame him for it

I'd never give my DH control over my or DC's money - sounds like you are doing the right thing now in trying to get that sorted.

And the way you are suggesting - all money goes into the joint pot and then have a bit each for spending money - is the way a lot of people do it and works well. Would also ensure you have oversight of joint savings.

Of course if you agreed to the investments, you must take responsibility for the loss too - only if he was doing it all behind your back or lying to you about what he was investing your money in would it only be his fault. You both knew stocks were risky.

Nothing to be done about it now, but it's good that you're going to make the changes that need to happen.

The word dabbling rang alarm bells for me - it takes experience & judgement to invest wisely and even then you are a hostage to fortune. As others have pointed out, a long-term view is needed. Our investments are currently down as Brexit is creating market uncertainty but we won't be selling

You both had no right to risk your DC money.

My dh 'dabbles' as well but 22k is beyond dabbling, unless you mean he started with 5k built up and then lost it.

And why would he be tempted to invest? It sounds like you are talking about an addiction.

He is mortified and has immediately sold all his shares

That was the massive mistake. How did that happen!?

You hadn't lost £22k until he sold them. You were down £22k, which happens in the stock market. He's 'gambling' with a lot of money if he doesn't really know what he's doing, but it's an amateur mistake to cash out shares at rock bottom prices, they won't stay there.

I mean you own a few properties between you I'm sure you will scrape by.

I don’t know much about stocks and shares but my parents have a quite a bit invested. My father lost £17k after the brexit decision. He’s managed to recover about £7k but unlikely to get the remaining £10k back until we finally leave and the markets settle. Stocks and shares are about playing the long game.... when you make a ‘loss’ you wait it out. Selling up now means you can not recover that loss ever again. If you wait it out, you may find you recover or even make gains.

You both decided to take a punt and as sometimes happens, he made a loss. If he'd come out on top with the extra investment would you still be complaining?

I think you should cut him some slack. It was a joint decision to play the stock market, the numbers hardly matter. Rethink your strategy together but stop blaming him.

He is gambling with money he cannot afford to lose and money that is not his. He sounds addictive and, if you want to stay with him, he needs to seek treatment and never do it again.

There are some weird posts on this thread about the market, however. Most professional traders cut losses and run profits. The idea that shares should be held until they ‘recover’ is nonsense. You will end up selling all the successful companies and holding a portfolio of losers. Of course, each situation is specific but selling the shares when you found out was absolutely the right thing to do.

I think the big mistake was giving him money to invest, with no idea what he was investing in.

My husband once 'invested' (sunk) almost 8k of our money into shares in an overseas company that promptly went into liquidation. We lost it all. He didn't tell me what he was doing, I only found out when it was too late.

My husband made an utterly stupid mistake and clearly didn't know what he was doing, didn't have the experience or knowledge but thought he was the big man playing with stocks and shares. Our marriage barely survived it.

YANBU, I would be furious too.

The money is gone, however, and you need to rebuild. The thing that concerns me the most is that this has clearly been going on for a very long time without you being aware. That rings alarm bells. I would expect a partner who had lost money to fess up much earlier, and to discuss possible actions to take in the circumstances with me.

I would insist on full oversight of the money. Pool accounts (get a joint bank account) and keep an eye on all investments. See it as something you do together from now on.

You both understood the risks. I don't understand why you're taking it all out on him. You'd have been very happy to take any profits.

It may have been a mistake to sell out (depending on dividends, longer term prospects of that stock etc) but it sounds as though he had a 'gambling' mindset so if it's done, I guess you have to take this as an expensive lesson. Get some index trackers maybe. Even with managed funds, don't put too much in any one (I've got a bit sitting in Woodford now. but it was just a part of the profit from previous fund - we knew that past performance is not a reliable indicator of future performance) . Check the charges on everything carefully.

Like others have said he sounds like he doesn't actually have a clue what he is doing and ivo of that I should stick to putting your money in savings/ISAs/PSBs. "Working in finance" does not automatically make you an expert in dealing in stocks and shares - as he has proved.

Stock market is a risk. You both agreed to gamble. At least you still have an income and a home.

There's a saying - the quickest way to get a small fortune is to start off with a large one
As a couple you had a marital home and 2 rental properties, now you have a marital home & 1 rental property & have seemingly lost a substantial amount of the increased equity from the former 2nd rental property.
If your DH has what amounts to a gambling addiction, in that investing in shares could be replaced with having a gut feeling about number 5 in the 6th race having "studied the form" religiously, then he certainly should look to get counselling etc. When investment is really gambling then it's always good to remember that "the house always wins" overall.
If you're looking to buy a larger house then consider financing that through the sale of the marital home +1 that you still own.
For your DC's investment I'd recommend putting it in Premium Bonds. He/she can have £20k invested with the capital guaranteed & at that level of investment an extremely good prospect of numerous wins, from £50 up to £1m every month, until age 18 when they can start making their own decisions.

All these people saying he was mad to sell , I don't agree. It sounds like he's investing in AIM or smaller businesses - not ftse 100.
It common human response (/failing) to hang on to fallen AIM shares (or perhaps worse still double down on them) in the vague hope that they will get better some day.
The hardest thing to do is to sell you bad picks quickly and hang on to the good ones. Unfortunately most of us are programmed the other way around.