To be hopping mad at husband?

[Skiphopnicknok]

Been married almost 2 months but together 5 years with 1 year old DC. We’ve always split everything 50/50 but retained our own properties we had pre being together (we also own a house jointly). We’re looking to buy a bigger property and have another DC. When we bought our current home, I put in more than my (then DP) DH as I had more available cash.

He recently sold his property and paid me back (even though I now consider it “our” money). He’s been dabbling in stock market for last 5 years (he works in finance anyway) and is up for the most part but had a bit of a disaster earlier this year having taken a big position on one stock. He made it back but yesterday had another big loss.

He told me originally he’d lost 12k of “his” money. He’s also invested some of my money I had given him (to invest for me) in it and our DC’s. DC and I have lost our paper gains we had but capital is safe (well, I’m 700 down on capital) but last night it transpires he’d actually lost 18k of “his” money and so when added to mine and DC’s losses, we’ve lost about 22k as a family.

We are looking to buy a bigger house and I am SO mad at him. He is mortified and has immediately sold all his shares (other than those in funds which are managed by other people as to be fair, we do need to try to grow a bit of it). He’s not slept all night (neither have I).

He recognises that he’s done wrong and is going to seek help. I told him in no uncertain terms if it happens again I will divorce him. He is genuinely remorseful.

He’s a great husband and dad but I’m a little worried and of course hopping mad.

We are sitting down this weekend and pulling together all finances. I’ve also said we will now have “spending” money each month and rest goes into a joint savings account so that way he’s not even tempted to do anything on markets (other than with his spending money).

Now also feel I need to take control ofDC’s investment account.

I don’t want to lose him but I am very very cross.

More advice rather than AIBU I guess.

Dabbling in the stock market is not for the faint hearted, yes you can make great gains but you can also lose everything.

Only invest what you can afford to lose, we’ve brought and sold shares over the years and done quite well out of them, but we no longer buy any as we have less surplus money available to invest.

He has been dabbling in stocks for five years and it was all grand and dandy when he was mostly on the up but then it goes down, he loses, and you are saying that if it happens again you will divorce him. What is this? If you make me money you can work away but if you lose it you are out the door. Makes no sense to me.

I have a (FSA regulated) man who manages two investment products for me. Together the products have made over 12% in a year. He knows what he’s doing.

Clearly your DH doesn’t have a clue. Your options are to keep your finances separate or pool them and treat him like a child doling out his pocket money. I know what I’d do.

Was he actually trading in individual stocks and shares, or something more speculative like derivatives?

It's a basic premise of investing that you should 1. never invest more than you can afford to lose 2. Spread your risk and 3. Take a long-term view.

If you don't know what you are doing it is much better to invest in a few funds which do the hard work for you.

At the moment, stock markets are very volatile because of the risks of a No Deal Brexit. Definitely not a good idea to have a short term punt.

So let me guess your DH has a IG spreadbetting or CFD account and thinks he knows how to predict the stockmarket - more fool him!

These accounts allow you to take much larger position than you actually put up initial capital (it's called gearing) and because he's putting such a high concentration in one stock, there is no diversification meaning if that stock tanks then so does his/your money.

This is gambling plan and simple. If you are an experienced investor with capacity for loss then that's fine however it sounds like your DH thought he could make a quick buck and is now at a loss putting your financial future at risk.

I am a bit confused as to why you are angry. Have I got it right, that you knew he was investing the money on behalf of you, the DC and himself? So what has he actually done wrong, apart from invest in stock that has gone down in value (which could happen to anyone)? Surely you knew that shares can go up or down when you gave him your money to invest? It is not as if he invested the money behind your back, and then lost it.

I don't understand why DH is getting the blame here You went into this with your eyes open, knowing that he had made losses in the past. It was daft to trust an amateur with so much money, but that was a joint decision. And, in fairness to your DH, even the most savvy investment managers can make a bad call.

Where you have both been total idiots is in panicking and selling the shares in a rush. But - again - it sounds like that was a mutual decision.

Oh dear.
It does sound as if he doesn't know what he is doing.
I would be angry too OP.

Did you give him your money to invest willingly? If so I thi k you have no right to be mad. The stock market is just gambling by another name and if it had paid off you would've been his biggest fan. Unless you are prepared to risk that amount of money put it somewhere safe. If he invested the money without your approval then you have every right to be mad

It common human response (/failing) to hang on to fallen AIM shares (or perhaps worse still double down on them) in the vague hope that they will get better some day.The hardest thing to do is to sell you bad picks quickly and hang on to the good ones

Agree but it doesn't follow that it's a good idea to sell everything you own on a single day, as the DH has done.

I can imagine how you feel, Skiphop, but I believe you and he will get through it after which your husband may feel a change of occupation to be a course of action. People in your husband's line of work are known to burn out quite young but often find stability and fulfilment in another career.

You two are in it for the long haul and you'll be alright in the end.

Erm....this is how stocks work.

I can't believe he sold them.

@Butterflyone1

So let me guess your DH has a IG spreadbetting or CFD account and thinks he knows how to predict the stockmarket - more fool him!

I think you might well be right.

And if it's CFDs it's pretty rubbish because you're effectively in the same position as you would be with spread-bets but with CFDs you then have tax liabilities if you're lucky enough to make anything.

He recognises that he’s done wrong and is going to seek help.

What do you mean he's going to "seek help"? Do you just mean financial advice? Your phrasing makes it sound like you feel he has some sort of problem requiring treatment but he's not a gambler, he just made a shit investment

dh bought something and admitted it had made quite a big loss almost immediately 🙄. 7 years later he’s doubled his money, sadly not the kind of money you are talking about though! his investment was minor in comparison and frankly it would have made diddly squat in a high interest savings account in that time.

it’s a gambling game, you win some and you lose some, how much did you start with? you say you’ve lost 22k but is that a 10k investment that doubled and some and then you lost it? of is that 22k savings straight in and lost immediately?

Unless you really REALLY know what you are doing, investing in individual shares can be pretty risky especially if you are looking at higher risk investments. You should really only be looking at investing in unit trusts, ideally via an ISA (to maximise tax savings) unless you have money to lose, and even then go via an IFA who knows their way about EIS, AIM and VCS investments.

Not sure why a pp said the idea of all money going into a joint account and each having their own spending money was being controlling - this is what seems to be the "go to" advice on MN. The OP wasn't talking about her doling out "pocket money" to him, she was talking about both having their own spending money (presumably the same amount).

You both agreed to put money into stocks on the gamble you’d make some quick cash. Why is it his fault when it was a joint decision?

as PP have said.
Investing in the stock market is great, but it is a long term thing. It is absolutely not your husbands fault that the share price went down, a lot of investments and pensions have due to the weak pound and brexit. His mistake was panic selling the shares at the bottom of the market, he should have held on to ride it out.

The recommendation of premium bonds is silly, your capital is safe but you are gambling for a return(statistics of average return rates are grossly manipulated on how averages work due to the million pound jackpots- most people get no wins at all), plus due to how money works (inflation) without guarenteed interest your capital is actually worth less as it has less buying power.
Shares are only good for long term plans (5+ years) due to the ups and downs of the market for svaing for property you should look at investing in gilts or bonds- lower average returns than shares but a lot more stable.

The recommendation of premium bonds is silly - nonsense. Premium Bonds for a 1 year old child is in no way "silly". Far better than whatever money being put aside for them being gambled on the stock market.

Is basically long term gambling. I actually don't think you can be that mad at him as you were happy to take the risk and just because it played out against you, isn't his fault.
He was stupid to sell them though..

Sorry been in a meeting. I think it’s the amount he put in on one stock without telling me then selling without consulting me then lying about the loss.

I told him to hold his nerve and not to sell for the reasons people have said but he panicked

• amount he put in one stock without telling you- you both agreed he would invest money in stocks. Unless you specifically asked to approve each stock and how much £ in each stock, I’d say it’s understood that an agreement he would do the investing means it’s his choice and he does not need your pre-approval. You may think you would have spotted this stock to be a loser, but that is hindsight talking.
• selling without consulting you- are you sure you are not changing your story here? You said that he’d lost the money and you were hopping mad, so he, immediately sold the stocks (other than ones managed by other people because to be fair WE need to grow some of it)...the way you wrote that indicates that was actually a joint decision based on his losses and your duping decision to leave investing to the professionals

-lying about how much was lost- here I don’t think he was lying. Stocks fluctuate and you may have lost 12k when he mentioned it to you, but by the time they were sold the loss would definitely be a different number from 12k...so a further loss of 6k is not impossible in the intervening time.n

*duping should be joint...not sure how my pad autod that in.

I told him to hold his nerve and not to sell for the reasons people have said but he panicked

You also told him you'd divorce him if he lost anymore money. I'm not surprised he panicked!

Sorry I didn’t make it clear:

1. He took a big position on another stock earlier in year and same thing happened. I think I had assumed he wouldn’t do it again - small positions on lots of different stocks. I get that the market generally could then go down - not the issue - the big positions are. But maybe I’m partially to blame for not taking enough notIce

1. No I mean he sold the shares in the stock which tanker without us having a discussion after I’d said to hold nerve. But again, perhaps im partially to blame and should’ve gone to meet him to discuss properly

1. He admitted he lied because he didn’t want to upset/worry me

Having thought about it (and having had a bit of breathing space to think as been away this morning for work in meetings) I do feel I’m partially to blame - I haven’t paid enough attention as knew he’d been “doing well” over all so I’ve called him and said it’s not fair of me to now be mad because it’s gone tits up, but that we will look at everything this weekend and come up with a joint plan together (not me taking control or spending money etc - an actual plan for how we will run investments in the future) so thanks for the comments, I’m feeling much clearer and I think he’s actually probably relieved he can take the pressure off and that we do this together